Live 'staying in tune' problems *grrrrr*

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TheRockDoc

TheRockDoc

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let's just say the band is not excited about my little 'problem'

several culprits- Ibanez SG (lawsuit era)/Bigsby type , Agile SG no trem, Dean V-X no trem, all having the same issues- even one bend or wank, and the G-string goes 'boing' and the the entire high end shifts (B and E strings). I am c o n s t a n t l y needing to hit the strobe pedal (peterson) and retune- like every friggin song and feel like I am a rookie

No- they are not happy at all, and neither am I...:rolleyes:

I keep the humidifier on 40-45% all the time and/or keep them in the cases. How the h&*@ am I going to gig when every figgin guitar loses it's tuning every friggin song?

gggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

can someone offer some sage advice?

TRD
 
Sell them all and buy one that stays in tune?

Not trying to be an ass, just a suggestion.
 
Amp up > picking hand down!

It takes a while to get used to playing softly, I like to destroy, but it works.
 
new tuners maybe? possibly a locking nut? i dont have much experience with the locking nut but maybe it'll help. unless it's a problem with the bridge...hmmmmm....maybe experiment with different string types. i have a cheap-o tele copy that had problems staying in tune and i just changed strings from slinkies to elixers and it helped quite a bit. maybe try that out. sorry i'm not too helpful, just typing out ideas ;):rolleyes:
 
Also, if you haven't already, make sure you stretch the hell out of the strings when you put them on new.
 
Three guitars, same tuning issue with them all? Sounds like one of two things to me, bad strings or bad handling of the guitars. Try new strings, maybe a slightly heavier gauge, and stretch them really well (tune up, stretch the hell out of the strings, repeat until they stay in tune after stretching.) I used to have lots of tuning problems until I tossed the extra light strings and started using heavier strings. Old strings don't stay in tune as well as newer ones, especially if you play hard. Rough handling, playing hard enough to bend or twist the necks or loose neck joints could be the problem too.
 
I'd take the Dean, buy FAT GHS strings, like, .10 or .11 gauge. Remove the old strings, check if the bridge is OK, then the plastic nut-is that all clear and do the strings sink all the way to bottom. Put on new strings, pulling the string taut, only wrap one whole or less to the peg and wind to tune, maybe a tad higher. repeat to all strings.

then before tuning, I yank the strings upwards, away from guitar as much as they give in (some 10cm), 3-5 times, from 3 points, near bridge, in the middle and near headstock-retune -yank again -retune -yank again until the tuning stays after yanking on that string. -->next string.

takes almost a half an hour, but I never have to tune while playing, and I play hard enough to break strings once in a while. Same for bass.

-Set neck, no whammy bar.
-thick strings
-At most, three or four windings on the tunerhead, when tuned.
-yank the hell out of each string when new.

If is still out of tune, check your personal history, you gotta be hexed, voodooed or jinxed by someone.
 
Aside from the other things mentioned:

Loose tuners will slip this way. But I'd be surprised to see that on all three guitars.

I hear if you wrap the strings around the tuners a bazillion times instead of just two or three, you'll get this kind of trouble, as it's got too much room to keep tightening up around the tuner shaft.

The strings could also be binding at the nut. I'd be particularly suspicious of this one if you recently switched to heavier gauge strings or went from a plain G to a wound one. You could have a similar problem on the Bigsby type at the saddle.
 
And always tune up, never down. If you find you're sharp, detune below the note, then bring it back up to pitch.
 
If you're not using locking nuts on those guitars, use graphite or any kind of nut lubricant in the nut slots.
 
three choices.....

1. get a real guitar.....or.....

2. pay a good luthier over and over.....or....


3. get a real guitar AND pay a good luthier once.
 
Tuning machines work exactly like an adjustable wrench. They can't slip without jumping teeth, which you'd notice right away, and would require the tuner to basically have been destroyed by violence.
 
ermghoti said:
Tuning machines work exactly like an adjustable wrench. They can't slip without jumping teeth, which you'd notice right away, and would require the tuner to basically have been destroyed by violence.
Click to expand...

+1. Anyone who has ever taken one apart knows that even cheap tuners can't "slip". You can't turn the worm gear by rotating the pinion, and the peg itself is clocked into the pinion with a D shaped shaft. If you rounded the corners of the D enough it could slip, I guess, but then you could never even get close to pitch.

Hearing the "boing" when he bends the G string and then it's out of tune sounds like a wound G string binding in the nut to me.
 
danw said:
I hear if you wrap the strings around the tuners a bazillion times instead of just two or three, you'll get this kind of trouble, as it's got too much room to keep tightening up around the tuner shaft.
Click to expand...

wow, i never would have thought of that!
 
i'm not really a guitar tech, but...

poor string installation, anyone?

make sure you install your new strings properly, with a nice locking knot - new tuners not necessary.

for bigsby - a roller bridge is nice, also a "slip stone" (delrine) nut - I have installed both on my REALLY CHEAP guitar after I installed bigsby - it stays in tune from practice to practice, and I use vibrato all the time and do string bends.

Selling your guitars is too rash, if they sound/play well. To every guitar problem there's a mechanical solution.
 
By "loose tuners" what I was referring to was the actual tuner shaft not being as tight as it should be in the peghead. The little screws that hold them in place can back out, and I've seen those press-in bushings back out on the front. I thought a guy posted something about that here a few months ago, but I can't find it on search. I recall that he never noticed it with tension on the strings, but once he took them off, the tuners were just rattling in the headstock. I wouldn't expect that unless the guitars in question were pretty old, though.
 
A couple of things jump out from your original post.

I am c o n s t a n t l y needing to hit the strobe pedal (peterson) and retune- like every friggin song and feel like I am a rookie
Click to expand...

Are you expecting to get too much from the tuning of your guitar? I'm not being patronising here, it's just that there is a cathartic moment in most musicians lives when they get to understand the truth about intonation. If your not sure what that means. Shout and we'll stick some links up.

Second from a setup perspective the most likely cause of the problem you describe is the nut sticking. After that the saddle, after that the trem, after that the body/neck joint integrity. Strings and tuners are rarely if ever the issue.

As it's happening on more than one guitar. First look to your understanding of how a guitar can be tuned and after that the nut. If you still have issues we'll need more specifics.
 
Gear_Junky said:
i'm not really a guitar tech, but...

poor string installation, anyone?

make sure you install your new strings properly, with a nice locking knot - new tuners not necessary.
Click to expand...

I never put a knot in my strings when I install them. I tried it once and it didn't do anything but make the old strings a bitch to get off when it was time to change them.

I have regular old stock tuners on all my guitars; I just put the strings through them (or down into them, in the case of my Strat) and put a few wraps around the pegs, and they don't slip.
 
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