"Lost Dreams"

[JohnnyAmato]

Another short recording from a few years ago that I just re-did the drums for, and re-mixed.

Worked on the mix for two nights, time to take a break on it. Used a little more reverb than I normally do, as the mix was a little more open than the last few I worked on. Hopefully I didn't over-do it, hard to tell.

'97 Jeff Beck Strat on all the tracks on this one.

Any thoughts on the mix, anything stand out as off?

Lost Dreams (Demo) | Johnny Amato

 

[seeking]

I dont give comments to professionals musicians.........(read envious)

-einar-

 

[Robus]

Good playing as always Johnny. I'm not hearing much that is obviously wrong with this, but there is something lacking in the energy level. The more atmospheric parts with the kick drum sound great. It's in the more rocking parts where I'm noticing just a lack of intensity. Perhaps it's in the relationship between the bass, drums, and rhythm guitars. Not quite driving and pumping together as they should. Hopefully andrushkiwt will chime in. Something he does very well is side chain compression on his drums and other rhythm instruments to get them pulsing together. Might help here. The lead guitar level seems inconsistent. I'm hearing phrases in the guitar solo that drop out a little, level wise. I'm not sure, but I'm wondering if it has something to do with the getting the levels balanced between the parts where two guitars are playing harmonized lines, and other parts where it is the single lead guitar. Maybe the latter needs to come up? I'm not sure, just a thought.

 

[JohnnyAmato]

Thanks Robus, great info.

There's no compression at all in the mix, literally none. So it probably does need some. As much as I've been learning lately about mixing, compression is still something I don't have a complete handle on. The rhythm guitars and even the bass for the heavier parts are on their own tracks, so it shouldn't be too difficult to experiment with some side chain compression with those. I've never used it before, so no time like the present. Not sure exactly what I'll be shooting for, I'll just have to experiment.

And good ear, I too was noticing that there are some spots where it seems the lead drops a tad in level. Some sections of the same lead even seem to drop a hair for some reason. I left it alone because I know it was all tracked at the same level, so I wasn't sure if my ears were playing tricks on me or what. I'll try to isolate the few spots where it happens, and try to even it out.

Thanks a bunch, as I always respect your input.

 

[Nola]

Johnny, I don't think you need side chain compression. Regular compression should be fine. The bass is just poking out here and there, so like a mild -3db compression with something like a 3:1 or 4:1 ratio should fix that. Once the level is smooth, you can turn it up more to match the kick (or you can turn the kick down, whichever works). The kick is loud but it doesn't have a lot of meat -- seems like 200-300hz was notched out too much or too high a hpf. Most kicks sound good with hp around 40 and -4db cut between 200-300hz. It's a good starting point, imo, but mess with that to get some meat back on it instead of just volume. If you or the sample creator didn't notch those areas, maybe add a bell curve boost somewhere to see if you can add some meat without messing up the sound. You'll just have to sweep around to find where the meat/body is lacking.

The mix is pretty loud, so there must be compression (a limiter) on the master bus, no? If so, it might be causing some problems since the tracks themselves had no compression.

You're not far off with it. Just a few simple EQ and compression moves should finish it and keep the organic vibe.

 

[TripleM]

Some crunch rhythm guitars. Nice. They sounded good.

Very good guitar playing again.

A lot of reverb on things. If you're going for an 80's hair-metal sound, you got it. To me, your style should be straight ahead rock. But that's just me.

 

[JohnnyAmato]

Thanks for the listen, TripleM. I actually kind of was going for a slight 80's metal sound with this one, still might have overdone the reverb though.

Nola, going to mess with compressing just the bass itself first. If it doesn't work well, will try side-chaining with the kick. Will get back to the mix shortly, just giving it a few days break.

And yes, the mix as a whole is compressed with a preset in SoundForge, "Smooth Compression". Gives me a nice volume boost without changing the sound of the mix, at least not that I could ever tell. Been using it for years.


Thanks for the suggestions. I'm going to look at that kick EQ as well.

 

[andrushkiwt]

Hopefully andrushkiwt will chime in. Something he does very well is side chain compression on his drums and other rhythm instruments to get them pulsing together.

Hey thanks Ray. I don't do sidechain compression, unless you mean the less-frequently used meaning of the term where you roll off certain frequencies on the compressor so it doesn't react to them. But I don't use it to "duck" one thing under another. Each bus has its own compressor and then one master compressor, for me.

Nevertheless, I do hear what Ray means in the lack of energy. Reading through the posts, it might just be the lack of compression on individual channels. I start the mix, usually, with only kick and bass and work those for awhile until I'm feeling them groove so nicely together that I end up wanting to re-track the song to include a bass/kick-only section. kidding, kinda. But if you can get those two working together well, you're on a good track. I'll cut the kick where it's muddy/flubby and the bass in the frequencies it wants to really pop out at. I aggressively compress bass - usually around 6:1 with 7-8 db GR and the kick around 4:1 with only 3-4 GR. But, I'll work the kick and bass alone until they sound good together.

Really, that's where I'd start with this because I do hear a general lack of oophm in the heavy sections. Solo your kick and bass and see how they sound together. Then bring in your snare to complete the basic groove of the track. Not really much else needs tweaking, to my ears. And really, the whole thing could be fine as it is. Personal preference at this point, in my opinion.

 

[JohnnyAmato]

Thanks andru for the input. I'll be messing with this tune again shortly, I'll see if I can get that bass and kick pumping better. I should have another mix up in a day or so.

Thanks.

 

[JohnnyAmato]

Put up a new mix in the OP and also in this post just to make it easy.

Worked with compressing the bass, kick, and snare, and tried to even out the lead guitar volume as best I could, was tricky actually. Didn't spend too much time, as I'm currently working on about 8 tunes all at once

Trying to address the comments about the energy of the heavier part between the bass and the kick, hoping I'm making some progress.

Also put a compressor/limiter on the master bus, the Maxim Limiter (Mixing Limiter preset)

Lost Dreams (Demo) | Johnny Amato

 

[Robus]

It does sound more energetic.

 

[JohnnyAmato]

Thanks Robus, good to hear I'm on the right track then.

 

[Nola]

Hey Johnny, kick sounds better (from what I remember), but now it sounds out in front of the guitars/not in the same space. I can't remember if the last mix had that. It still could use more meat on it, too. What are the compression attack/release settings? Experiment with a longer release to give it more body.
Also, do you EQ your reverbs/delays? There is a bit of what sounds like ambient buildup, and that's usually the result of not EQing those effects.

 

[JohnnyAmato]

Thanks Nola, I'll check out that kick a little more.

No, I didn't EQ the reverb at all. I probably need to filter some low-end off?