My distortion sucks and i don't know why...

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socialistfish

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Hello all!

my problem is listed in the title of this thread. Basically, i have never really recorded distorted guitar before, as i am mainly an acoustic guy. I can get professional quality acoustic recordings, but my attempts at recording an electric are pathetic... here is what am doing, please mention what i am doing wrong (which is probably quite a bit):

I have a PRS SE i run into a digitech gnx1, which runs into a M-Aduo Fast Track Pro, which runs into my Macbook Pro.

OR

I have a PRS SE i run into a Marshal 100 Watt Valvestate I run into my GNX 1 via an emulated out (as a ghetto pre amp of sorts... gives me a right and left channel) which i run into a M-Audio Fast Track Pro, which goes into my Mac

now, i would like to avoid mic-ing my amp if at all possible. so is there any way around the mic?

i'm going for a modern rock distortion, using my bridge pickups.

any help is appreciated... i know this question is kind of general, but i think with all the technology out there, there has to be a way to get around a mic...
 
Getting a solid tone by throwing a 57 in front of a 4x12 Marshall filled with Celestion G12M70's is a fairly simple thing.

Getting a solid tone direct - even using hardware specifically designed to circumvent the cabinet/mic thing (think Pod Pro, etc.) is an entirely different beast.
 
right off the bat I'm gonna suggest that you're likely using way too much distortion.
Strange as it may seem ...... you have to use a much cleaner sound than you would think to get a good distorted guitar sound tracked.
 
socialistfish said:
...I have a PRS SE i run into a digitech gnx1, which runs into a M-Aduo Fast Track Pro, which runs into my Macbook Pro.

OR

I have a PRS SE i run into a Marshal 100 Watt Valvestate I run into my GNX 1 via an emulated out (as a ghetto pre amp of sorts... gives me a right and left channel) which i run into a M-Audio Fast Track Pro, which goes into my Mac.
Click to expand...

I think Bob is on the right track (hehe, excuse the pun) with using less distortion.

I've heard the Valvestates have a good clean sound. If you can record two tracks at the same time and use the valvestate on one track with a clean sound or just slightly dirty/sparkly sound, and the GNX with heavier distortion on the second track, you might find a good mix between the two.
 
You have to ask yourself - does the distortion suck before or after you hit the red button and what does it sound like in the mix? Switching from acoustic to modern rock distortion is like two totally different animals. Your electric isn't going to solo nicely like an acoustic and still fit into a rock mix necessarily. There's a good chance it may sound like ass on its own and sound great in a mix. Performance technique is majorly different too. I have friends that are fabulous at classical but suck at rock. Go figure?

A normal rock setting is a large open area and that sound typically can only be captured with micing an amp. The air ambience is next to impossible to create using a direct in and like the Lt. hit on, use less disortion when recording.
 
I know you said you dont want to mic your amp.................but here is my advice...................

MIC YOUR AMP!!!!!!!!!!

This is my main deal actually, I have a hard rock style, and the best way that I have personally found to record distorted guitars is place a mic 2 to 3 inches from the center of the cone. Turn down the distortion. Record your riff, then pan it hard right, Record the SAME riff, then pan it hard left. You will be amazed at how this sounds.


CHEERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
so i suppose there really is no way around the mic issue.


i also think too much distortion is my problem... it sounds great live (i love the valvestate tone) but when it is through the computer it is just... not like it is live. so i'll roll down the gain and try that, hopefully it is as simple as that.

am i to assume that distortion never sounds the same recorded as it does live? i'm just so used to my acoustics that sound near perfect when recorded...

oh well... just when you think you get then hang of this stuff, something new comes at ya.

thanks for all the help mates, i shall let you know how it works!
 
From the old trial and error method I'v found... use less distortion than you think you need, boost the midrange a little, double track or more the guitar part, don't be shy about using the bridge pickup. I know micing a cranked up amp is not allways possible but imo it is the best way to record electric guitar.
 
I have a couple of valvestates. One has a line out, one has an 'emulated' line out. The line outs both sound like ass emulated or not, and I'm trying to figure out what the heck the emulator is emulating because it ain't the sound that comes out the speaker.

Bottom line is that you won't get around the fact that line outs for those amps, and most amps for that matter, sound like total junk. I personally don't think rolling off the gain is going to help you with that. You'll just have a less distorted ass-tone. So I'll echo that your best option is to mic your amp.
 
socialistfish said:
I run into my GNX 1 via an emulated out (as a ghetto pre amp of sorts... gives me a right and left channel) which i run into a M-Audio Fast Track Pro, which goes into my Mac
Click to expand...

Drop the GNX 1 and roll the amp's gain down.. if you are using an emulated out, that's also most-likely line level.. so you DON'T need a pre-amp... so your sound might be nasty because it's clipping like hell.....I could be wrong though, but I think that would fix your problem..

if you want to keep the GNX, use it before the amp or in the FX loop if those Valestates have one...

-Paul
 
NewAgeMuttLange said:
Drop the GNX 1 and roll the amp's gain down.. if you are using an emulated out, that's also most-likely line level.. so you DON'T need a pre-amp... so your sound might be nasty because it's clipping like hell.....I could be wrong though, but I think that would fix your problem..
Click to expand...
I didn't notice that before but that Valvestate emulated output is a line level signal which is NOT what that GNX wants to see. It wants a guitar level signal and it wants something clean so it can do its' thing to the clean signal.
In this set-up you'd have a processor distorting already distorted sound. ........ NewAge is right ...... that would be a problem right there.
 
Turn your gain/distortion down...

Turn all effects off in your DAW that may be open on your track.

Recording distortion is going to sound totally different then your 'live' distortion.
 
Lt. Bob said:
right off the bat I'm gonna suggest that you're likely using way too much distortion.
Strange as it may seem ...... you have to use a much cleaner sound than you would think to get a good distorted guitar sound tracked.
Click to expand...

Its weird but right...you have to find a level you like...and then turn back a notch or two to get it right.
 
Possibly post a short clip of "pathetic" :)

are you adverse to spending any additional money?
 
hum, I was going to add to this thread but the typical OP MIA. seems to really happen a lot.
 
Sonixx said:
hum, I was going to add to this thread but the typical OP MIA. seems to really happen a lot.
Click to expand...

Well, it is Dec. 17th (last post of OP)
Christmas is a hectic time for some.
Keep that in mind. ;)
 
One mistake poeple make when recording direct guitar is they listen to the recording and think it sounds thin and lifeless so they think by adding more distortion they will thicken up the tone which usually doesn"t work , what usually does work is to use less distortion and More tone shapeing and EQ , My guitar amp has a 15 band eq on it , when I bypass the EQ the guitar is just thin and weak sounding (Like a crappy fender ), with the eq engaged the sound is Thick and it really cuts through ........


Cheers
 
socialistfish said:
I have a PRS SE i run into a digitech gnx1, which runs into a M-Aduo Fast Track Pro, which runs into my Macbook Pro.

OR

I have a PRS SE i run into a Marshal 100 Watt Valvestate I run into my GNX 1 via an emulated out (as a ghetto pre amp of sorts... gives me a right and left channel) which i run into a M-Audio Fast Track Pro, which goes into my Mac.
Click to expand...
I've isolated the problem for you.

Giving specific advice is a little tough not knowing exactly what type of sound you are looking for.

Most of the time, stereo is gotten by having the guitarist play the part twice, not by some stereo effect like chorus or delays (which is how the GNX1 is doing it).

Most of the time, the guitar is less distorted than you think and has more midrange than some people seem to go for. Once you play it two or three times and EQ some of the midrange away, it sounds like it is more distorted than it is. It also sounds a lot bigger than an overly distorted, fuzzy, scooped guitar with a chorus on it ever could.
 
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