Mic Recomendations?

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Analytical Man

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I am searching for a new mic for recording clean vocals.. I am having problems getting a good clear vocal sound with my current mic. I have to keep on hyping the highs. But that mic is a cheapy Nady. I guess that i am looking for a very clear, crisp sound, that is not nasaly or harsh. I am recording to digital if that factors in. I am looking to spend about 300 on the mic, and i am willing to spend an extra 200 on a simple pre amp if need be. The musical style will be kinda mainstream metal, you know the hooky choruses where the guys stop screaming for like 10 words. I guess i am after extreme detail, not at all muffled, and not too silibant. Any help is appreciated. The vox will be processed pretty heavily, but i need the clarity without EQ boosts. Thanks in advance for anyone who can help.

An example of what of what i am looking for is the sound from Demon Hunter's song "Not Ready To Die"

can be downloaded from www.demonhunter.com
 
For metal in the $300 price range, I'd recommend an SM7a dynamic mic. It's not at all sibilant, and it will handle anything you can throw its way. You may have to boost the high end just a tad, but it takes to EQ really well.
 
I hat to say it, but if your vocals aren't very detailed, then there is probably something else wrong. My guess would be that you need to back the singer (yourself?) off the mic by as much as an extra foot or more. You're probably getting too much proximity effect, which can muddy things up and force you to use too much EQ to compensate.

If you (or the singer) is the type that has to swallow the mic, then the only thing I can tell you is to save a few more pennies and pick up a used Electrovoice RE-20 or something in that line (the RE-20 is designed to minimize proximity effect, and it does a good job).

A Neumann TLM-103 or even a Marshall mxl-2003 are a few of the brightest mikes I can think of off the top of my head. Something like that might also work, but you might also find them to be overly sibilant, and I wouldn't normally think of them as a good choice for metal.
 
thanks for the response. I have sm57's. They work well on the really heavy stuff for me, but they didn't have it for the clean vocals. It wasn't bad, just not what i was looking for.

The mic will be only for the clean vox, not for the swallow the mic type of stuff. I will try and back off of it to see if that yields more appealing results but if i remember correctly when i tried that it sounded not quite clear enough for me even when i i compressed and raised the overall levels. Maybe i need to treat my room too? I bought a new house i will be moving into in September that will have a totally acoustically treated studio room there. Now i am in a basement with all concrete walls and it is very large. I will look into the RE-20, any other thoughts out there. I suppose i shouldn't forget to mention that all of the vocals i need to record will have harmonies on them, and not be just the single voice.
 
You will also enjoy the at 3035 or ebay 4033. both great, clean signal producers
 
Analytical Man said:
thanks for the response. I have sm57's. They work well on the really heavy stuff for me, but they didn't have it for the clean vocals. It wasn't bad, just not what i was looking for.
Click to expand...

He said Sm7, not 57. I have a SM7, which I use for hip hop vocals, and its nice and smooth no matter what you throw at it. It dosent have the highest output, so I'd recommend running it through a pre that stays clean at high levels. But its a clean, smooth mic. Michael Jackson also recorded the entire Thriller album with a SM7. Ive also heard of a lot of Screamo/Post Hardcore bands using it, so Id check it out, it might work nicely for you. I got mine for $349 at Sam Ash.
 
Analytical Man said:
Maybe i need to treat my room too? Now i am in a basement with all concrete walls and it is very large.
Click to expand...
Look into treating at least a portion of the room.
 
Yes, treat the room. If nothing else, yoou can create a small booth with some stands and furniture blankets. The farther away from the mic you get, the more the room comes into play.

As for mics, I would also recomend a RODE NT1000 and RODE NTK. The NTK is a little more than $300 but the NT1000 usually sels for that. Both are very clean sounding mics.

Blessings, Terry
 
Thanks

I guess I misread that SM7-SM57 thing. I am definately treating the entire room, with pro quality materials. I usually am fairly close to the mic when i record, but not eating it. I guess i can go over 300, but i didn't want to go too nuts. I used to use the AKG C3000B LDC, it was better than what i am using now but still i needed something better so that one went. Thanks for the ideas.
 
Sure you can get "clean" vocals with a SM57.
Let's make it clear :) you don't HAVE to use a different mic.
It's basically the same capsule as the SM7, and is very open to EQing.

Just a matter of patience to place a '57 well, and to EQ it during mixing.
A nice parametric EQ that'll work well is the DBX 242.
I expect the new Joe Meek line to do a fine job when they're available pretty soon also.

This is meant as another option in addition to the other good suggestions in this thread.

As far as the harmonies are concerned, while your room isn't acoustically treated, one idea would be to get a Sennheiser 421 (not the new MKII)
because you can record up to a vocal trio with one.
One possible set-up would be to have the lead singer on the SM57 facing
directly the other singers on the 421 to minimize bleed.

For acoustical treatment in the meantime, check out www.realtraps.com
The products are superior to packing blankets, etc.

Chris
 
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Analytical Man said:
I am definately treating the entire room, with pro quality materials.
Click to expand...

It's not so much the use of "pro quality materials" as it is a professional design. There's a lot more to it than just using foam and such -- you should really pay a visit to the Studio Building forum just south a ways from the mic forum. :D

Having a solid accoustic environment will allow you to back off from the mic a bit more than normal, which can help out a great deal with the clarity issue.

Picking up a condenser isn't a bad idea either. You'll generally find them to be more responsive and thus more detailed than most dynamics -- if that's what you're looking for.
 
Analytical Man said:
I am searching for a new mic for recording clean vocals.. I am having problems getting a good clear vocal sound with my current mic. I have to keep on hyping the highs. But that mic is a cheapy Nady. I guess that i am looking for a very clear, crisp sound, that is not nasaly or harsh. I am recording to digital if that factors in. I am looking to spend about 300 on the mic, and i am willing to spend an extra 200 on a simple pre amp if need be. The musical style will be kinda mainstream metal, you know the hooky choruses where the guys stop screaming for like 10 words. I guess i am after extreme detail, not at all muffled, and not too silibant. Any help is appreciated. The vox will be processed pretty heavily, but i need the clarity without EQ boosts. Thanks in advance for anyone who can help.

An example of what of what i am looking for is the sound from Demon Hunter's song "Not Ready To Die"

can be downloaded from www.demonhunter.com
Click to expand...

CAD M9 tube mic. It will cost a bit more than $300 (maybe $389 new - see eBay), but tough. Worth it.
 
Analytical Man said:
I am definately treating the entire room, with pro quality materials.
Click to expand...
Look into having it done by a professional... as chessrock pointed out, there is a LOT more to it that just sticking some foam on the walls... many concrete basements need bass traps placed in just right places and etc, etc.

Too be honest... I'd be more concerned about your room acoustics than a mic right now.
 
Studio acoustics not a problem, finding the right mic is

I think you misread my posts, or maybe i mis-typed. I am moving into my brand new house in like 3 months so it wouldn't pay to treat where i am right now. I have a studio all designed in my new house with proffessional materials treating it. I am not just throwing foam up on the walls. I am using alot of sound diffusing panels that break up the sound into like anywhere from 10-20 different planes, and sound absorbing panels that soak up the diffused waves, i have bass traps that will be placed appropriately, sound proof walls and insulation in the drywall, it is not in a basement, and a few different panels for spot treatment, also an iso boothe for vox that is entirely dead because i want it that way so i don't capture anything but my voice(i will be processing the crap out of it anyway) I am into the ultra modern clean vocal sound. It was designed by a proffessional so i am quite certain that i will not have much trouble with the acoustics. My concern is still the mic. I use studio grade monster cables (the best ones i have found to date, although a bit pricey), and i run direct into my roland vs2480cd...the Roland boards were always known for having kinda crappy pres, but not this bad boy. They uprgraded all the pres on the real expensive models, and they are pretty nice, so i have the signal real clean, just need THE RIGHT MIC for that ultra modern clean vox sound. I use to run the vox through the TC Helicon VoicePrism Plus, but i sold it because it didn't have auto pitch correction. You would think for well 1300 back then, but now they are like a grand that they would have that. I know, sing in key and you won't need it, but it can help in spots. I am thinking of picking up the Antares Vocal Producer, and probably the AT4040- i think that is the model. Khompewtor (Evan K) uses that mic and i really love how smoothe his vocals sound though it. Although i am not completely settle on this setup, i think it would work, andyone see any problems? Thanks again
 
Analytical Man said:
I am thinking of picking up the Antares Vocal Producer, and probably the AT4040- i think that is the model. Khompewtor (Evan K) uses that mic and i really love how smoothe his vocals sound though it.
Click to expand...

Well, sounds like you've got that one taken care of, then.

You should also find out what kind of mic pres Evan K uses. :D Yea . . . I know, I know, your Roland pres are better than the old ones, but I still wouldn't recommend using any of the onboard pres on an all-in-one multitrack recorder. Just call me superstitious.
 
Personally, I'd wait

If you're going to be recording in a different (hopefully significantly better)environment, I'd wait until you try out your setup there first. Your current problem may disappear, or be more pronounced, or you may have an entirely new problem.

Also, a bit of unsolicited advice. If there is a certain singer whose sound your chasing, the equipment they use will be of no real value to you unless your voice sounds very similar to theirs anyway. Maybe they use that mic because the proximity effect makes their naturally thin voice a little 'fuller', or it minimizes their siblance, but you don't have those problems, and using that setup would make your voice boomy and flat-sounding. And then there's the question of all the little processing tricks (EQ, compression, etc.) that were used that you don't know about. I'm not saying don't try it, but make sure you can return them if they don't do the trick for you.

And about the autotune, if you can't do it in your own home studio with no time limit, how are you going to pull it off live?

Good luck, and enjoy that new studio! :)
 
Something else to be careful about...

What do you get when you cross a cheesehead and a metalhead?

A head that plays cheesy metal. :rolleyes:
 
There's a place a few miles from me called "Cheesefoothead" - No kidding.
Just thought I'd add to the conversation.....

Carry on...
 
That's kind of a coincidence.

I just had pizza with cheese on it not too long ago.

And I have a head, currently. And I've tried head cheese and thought it was horrible!

This is just too spooky.
 
sm57 for singing

Probably just me, but I use my condensers to mike my guitar only. I've been singing thru my sm57. For whatever reason, it just sounds better. I sing on key but have a lot of (to me) faintly unpleasant overtones or rasps or something in my voice, and the condensers are either too detailed or I just don't know how to use them. One other thing: probably just me, but I need to relax when I sing, and there's something about holding the sm57 in my hand and just wailing into it that is ... relaxing somehow. Who knows. I like the result. I probably could ahv elearned to mike EVERYTHING with that 57, or maybe 2, and saved some money. Live and learn.

P.s. you guys are killing me with this eq business: I eq the guitar a little, but don't really know what I'm doing; just trimming the treble a little here, trimming the bass of my booming martin d35 there, and just save the result when it sounds right. You guys sound like rocket scientists by comparison.
Maybe i need to go to a clinic.
 
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