Mix contest

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Re: Re: Re: Fenix - a little background please

philsaudio said:
Fenix:
Thanks for the information. If understand correctly, everything was not tracked seperately since the Drums,Guitar and vocal were recorded at the same time to click. Correct?

No. He played along live (as in no scratch tracks) while i recorded drums. There were no scratch tracks laid down.
 
Re: Hearing the click track. I didn't hear it until I had a mix and then tried to apply compression to the whole thing. Then I heard it at the beginning of the song and wondered where THAT came from!

Self-critique on my last mix:
Still not getting enough high end in places. One of the things I like about Fenix's mix is that he's getting that. Mine just sounds too muddy. Maybe I need to bleed off some mids? Don't know. Anyone have any suggestions? Overall volume still too low, but really haven't done much processing on the mix itself. Need to increase drum volumes as the other instruments come up. Since I still have the lead guitar hanging to the left, but brought the acoustic more on-center, it sounds too left biased. Gotta fix that.

This is great fun! Never had to deal with so many tracks before...many little decisions to be made. Hope I'm not boring you more experienced guys!

Gary
 
the click track could be from the bleed from the control room. The dude running the PT session could have had the click a bit too loud in the monitors in the control room.

I'm really starting to dislike this board. When I type up a long post and then it says "sorry there's too many people logged in at the moment" or something like that and i lose my post.
 
Recording method

Fenix:

I am even more confused now. You are killing me bro!

When I think of recording instruments SEPERATELY this is what I think of : One instrument plays at a time, be it drums with 10 mics or a bass direct, the one instrument is played and none other is played by a musician at the same time. This is SEPERATE. Unless the first instrument is going down first, what then must happen is the next instrument(s) played are being played while the musician listens to the first (and subsequent) instrument(s) that wer recorded.


Now I think I hear you saying that while you recorded drums, Josh Hill played guitar and sang at that same time. This performance by Josh Hill is the bleed through I hear in the drum tracks.

You say you recorded each instrument seperately. This could mean two things, as far as my puny mind can fathom.

1) Josh was playing guitar and singing when you played drums but you did not record those two instruments (voice + guitar) other than recording the bleed through.

2) You recorded his voice and guitar on seperate tracks while you were playing drums.

WTF Over Fenix- Did you record drums voice and guitar all at once or do something else that is semantically correct but confusing the hell out of me. Help me understand.
 
fenix said:

I'm really starting to dislike this board. When I type up a long post and then it says "sorry there's too many people logged in at the moment" or something like that and i lose my post.

Yeah that sucks.

Highlight the text and copy it before you send your post.
If it screws then just paste it again and resend.

MAlcolm
 
Hey guys,

Is it just me or is someone else also having problems with the overheads? Apart from the fact that the left track is about one second longer than the right track, they don't really seem to 'lock' (for lack of any better term)? The image of the snare doesn't seem to be stable.

And those ghostnotes on the snare are pretty destracting, I first thought I'd hear single delays in the OHs.

Apart from that, I think I would like to try some heavier editing on the drums, as there are several timing issues present in the tracks.

Am I allowed to redo the bass part, or am I violating rules here?

Oh, and the BPM is 161, or 80.5 for a less annoying click.

More when I return,

David


A real big THANK YOU to Fenix for letting us all mess with his tracks, hehe. Thanks, man.
 
I'm late!! Here's mine, I just finished it.
. It's cool to see what everyone else has done since I'm done with mine! Cool song, and great tracking, especially the bass.
 
Finally got a chance to work on this... I'll post either tomorrow or Friday...

Cool tune!
 
Re: WAV Envelopes

I haven't checked this thread in a while. Cool that it's still alive.
philsaudio said:
Wav envelopes of submitted files
Very educating. I definately see a few peaks that I should've tamed.
 
It's done, done, done!

I've finished my mix about five minutes ago. I'll post it sometime tomorrow, in case I can find someplace to upload it to, that is.

Explanations on my mix tomorrow, when I post it.

I'm tired. I'll go to bed. Bye.
 
Here's mine....

More At Ease - Blue Bear Sound mix ---> Stream / Download

I didn't make it super-hot in overall level, because I liked the dynamics when it wasn't flattened!
 
BB, I like the mix overall. The intro is cool. The chorus is cool. I see that you didn't care for the Toms too much either. I'm confused though. I can understand preserving the dynamics, but I think this mix needs a little umph (my personal opinion). What reverb did you use on the vocals? It is very clean and natural sounding. You did a lot better than most (including myself) with the OH. I'm surprised to hear the squeaking in the vocals though. Is it just me or does it sound like the singer is jacking off the mic during the recording. It's a somewhat-subtle, mid-range squeaking that is very annoying to me. My personal approach was some para-EQ to lower the squeaking, but it's almost, if not totally, impossible to remove the squeaking without messing up the vocals. Is there a happy median here, or should we just leave it be and say, "well, it should have been tracked better".
Also, where's the kick? What did you do to calm the toms (besides reducing their presence in the mix)?
Overall, it's a very natural sounding mix Bruce (which I presume is what you were going for). Any tips/rips on my mix (or any other for that matter) would be greatly appreciated because we are all here to learn and this is the best classroom experience any of us could wish for. BTW, this goes for everyone.
Best Wishes,
Keith
 
alright, here's mine...

download it at www.nowhereradio.com/nessbass/ under Discography -> Singles.

As you will hear, I messed with the tracks a lot, in a production way, rather than in a mixing way. Here's in detail what I did:

I thought that the snare sound was quite problematic, as were the ghost notes, so I triggered it using samples out of one of my band's recordings.

I then MIDI-ized the kick, because it was easier for me to manipulate MIDI data than to fiddle around with more than 200 snippets of wav file, what would definitely have been possible, but would have taken much more time. So I corrected the timing issues that way and changed the patterns around, leaving some kicks out and putting others in, you will have to listen to see what I mean. I then used the MIDI data to trigger samples taken out of the original wav file. This way of doing it was made possible by the fact, that the kick drum wasn't really prominent in the overheads, so that I could change the timing without having to edit all the drum tracks.

The toms were manually gated using automation, which is very nice, cause this way you can let them have a fairly natural decay (probably longer than what my noisegates offer).

You will also notice that I changed the verse parts, because I thought that the song could use some more drive there, so I added rimclicks on all quarter notes. The rimclicks are also sampled, because they were really not there in the snare track.

With the drums that way, I thought that it might be a good idea to leave the bass out of the verse part right after the first chorus, to gain some space to breathe. But I had decided against redoing the bass part, so I constructed a fake note with a natural, long decay out of a looped bit of the first note of said verse (did I make myself clear here?). Other than that, I didn't do anything to the bass part. I thought about replaying it in the first place, because Josh was contantly sliding up and down the fretboard all the time, and I didn't really like that, but as you don't hear very much of that in the mix, I left it the way it was.

Another thing you will probably have noticed is the vocal arrangement.

My first impression of the first verse was that the end (the second "at all") didn't really fit where it was, so I used it to create a harmony.

I then delayed the backing vocal leading into the choruses ("do the same" and "again"), because I thought it would be better to fill the gap there to keep the excitement, rather than having a harmony.

The last thing I did vocal-wise, was to use the backing vocals at the end (where Josh is singing the same line three times) to build a three-voice 'choir'. I did this by copying the track to two other tracks and by chopping these around, changing the order of the lines, so that I got three different successions:
(1->2->3/2->3->1/3->1->2)
I think it sounds much nicer that way, the single background vocal just sounded too 'solitary'.


Alright, I think that's enough for now. If someone wants to know specifics as to how i mixed certain tracks, please ask.

I have a question myself here...
I know that I maybe left too many of the kicks out and that the hihats are quite buried in the mix, but what about the low end? I guess I will have to start mixing on decent monitors, because I found it very hard to get the bass frequencies under control. So here's my question: I the bass (instrument) too boomy, or is it alright, and what about the kick? Would be great to know what's going on there, so could all you guys with decent monitoring share your thoughts on that?

Thank you all, this was (and still is) great fun.

David
 
freeztar said:
BB, I like the mix overall. The intro is cool. The chorus is cool.
Thanks Keith...!


freeztar said:
I see that you didn't care for the Toms too much either.
No - I didn't care for the way they were tracked - very little "snap" so they sound pretty muddy -- but I didn't have forever to work on this mix, so I didn't worry too much about it... they is what they is, much like the tracking of the vocals & snare!


freeztar said:
I'm confused though. I can understand preserving the dynamics, but I think this mix needs a little umph (my personal opinion).
I don't really agree, the song builds nicely because of the arrangement, and since I was going for "natural" instead of "rock production", I left it alone... in my mind, it reminded me of the kind of song you might hear as the opening to a movie - so I wanted a warm, ambient space for the mix, which I feel I achieved. Besides - this is not a mastered mix, so "punch" could still be added!


freeztar said:
What reverb did you use on the vocals? It is very clean and natural sounding.
There were 4 different ambient textures applied to the lead vocal, including a small delay. "Clean and natural" doesn't necessarily come about by using only a single reverb -- for me, it's about creating texture which, if done well, tends to sound far richer than a single reverb patch.


freeztar said:
You did a lot better than most (including myself) with the OH.
A few judicious EQ cuts and a slight hi-shelf boost was all I did. Incidently, the snare was problematic, but a little compression for color and balancing between the over/under snare tracks was all that was needed...


freeztar said:
I'm surprised to hear the squeaking in the vocals though. Is it just me or does it sound like the singer is jacking off the mic during the recording. It's a somewhat-subtle, mid-range squeaking that is very annoying to me. My personal approach was some para-EQ to lower the squeaking, but it's almost, if not totally, impossible to remove the squeaking without messing up the vocals. Is there a happy median here, or should we just leave it be and say, "well, it should have been tracked better".
Not sure what squeaking you mean - the problems I heard with the vocals were significant level changes and some pitch issues. The level issues were tamed with some compression and limiting (for that one inexplicably loud segment). I initially thought to correct some of the pitchy notes with the autotune but then decided not to - mainly because I felt the pitchiness added a rawness to the track that worked in context. I did double the BG voxs and delay them a bit to make them wider (panned apart). I didn't have a lot of time to work this mix into my schedule - one thing I would have like to spend more time on is de-essing the lead vocal - which may also help on the "squeak". Oh well....


freeztar said:
Also, where's the kick?
It's right where it should be, locked together and accentuating the bass! (In contrast to many others mixes, which had the kick WAY too up-front, IMO...)


freeztar said:
What did you do to calm the toms (besides reducing their presence in the mix)?
I stripped the tom tracks down to their actual hits - I think the toms actually only appear 8-9 times in the track - and cut around 300 Hz, slight boost at around 2KHz, and slight boost at around 100Hz. I would have like to have them tracked with more attack and depth, but they is what they is!


freeztar said:
Overall, it's a very natural sounding mix Bruce (which I presume is what you were going for).
That's the biggest compliment Keith, because that's exactly what I was going for!
 
Last edited:
Blue Bear Rocks

I listened to all who posted songs. Very interesting.
I tried my hand at mixing the song. Very interesting.

I listened to BlueBears mix. ------------
I went into the studio tuned up and started to play along.

Blue Bear Rocked me.

You Rock!
 
Yeah, nice mix indeed, Bruce! Although the kick is too quiet for my tastes - okay I may have gone over the top in my mix....

I think it's a nice idea to bring the electrics from the verse-buildup-parts up again in the last chorus.
 
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