MSH-1A matched pair test

[Minion]

If you're tracking multiple instruments in the same room and need some isolation, if the room sounds bad, if you use coincident micing techniques, etc. you're not always going to reach for omnis.

That is what Isolation Booths are For.....

a Single Directional Mic isn"t going to do you much good if you are trying to Capture the sound a several Cymbols that are spaced apart on a Kit...You will hear the Cymbol Closest to the Mic the Loudest because of Proximity effect.....

If you Mic each Cymbol seperately with a Directional Mic then that would Work and help get rid of Transients if there are several Instruments being recorded in the Same Room but that wouldn"t be what you would call Overheads but more of a Close micing situation.....don"t you think??

 

[XLR]

a Single Directional Mic isn"t going to do you much good if you are trying to Capture the sound a several Cymbols that are spaced apart on a Kit...You will hear the Cymbol Closest to the Mic the Loudest because of Proximity effect.....

I think he was talking about overhead cardioids in XY or ORTF, not spot mic'ing.

Walter, Tonio and Julian - thanks guys.

Tim

 

[orksnork]

more like timothy LOLLER

get it? k

 

[leddy]

That is what Isolation Booths are For.....

a Single Directional Mic isn"t going to do you much good if you are trying to Capture the sound a several Cymbols that are spaced apart on a Kit...You will hear the Cymbol Closest to the Mic the Loudest because of Proximity effect.....

If you Mic each Cymbol seperately with a Directional Mic then that would Work and help get rid of Transients if there are several Instruments being recorded in the Same Room but that wouldn"t be what you would call Overheads but more of a Close micing situation.....don"t you think??

Isolation booths are not always an option. I record small jazz groups all in one room, often at live gigs. I use combinations of omni and cardioid mics depending on the situation. A single directional mic can pick up the whole kit in a balanced way if you place it right.

 

[XLR]

What settings on the GR pre?

Just 44 dB of gain, and I used the balanced outs. The MP2H only has gain, pads, phase reversal and the choice of balanced and unbalanced outs. The balanced outs are just a shade smoother IMO.

Tim

 

[Adam P]

I just wanted to mention that the MSH-1A (and this thread in particular) has gotten a bit of interest over at Steve Albini's Electrical Audio forums: link.

 

[Halion]

That is what Isolation Booths are For.....

a Single Directional Mic isn"t going to do you much good if you are trying to Capture the sound a several Cymbols that are spaced apart on a Kit...You will hear the Cymbol Closest to the Mic the Loudest because of Proximity effect.....

If you Mic each Cymbol seperately with a Directional Mic then that would Work and help get rid of Transients if there are several Instruments being recorded in the Same Room but that wouldn"t be what you would call Overheads but more of a Close micing situation.....don"t you think??

I'm sorry mate, but I have to correct you here.

First of all you can totally mic an entire kit with just one directional mic.The sound won't be as punchy as it can be, but that might not be what your going for either.

Secondly, it's called cymbals, with an a.

Thirdly, micing every cymbal with it's own mic is overkill in most situations.

Fourthly, proximity effect has nothing to do with this. Proximity effect is the buildup of bass when close micing something (matter of inches) with a cardioid mic.

Fifthly, transients have nothing to do with this either. You probably mean bleed, which is something you'll get if you mic a kit further away and if there are other sound sources in the room, but that doesn't have to be a bad thing, and definately doesn't have much to do with transients.

 

[XLR]

Hey mshilarious... when you were building these mic's the point-to-point way how long did it, on average, take to make each mic? No, I'm not trying to estimate your annual uncome - just interested in the building process.

Tim

 

[mshilarious]

Hey mshilarious... when you were building these mic's the point-to-point way how long did it, on average, take to make each mic? No, I'm not trying to estimate your annual uncome - just interested in the building process.

Tim

Well, guess what, I'm back to p2p. PCBs were a miserable failure from an efficiency standpoint. Attaching the PCB to the pins was the most time consuming part, then I had to drop a couple of component values to fit, and stuffing the board wasn't that fast, so then I thought why am I doing this if it costs more? PCBs aren't cheap, even in the quantities I order now, it is still about $0.70 per mic.

So, p2p. About 15 minutes Testing each mic initially takes another 5 minutes, first for a voice test (sorry yes, every 1A has been forced to transduce my singing don't worry, I hold it above my nose, so no spittle is deposited), then a white noise test. Matching takes about 1/2 hour for a batch of 16 to 20 mics.

 

[apl]

Well, guess what, I'm back to p2p. PCBs were a miserable failure from an efficiency standpoint. Attaching the PCB to the pins was the most time consuming part, then I had to drop a couple of component values to fit, and stuffing the board wasn't that fast, so then I thought why am I doing this if it costs more? PCBs aren't cheap, even in the quantities I order now, it is still about $0.70 per mic.

So, p2p. About 15 minutes Testing each mic initially takes another 5 minutes, first for a voice test (sorry yes, every 1A has been forced to transduce my singing don't worry, I hold it above my nose, so no spittle is deposited), then a white noise test. Matching takes about 1/2 hour for a batch of 16 to 20 mics.

That's poopy. Maybe you need to throw $10k at the problem and do SMT with a pick and place robot.

 

[XLR]

Thanks MSH. Sorry to year the PCBs didn't work out. It'll be interesting to see what these sell for a year from now when the sound-quality/price/buyer-perception balance works its way out.

Tim

 

[mshilarious]

Thanks MSH. Sorry to year the PCBs didn't work out. It'll be interesting to see what these sell for a year from now when the sound-quality/price/buyer-perception balance works its way out.

Tim

I suspect everyone who wants one will have one by then. It'll be fun while it lasts

Next week is going to be lots of fun (hint, hint)

 

[XLR]

I suspect everyone who wants one will have one by then. It'll be fun while it lasts

Hmmm.... IMO right now you're selling to early adopters, many of whom are market influencers. The $20 price makes it a no-brainer to try them but the sound quality is worth much more than the current price. Later you'll be swamped with orders as each, "What's the best mic under $X" is answered with the MSH-1A on the short list. And that's a question asked every day all over the various forums. You'll have to hire an assembly staff or raise your price as a natural control of the number of orders. That's what I'd expect anyway.

Is your design patented? If so you could probably sell it to a manufacturer for a bundle.

Tim

 

[apl]

Hmmm.... IMO right now you're selling to early adopters, many of whom are market influencers. The $20 price makes it a no-brainer to try them but the sound quality is worth much more than the current price. Later you'll be swamped with orders as each, "What's the best mic under $X" is answered with the MSH-1A on the short list. And that's a question asked every day all over the various forums. You'll have to hire an assembly staff or raise your price as a natural control of the number of orders. That's what I'd expect anyway.

Tim

I think the buzz is getting awfully loud. And now that I've gotten mine at an incredible introductory price, I'd concur that it would still be a bargain if the price went up. What's the nearest serious competitor cost?

 

[mshilarious]

Is your design patented? If so you could probably sell it to a manufacturer for a bundle.

I don't consider it patentable, but just to make sure, the schematic is published

It would sadden me to raise the price, I think. Beyond a question of value, I don't embrace pricing as a scheme to limit demand (and yes, I do have a business degree ). Perhaps I am being naive, but in these halcyon days nobody really asks why the mic is glued into an XLR connector, and I'd like to keep it that way

 

[orksnork]

perhaps some naivity is exactly what the world needs...

 

[BigRay]

I suspect everyone who wants one will have one by then. It'll be fun while it lasts

Next week is going to be lots of fun (hint, hint)

MS, I think you will be a real hit with the tapers.(you are starting to be already)..did you put up a retail ad on ts? the combination of low profile, sound good, and low cost is a trifecta for the taping folks. (well anyone, really)

I just bought 3 dpa 4006, id love to do some comparisons. The clips i have heard sound great.

 

[mshilarious]

MS, I think you will be a real hit with the tapers.(you are starting to be already)..did you put up a retail ad on ts? the combination of low profile, sound good, and low cost is a trifecta for the taping folks. (well anyone, really)

No ad yet, I'm working on some taper-specific products first. The 1As really don't like low current. Low voltage, yes, low current, no. The good ol' 1, with a couple of tweaks, could be very useful for them.

 

[BigRay]

No ad yet, I'm working on some taper-specific products first. The 1As really don't like low current. Low voltage, yes, low current, no. The good ol' 1, with a couple of tweaks, could be very useful for them.

Yeah, and there is a huge market potential.....lot of people on that board. The resident mic guru and all around tech geek guy went AWOL with quite a bit of some tapers' gear, so the good people there need another geek.

 

[XLR]

...It would sadden me to raise the price, I think. Beyond a question of value, I don't embrace pricing as a scheme to limit demand...

Very admirable! It's the value aspect that will eventually change the price IMO.

Tim