Low ceiling????

[RAMI]

How fucked am I with a 6 foot ceiling??? I know it depends on treatment, placement, etc....But, are you pretty much screwed for recording drums with such a low ceiling??? Or are there very effective ways to counter-act that???

I use 4 mics on my drums and don't want to start close micing my toms, etc....

This will help me decide on houses I'm looking at.

Thanx.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Well, I know at least one drummer, one keyboard player and two bass players that couldn't even stand up straight under a 6' ceiling. And that's just on the first page of my cell phone contact list. Never mind sound, how you gonna get musicians down there?

G.

 

[RAMI]

Well, I know at least one drummer, one keyboard player and two bass players that couldn't even stand up straight under a 6' ceiling. And that's just on the first page of my cell phone contact list. Never mind sound, how you gonna get musicians down there?

G.

There won't be any musicians down there. Just a 5'11" drummer.

 

[Daisy]

I say the level of how fucked you are is indirectly proportionate to the amount of space above your head. And directly proportionate to how much your head would hurt if you were to jump up and down on a trampoline.

.

 

[RAMI]

Hehe...OK, so are we not mentioning sound issues because there aren't any??? Or are we just that concerned with me bopping my mellon???

 

[cellardweller]

Yep, I'm in the same boat, except that I'm a 5'11" guitarplayer, and that drum players no longer come over because my neighbors are fuckheads (who call cops).

Just curious, is your ceiling finished?
Drop ceiling?
Bare rafters?

 

[MidiPunk]

I'm stuck with a 7-foot ceiling, have about 8-inches to spare with overheads in this week's sweet spot. Any closer, the stereo image gets borked & I start whacking mics (big drums, 7 piece).
I too use four mic setup, but am a complete noob.

 

[RAMI]

Yep, I'm in the same boat, except that I'm a 5'11" guitarplayer, and that drum players no longer come over because my neighbors are fuckheads (who call cops).

Just curious, is your ceiling finished?
Drop ceiling?
Bare rafters?

Hey Cellar. It's a finished ceiling. I don't know much about building lingo, but it's a solid, finished ceiling. Not those sort of tiles that you can take out.

 

[RAMI]

Any closer, the stereo image gets borked (big drums, 7 piece).

Yeah, that's what I'm worried about. I'd have to experiment with an affective way of getting the overheads as far away from each other as possible.

 

[MidiPunk]

You might do well to scrap tradition & bring overheads out in front of the kit, say ten & two o'clock. I look forward to hearing from the pros.

 

[RAMI]

You might do well to scrap tradition & bring overheads out in front of the kit, say ten & two o'clock.

Funny. Exactly what I was thinking.

I guess my question to the pros would be "Does sound recognize 'up and down'??? Sounds stupid. I guess what I mean is, if I treat the length of the room as if it was the height of the room, would the mics know the difference??? I have a feeling I'm missing something obvious here.

 

[cellardweller]

Are you asking if gravity has any measurable effect on sound waves?

 

[RAMI]

Are you asking if gravity has any measurable effect on sound waves?

Hehe...No. I guess I'm asking if 4 feet AWAY from the drums is the same thing as 4 feet ABOVE the drums.

 

[cellardweller]

Ahh...honestly something I myself wondered...way back when I used to pretend I could play drums.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Hehe...No. I guess I'm asking if 4 feet AWAY from the drums is the same thing as 4 feet ABOVE the drums.

Obviously there are two major differences; the orientation of the mics to the drums, and the orientation of the mics to the closest wall/ceiling.

I use a 3-4 mic setup that I first created for live recording, where the "overheads" are instead rear-facing cardioids in an X/Y or ORTF configuration. But I don't put them 4 feet in front; put them too far in front and the stereo image shrinks too far. I just stick the stand so that the vertical is maybe 6" in front of the front of the kick.

I just use one mike stand that has both a top thread and a seperate adjustable boom arm. I crew a T-adapter mic mount on the top thread to mount the stereo pair and raise those to the height that works for that drummer. If they are too cymbal crazy, I'll raise them halfway between the top of the highst rack tom and the bottom of the lowest cymbal, pointing the mics slightly downward. Then I can just hang the boom arm downward and hang the kick mic on that into the soundhole.

An alternate configuration would be to place the T on the boom and swing it up over the kit with the stereo pair pointing mosly down on you, and then just run the kick mic seperately.

G.

 

[Obi-Wan zenabI]

Preface:

My room is 7'2" (20'x30') I have the ride side OH sort of over the drummer's shoulder, with his head as a sort of gobo between it and the hats. Other is placed on the hats side, aimed at the snare as with the first, and equally distant from the snare and, as much as I can manage, the bass. I move it around a little until the distance from the hats is cool and the sound balances. MXL 604's, with the cardio capsules. Jazz kit. Great drummer from the old school.

I'm happy with my drum sound. www.waterfrontjazzproject.com/songs

I have a bunch more panels of 703 on hand, and the next step is to make a cloud for over the drums, hopefully making the ceiling reflections disappear. I won't use omni's until I do that. The rest of the room is treated, but pretty live. I am concerned about shortening the standing room to 7" or less, but no one is going to be standign and playing.

At 6 feet, though, you can really barely afford to lose any height for a cloud, but I think it'd be necessary-- reflection points are the issue no matter what you're doing.

Moreover, RAMI, I tend to think that the most productive and creative and regularly used spaces are those that are nice to be in. Well lit and clean studios are refreshing places to be, and make this an enjoyable hobby. A cave won't be fun to be in, and won't draw the best performances out of you or your drummers. Good luck!

 

[RAMI]

Obviously there are two major differences; the orientation of the mics to the drums, and the orientation of the mics to the closest wall/ceiling.

I use a 3-4 mic setup that I first created for live recording, where the "overheads" are instead rear-facing cardioids in an X/Y or ORTF configuration. But I don't put them 4 feet in front; put them too far in front and the stereo image shrinks too far. I just stick the stand so that the vertical is maybe 6" in front of the front of the kick.

I just use one mike stand that has both a top thread and a seperate adjustable boom arm. I crew a T-adapter mic mount on the top thread to mount the stereo pair and raise those to the height that works for that drummer. If they are too cymbal crazy, I'll raise them halfway between the top of the highst rack tom and the bottom of the lowest cymbal, pointing the mics slightly downward. Then I can just hang the boom arm downward and hang the kick mic on that into the soundhole.

An alternate configuration would be to place the T on the boom and swing it up over the kit with the stereo pair pointing mosly down on you, and then just run the kick mic seperately.

G.

Thanx for the help, Glen. That makes sense.

I guess you can't really treat the length of the room as though it was the height of the room without then considering the height of the room to be the length of the room. So it would be the same thing as having a higher ceiling in a room only 6 foot long. I'm trading one for the other, like flipping a box.

 

[RAMI]

At 6 feet, though, you can really barely afford to lose any height for a cloud, but I think it'd be necessary-- reflection points are the issue no matter what you're doing.

Moreover, RAMI, I tend to think that the most productive and creative and regularly used spaces are those that are nice to be in. Well lit and clean studios are refreshing places to be, and make this an enjoyable hobby. A cave won't be fun to be in, and won't draw the best performances out of you or your drummers. Good luck!

2 great points there. Especially the second one. I did consider that. It's a nice room with nice lighting. But I can see myself, in a few months, getting sick of feeling claustrophobic. (sp?)

 

[CoolCat]

damn Rami..you have some of the best HR recordings I've heard..especially in the drum area? why are you asking if it will work..

are you moving to a new location or something?

 

[RAMI]

damn Rami..you have some of the best HR recordings I've heard..especially in the drum area? why are you asking if it will work..

are you moving to a new location or something?

Thanx alot, CoolCat. Yes, we're moving in the next few months. Shopping around right now. I don't think I'm going to move into a place with such a low ceiling after all. I can see myself regretting that.