Mixing suggestions?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Nathan1984
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Nathan1984

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I am using alot of vst amp sims, and impulses. I am getting pretty decent results, they sound really good, about as close to a mic'd cab as I can get without my half stack being here. When I put it into a mix though, they have some overly harsh highs, but if I roll back the highs in the amp sim, it effects the tone almost to much, so I was wondering what you guys do to smooth out the guitars in your mix. I am going for an extreme metal kind of sound, I don't use alot of gain, I want a very clear almost clean guitar tone for clarity. I play alot of sweeps and tapping riffs and want my guitars to really shine and yet fall into the mix better.
 
I'm not sure what you are using. But Guitar Rig gives you some limited mic and mic position choices. Maybe play around with that, as that would be my first suggestion if you were micing a real cab.
 
I'm guessing you mean you want the solo clean for the tapping and what not, and the rhythms distorted. This is where you can really use some EQ. Take a certain frequency, where you think the solo sounds good, and boost it a tiny bit, 3db max. Cut the same frequency from the rhythm guitars and you should hear a marked separation. Panning helps too. If you have the rhythms on the sides and the solo anywhere but the extremes, that helps too.
 
I am using the poulin le456, which I think sounds great with impulse cabs. I should have been more specific, I was asking what you guys suggest for eqing metal guitars, my solo riffs are distorted also. I meant, that my guitars are a low distorted tone, alot of the progressive death metal that I listen to, they don't sound as if they are very distorted. I just want the guitars to sound their best. I pan quad tracked guitars. guitar 1 and 2 100 and 70 percent left, and guitars 3 and 4 100 and 70 right. I normally only put one solo track on and I center it. I was wondering what I should do to help get alot of the junk out of the tones when mixing, like I have read alot of people say to cut at 800 hz. What do you guys suggest for metal guitars, hi/lo pass, boosts, what frequencies do what to guitars?
 
probably not what you want to hear, but using and actual amp (even if it's a baby bedroom amp!) and a mic, will lend better results.
otherwise, you're just playing mixing games with eq, and that's NEVER gonna get you off.

don't try to eq, using the SOLO button....
always do these kinds of EQ's with the whole mix going.
how something sounds when solo'd is a short road to hades.
 
GONZO-X said:
don't try to eq, using the SOLO button....
always do these kinds of EQ's with the whole mix going.
how something sounds when solo'd is a short road to hades.
Click to expand...

Very true :D Great advice.
 
GONZO-X said:
probably not what you want to hear, but using and actual amp (even if it's a baby bedroom amp!) and a mic, will lend better results.
.
Click to expand...

No it won't. A good sim is better than the wrong amp.
 
What you need to do is find the harsh frequencies and notch them out. With a parameteric EQ set to a narrow bandwidth, boost about 9db then sweep the upper midrange until you find the nasty frequency that annoys you. Once you find it, turn the gain on the EQ down to get rid of it. It will probably be in the 3-6k range.

Once you have done that, then set the high shelf to around 8k and boost it to bring back some of the open-ness and air into the sound.

Obviously, it's a much better idea to find a sim that isn't as annoying sounding. Sometimes (actually most of the time) it is better to record the guitars a little darker than you want them and EQ the highs in during the mix.

I do this all the time with real amps, because bright sounds make the speakers break up differently than mellow sounds. It makes the speakers produce that harsh sound in the 3-6 k range that is hard to get rid of. Mellow(er) guitar sounds end up smoother in the high end, so you can boost the hell out of everything above 8k without it getting harsh.
 
I am thinking that maybe I am just to much of a guitarist and I am equing my amp sim poorly? I normally run the gain at about 10 o'clock, bass at 1 o'clock, mids at 3 o'clock, and treble at about 1 o'clock, presence at about 1 o'clock as well. I don't know, maybe I shouldn't be doing something that I am.
 
That is not EQing, that is the tone control of your amp sim. Get a sound you like from the sim, adjusting the tone controls as needed. Turn the gain down - you never need as much recording as what you hear in your ears when playing.

EQing is using a multi-band equalizer in your recording software (or a real EQ outboard device) to get rid of harsh or problem frequencies, hums (60Hz) to reduce muddiness and to make 'room' in the mix for all the instruments/voices. Quad tracking 4 distorted guitars is going to give you a lot of muddiness if they are playing roughly the same thing. Also, panning instruments 100% to one side or the other can make them sound like they are apart from the rest of the instruments - not recorded in the same 'space'. If you have 2 identical tracks panned 100% left and 100% right, it's the same as having 1 track panned in the center.
 
Yeah, I know the whole eq, I was just wanting some tips on my tone settings. I do quad track, maybe I should just double track and have a lead in the center? I noticed that things do tend to get pretty muddy when quad tracking. The only thing is there are alot of songs that we play that have alot of layered guitars, two different things going on at the same time. What do you guys suggest, just doing a double tracked rhythm guitar and just a single lead centered?
 
here is where i am right now, i just got done recording this, sounds pretty tight through my monitors and laptop speakers. this should give you all an idea of what I am after, and what I need to correct in my eq'ing.
 

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In a mix everything should have its own place. When different instruments played together have similar frecuencies the mix sounds unbalanced because frequencies interfeer with each other.

What you should do is hear each of your recorded tracks and asi your self what do you want from that particular track. If you want the solo to totally take over and just barely hear a weak rythm in the back, then you should do what Saads said: boost the frequency that gives the solo the most character and cut that same freq from the rythm part.

Always EQ with all the tracks on, the most important thing in a mix is how well tracks relate to each other. Hear "white noise" by mogwai. To me thats like the most perfect mix ever
 
The guitar really don't sound that bad. I would back off on the distortion if you can. You would get rid of some of the fatiguing quality of the guitars by only having two tracks instead of four.

What I tend to do is have two tracks of the rhythm and just layer things on top of that. (only the differences) It kind of depends on what it is. If there is a riff that has a harmony, I will sometimes just have one guitar do the root and the other do the harmony, if it's 3 part, the other part just gets layered in just for that part.
 
Why do heavy metal guys always record with too much guitar distortion? All sound definition is lost. Not sure what was going on with the 'drum' part of that MP3! :rolleyes:
 
Try cutting some of the high end on the pickups, try changing pick up selector. Then try less high mids in the amp sim and if the problem still persists then use an EQ to cut out the high mids.

G
 
Yeah, I am thinking that it is hard to make something fake sound real. I have fake drums, fake guitar amps, and fake bass amps, but that is what I am limited to in my home studio, once I wanna record a serious demo that isn't just for fun for my band, I plan on mic'ing my 5150 cab, and mic'ing the drums. As for distortion, I am not using alot at all, that is why I am dumbfounded on why it comes out so grainy. I am still experimenting, I am still pretty new at this all. I think I need to start at square one, get good tracks in the first place, then mix one at a time. I was wondering, what do you guys normally do with your guitars. How do I even start to mix, I am second guessing myself alot these days, don't know where I am going wrong, would love somer pointers, what do I need to do to what to get what I am after you know?
 
Amp sims have a hard time giving you good compression with little distortion, which makes you turn up the distortion to get the 'feel' right.

A trick I always use is to use a comp/sustainer pedal (or sim) in front of the amp sim. This gives you the sustain and allows you to back the distortion off even more, which gets rid of the harshness and sim-sound.
 
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