My brain's the speed-brake...

[six]

... or at least one of several

When it comes to picking my right hand can't go faster than 16th-triplets at 125 b.p.m. (resp. 16ths at 166 bpm) at the moment, but that seems to be improvable... although it may take a year for 5 bpm, ha.

BUT the hardest thing is: I can't (with few exeptions) play notes that I don't really hear. It's a brain-thing.

At a speed of 90 bpm I can kind of hear and realize every single 16th-triplet note I play. but as it gets faster, my brain only hears a noise and therefore I can't really play it. so for the 16th-triplets at 125 bpm I tell myself to play triplets with downstrokes only but then use the upstrokes too.

Do I have to trick myself like that for all the fast stuff? What about sweep arpeggios? Is it like "start here in time - end there in time" and the rest will regulate itself?

 

[HangDawg]

... or at least one of several

When it comes to picking my right hand can't go faster than 16th-triplets at 125 b.p.m. (resp. 16ths at 166 bpm) at the moment, but that seems to be improvable... although it may take a year for 5 bpm, ha.

BUT the hardest thing is: I can't (with few exeptions) play notes that I don't really hear. It's a brain-thing.

At a speed of 90 bpm I can kind of hear and realize every single 16th-triplet note I play. but as it gets faster, my brain only hears a noise and therefore I can't really play it. so for the 16th-triplets at 125 bpm I tell myself to play triplets with downstrokes only but then use the upstrokes too.

Do I have to trick myself like that for all the fast stuff? What about sweep arpeggios? Is it like "start here in time - end there in time" and the rest will regulate itself?

Yes, 43 trees












































thread reported

 

[castlerock]

... or at least one of several

When it comes to picking my right hand can't go faster than 16th-triplets at 125 b.p.m. (resp. 16ths at 166 bpm) at the moment, but that seems to be improvable... although it may take a year for 5 bpm, ha.

16th notes at around 160 bpm is a respectable speed. or did you mean 8th notes? nothing wrong with 16ths at 160 but faster is better sometimes. (and sometimes required)

BUT the hardest thing is: I can't (with few exeptions) play notes that I don't really hear. It's a brain-thing.

i know what you mean. i've been playing for 25 years and i still struggle with my physical limitations. 16th notes at 160 bpm seems to be my limit right now.

i'm finding this excercise to be very helpful. there are also some good articles on improving technique at cyberfret .

Do I have to trick myself like that for all the fast stuff? What about sweep arpeggios? Is it like "start here in time - end there in time" and the rest will regulate itself?

heh, probably. it's just a matter of starting slow and clean and picking faster as you go until you hit your limit then push yourself a little harder at that point. you should eventually be able to train your hands to do what you want them to do.

for some of us i guess it'll just never come easy. =[

good luck.

 

[six]

for some of us i guess it'll just never come easy. =[

i've been playing for 13 years and 12 days now , and I think if I had concentrated on technique in the first few years (when I practiced or at least played daily for hours), i'd be able to play much faster now.

yeah, I meant 16ths at 160 (that's takataka for each beat ). sometimes i can even play some lines and sequences at this speed... but I feel most comfortable at around 90 bpm, playing up to 16th-triplets.

you see, I try to improve my right hand's ability by tremolo-picking at 160 bpm for a little while and then try 165 or whatever. now most of the time I end up with a strain in my arm. so the main goal should be to minimize the effort. don't know how though. maybe I should tremolo pick at 140 for half a day .

anyway. that's one side of the story. the other one is this mental thing. it really seems I have to trick myself.

 

[metalhead28]

Are you just refering to tremelo picking, like thrash metal speed picking....or actually being able to alternate pick complex sequences? Sounds like the former.
When it comes to total speed picking, as far as I'm concerned, you don't really feel each individual note, you feel them in groups...if that makes any sense. I can do 16ths at 250 that I know of (because I just recorded a song like that), but It's more like I'm vibrating my hand and counting off in groups of four or something like that. The notes sound like a sustaining texture instead of individual notes. So yeah, I guess your brain does have to process noise.

If this is what you're talking about, minimal, compact motion is essential. Minimal contact with the string is essential too.

 

[darrvid]

Well, you're faster than myself so I'm not sure I can really give any useful additions, but I can give you some support 'cause you're not alone in the brain processing issue. The best I've managed with that is to not process each individual note, but hear them as groups of notes. It could be you've just hit a bit of a roadblock, like I'm sure you've felt in your playing before if you made it to 160bpm. I remember having that around 85bpm, and once I made it past that there was a big jump in my speed. Nothing I know of beats solid, sustained practice, but sometimes a shift in how you perceive/think about playing a group of notes is just as helpful.

I can't say from personal experience, but from a book that has helped me in the past, it was suggested to just crank the metronome way up and practice that way to break speed barriers. I'll see if I can drag that info up, since it's not fresh in my mind (and again, I haven't tried the technique myself)

+1 to what metalhead said, sounds like he has a firmer grip on what I'm trying to get at. (16ths @ 250?! yep, much firmer grip on the speed issue than myself) What type of minimal contact are you talking about MH, that kind of speed seems like it must be barely touching the pick to the string, how do you get around having a low volume?

 

[IronFlippy]

I have a similar block, at 176 bpm. I can play quicker, but not solid in tempo. I think what it needs is a lot of practice with scales and various licks. I don't do that because my main ax is the sax, where I only wish I could hit the same note at that speed!

 

[capnkid]

Get a cordless drill, and a triangle shaped pick. put pick on drill. If you choose the high speed setting should be about 300 bpm.

 

[metalhead28]

+1 to what metalhead said, sounds like he has a firmer grip on what I'm trying to get at. (16ths @ 250?! yep, much firmer grip on the speed issue than myself) What type of minimal contact are you talking about MH, that kind of speed seems like it must be barely touching the pick to the string, how do you get around having a low volume?

That comes from years of playing death metal with incessant tremelo picking and stuff like that. When I say minimal motion, I mean I am just barely hitting the string...just the absolute tip of the pick, and the complete range of motion of the pick is probably under a half of an inch. With a high gain distorted sound the volume isn't really an issue. Out of curiosity, I fired up the metronome and determined that I can in fact play 16ths at at least 300 bpm.....and in case that sounds silly to you....I still can't compete with this guy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8Wbb8r8PUs

 

[32-20-Blues]

16th notes at 160 is fine, I play irish jigs, and triplets at around 190 is where I'm mots comfortable. I can play faster, but I don't feel i have as much control.

 

[punkin]

Are you just refering to tremelo picking, like thrash metal speed picking....or actually being able to alternate pick complex sequences? Sounds like the former.
When it comes to total speed picking, as far as I'm concerned, you don't really feel each individual note, you feel them in groups...if that makes any sense. I can do 16ths at 250 that I know of (because I just recorded a song like that), but It's more like I'm vibrating my hand and counting off in groups of four or something like that. The notes sound like a sustaining texture instead of individual notes. So yeah, I guess your brain does have to process noise.

If this is what you're talking about, minimal, compact motion is essential. Minimal contact with the string is essential too.

I like this answer, especially when playing musical passages.

I typically hear the phrasing in the tune which fits between points in time. If you don't hear or feel it, you can't make it happen. I really have to put my mind to it when working on technical building exersizes which often have some pretty abstract if any phrasing. For really odd passages, I plug them into my midi player and play backed with click track. This helps me to hear what I want to construct.

I would agree also with your comment about the right hand. Trem picking is for kids, it's the string transitions that will slow you down. I was broken of my self taught technique and pushed into full on strict alternate picking. This sucked for a long time. I can now do it if I want or need to. IMHO it's important to feel comfortable and natural in the up-pick movement which a lot of people have difficulty with. As part of my warm ups and I push this onto a few of my students, scales and exersizes strictly using up picking, then alternate.

 

[Dani Pace]

I just wanted to give you a word of encouragement. Your speed is pretty good already, and you are young enough to improve on it if you feel that you need or want to. I know plenty of players (including me) who aren't as fast as you. Fortunately for us slower players there are plenty of songs which don't require great speed. If you are like most of us (other guitar players) you will never be totally happy with your abilities. It's a vicious cycle, as we get better, we want to get even better. Don't worry about your brain slowing you down, I think you can reach a point where instinct and reflexes sort of take over, you know like when you play something and afterwards you say to yourself " Wow! I didn't know I could do that!"

 

[faderbug]

speed kills

 

[Hard2Hear]

You mean Speed Kills

 

[darrvid]

That comes from years of playing death metal with incessant tremelo picking and stuff like that. When I say minimal motion, I mean I am just barely hitting the string...just the absolute tip of the pick, and the complete range of motion of the pick is probably under a half of an inch. With a high gain distorted sound the volume isn't really an issue. Out of curiosity, I fired up the metronome and determined that I can in fact play 16ths at at least 300 bpm.....and in case that sounds silly to you....I still can't compete with this guy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8Wbb8r8PUs

Another question, since thats not a style I'm familiar with... I take it you run through compression then too? Assuming the whole song isn't played that way, unless the non-trem parts are just face melting loud

Even if you don't, would that be considered a good reason to use a compression pedal? My experience with pedals is mostly limited to wah and distortion.

 

[metalhead28]

Another question, since thats not a style I'm familiar with... I take it you run through compression then too? Assuming the whole song isn't played that way, unless the non-trem parts are just face melting loud

Even if you don't, would that be considered a good reason to use a compression pedal? My experience with pedals is mostly limited to wah and distortion.

No, I don't use any compression. The only time I've ever used compression on electric guitar was for clean tones, but other people may have a different idea. With the gain cranked up there is no noticable difference in volume between high speed trem picking and a more typical pick attack. (Lots of gain is pretty much compressing the hell out of it already)

 

[darrvid]

No, I don't use any compression. The only time I've ever used compression on electric guitar was for clean tones, but other people may have a different idea. With the gain cranked up there is no noticable difference in volume between high speed trem picking and a more typical pick attack. (Lots of gain is pretty much compressing the hell out of it already)

Good to know.

@ six - It was kinda mentioned by castle, but slowing way down (like 60bpm) and really nitpicking your technique can also make your speed increase. I'd think making it to the speed you have you probably already use this type of practice though. This helps me anyway, start @ 60, run the drill, go to 64, run drill, down to 62, back up to 68, rise repeat until you're pressing your max speed.