Latency/Drift $50 reward for fix

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purplepeople

Member
Hi, a couple weeks back, Windows automatically updated some drivers on my Win 7 machine and a ton of latency issues have sprung up.
I have an M-Audio 192/4 and Audition 1.5.
Before this update, I didn't have any issues. I reinstalled Windows thinking it would solve the issue. It didn't....
It might have actually made it worse.

Essentially, everything sounds correct for two bars, and then everything else is offbeat/drifts.
I have the drift box checked so you'd think it'd fix it, but it doesn't. Also start sync.
So at this point, my only option is to record line by line......
Which I've been doing, but it's taking me 10+ hours to create a song like this compared to like 1-2...
I've noticed that if I save/closeout of Audition every once in awhile the latency seems lower.....
It also seems latency gets worse the more I record....
Meaning latency is lowest when I start a new project. Once I've recorded around 50 files the issue is really obvious....
Maybe the temporary folder needs deleted every so often? If so, do I have to manually do that?
Any ideas on things I can try?
My computer is more than fast enough to handle the highest settings. Is there anything I can change?
 
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Bird Garden Audio said:
First to try is reducing buffer or latency size. Go to preferences then Audio Hardware. Under the Device Class drop box you can choose ASIO or MME. If using ASIO you will have a set I/O Buffer Size option. If Using MME you will have a set latency option. (See pictures attached). Which ever you are using make the number as small as you can without creating audio dropouts on playback.

Device Class MME:
aivXI.png



Device Class ASIO:
cROaS.png
Click to expand...
Thanks, but I have version 1.5. Meaning it doesn't use ASIO drivers....
I hate the layout of version 2+.
My M-audio device has it owns little ASIO program. I have it set to the lowest latency.
If this program isn't open, the latency is much worse. Like an entire second off.
I'm unsure if my latency issue is an Audition problem or Windows.
Sometimes the M-Audio program auto closes randomly...
It feels like Windows or Audition isn't recognizing the audio device program correctly.....
But everything worked fine before the Windows update problem. Like I could do a full 16 bars without noticing any latency.
I tried to uninstall my M-audio device and attempt to install the previous driver 1.03, but Windows doesn't find it.
I presume Windows is blocking due to age or something...
If I start a brand new project, the latency is minimal. Meaning I can record maybe 4-8 bars before I hear an issue.
But after recording maybe 30-50 tracks, the latency gets progressively worse. Like every 5 or so tracks recorded, the latency increases.
By the time I'm halfway through the track, it gets impossible to record anything onbeat unless I record line by line.
This makes me think that Audition/Windows is somehow getting bottlenecked.
I have 64 gigs of ram.... Where does Audition save the audio files to? The temporary folder or RAM?
Is there somewhere for me to select where? I presume my RAM would be quicker than the hard drive?
If I save all of my files, closeout, and reopen it helps some....
When first running Audition with "correct drift" on it'll correct the recording.
Same if I reopen the program....
But after the first one, it doesn't appear to make the same adjustments. So it's almost as if it stops working/doing anything.
Shouldn't it remeasure every time?
I experimented with turning drift/start sync off, but it made the latency worse.
The next time I'm on the computer I'm going to uninstall my network/Bluetooth drivers and see if that magically helps.
I've tried running Latencymon to measure if my system has a problem. I only get 1-2 green dots and it says my system has minimal latency.
Is there anything in a computers BIOS that could cause issues?
I guess I could try a normal USB port instead of 2.0 to see if there is a difference.
 
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Latency and drift are different things. Latency is a consistent offset (like a delay). Drift is an offset that increases over time. Latency in monitoring can be reduced by decreasing buffer size or using a direct monitor function. Latency between recorded tracks can be fixed with a setting in the DAW (though it's usually detected and corrected by the DAW). Drift typically results from a clocking mismatch, but that happens when two inputs are recorded at the same time through different converters, or when the record sample rate doesn't match the playback sample rate.
 
I switched to Reaper just after Audition 2 came out and haven't really looked back. I seem to remember having sync problems with overdubs with Audition which disappeared completely with Reaper. I found the transition from Audition to Reaper to be relatively painless.
 
bouldersoundguy said:
Latency and drift are different things. Latency is a consistent offset (like a delay). Drift is an offset that increases over time. Latency in monitoring can be reduced by decreasing buffer size or using a direct monitor function. Latency between recorded tracks can be fixed with a setting in the DAW (though it's usually detected and corrected by the DAW). Drift typically results from a clocking mismatch, but that happens when two inputs are recorded at the same time through different converters, or when the record sample rate doesn't match the playback sample rate.
Click to expand...
Clocking mismatch? How does one fix that? All my files are 44100.
It's not always a drift. Sometimes it's off at the very beginning too.
The latency is fine for first 30-50 tracks/takes. But after that, it progressively gets worse.
I'm confused what exactly changes a couple hours in.....
If I closeout of the program and reopen, it'll fix it for another 10 or so takes...
I think it has something to do with how the program stores the audio files before they are saved.
 
jamesperrett said:
I switched to Reaper just after Audition 2 came out and haven't really looked back. I seem to remember having sync problems with overdubs with Audition which disappeared completely with Reaper. I found the transition from Audition to Reaper to be relatively painless.
Click to expand...
I might give it a try. I see it has a free 60 day trial.
But will it accept my Audition sessions?
 
In Audition 1.5 it allows you to select a temporary save folder....
Should this number be large or small?
Maybe my folder size is too big and because of this, it isn't saving the files properly and it's bogging down my system?
Or it's saving way too many files.
And this is why it appears to start working again after I close the program? Because it's emptying the temporary folder?
 
purplepeople said:
Clocking mismatch? How does one fix that? All my files are 44100.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I left out some details in my post. A clocking mismatch would be from using two different interfaces at once. If their clocks aren't synced, they can run at slightly different speeds and the resulting tracks can drift. I don't think that's your problem, I just brought it up to give an idea of known issues.
 
purplepeople said:
I might give it a try. I see it has a free 60 day trial.
But will it accept my Audition sessions?
Click to expand...
Unfortunately it won't directly. You can either export all the individual tracks in your Audition session and then import them into Reaper or you could use a program called AATranslator to translate from Audition sessions to Reaper sessions. Unfortunately AATranslator isn't free. If you only have a few sessions to translate then I'd be happy to run them through my copy of AATranslator.
 
I would try all of the following: Turn graphics acceleration totally off. Don't let windows decide performance. Click the "adjust for best performance" option in settings. Set Audition's compatibility to your previous OS. Also, use a different drive than whatever drive your os and programs are running on.
 
purplepeople said:
Hi, a couple weeks back, Windows automatically updated some drivers on my Win 7 machine and a ton of latency issues have sprung up.
I have an M-Audio 192/4 and Audition 1.5.
Before this update, I didn't have any issues. I reinstalled Windows thinking it would solve the issue. It didn't....
It might have actually made it worse.

Essentially, everything sounds correct for two bars, and then everything else is offbeat/drifts.
I have the drift box checked so you'd think it'd fix it, but it doesn't. Also start sync.
So at this point, my only option is to record line by line......
Which I've been doing, but it's taking me 10+ hours to create a song like this compared to like 1-2...
I've noticed that if I save/closeout of Audition every once in awhile the latency seems lower.....
It also seems latency gets worse the more I record....
Meaning latency is lowest when I start a new project. Once I've recorded around 50 files the issue is really obvious....
Maybe the temporary folder needs deleted every so often? If so, do I have to manually do that?
Any ideas on things I can try?
My computer is more than fast enough to handle the highest settings. Is there anything I can change?
Click to expand...
Yes if it’s drifting out sync as bad as you say - your Wordclock or the Internal Clock is off - something is pushing it - you just have to find out.

Now I’ve got to ask - is all your software legal? Not any cracks of anything? I mean anything - not just audio.
 
Thanks for the replies. I seem to have figured out a work around.

First, it appears if my beat/instrumentals are in the same bit depth as my vocals, the lag is less.
For instance, if the beat is 32 bit, then the vocals need to be 32 bit.
The song I was having the biggest issues with was 16 bit on the beat and 32 bits on vocals.

2nd, in Audition there is the box to fix drift... But it doesn't work every time....
So if I record a vocal and then decide it's not good enough, I have to remove the clip instead of re-recording over the space.
If I just re-record over the same clip, it doesn't correct the drift on the additional clips.
Also, drift doesn't work unless the clip is around 10 seconds long. Meaning, if what I'm recording is less than that, then I need to let it continue to record before it'll auto correct the drift.

Also, have to save all of my files and close the project each verse... If not, the latency is there no matter what I do. Closing/reopening seems to fix it at least long enough for me to record a new verse/chorus. I have a feeling Audition 1.5 is limited on the amount of files it can properly run/store without a permanent save.

I experimented with Reaper. It gets rid of the latency. I'm just not a huge fan of the program. Ultimately I might switch over. Just hate to do that 20 songs into a project.

Yes, I'm using an authentic version of Audition 1.5. No plug-ins installed.
The only difference between now, and when everything worked properly is my different version of Windows.
I was still using the OS that came with the computer without updates.
Now I'm using a more updated copy.
Years ago I had a similar problem, and it turned out Auto-tune was causing the latency. It's not the case this time.
I think it's just something screwy with a Windows update or driver update on my interface.
Like the ASIO drivers aren't properly compatible/working.
 
Just to clarify, is everything going through the M-Audio interface, including playback? Do sample rates match for everything, from interface to samples to session?

Going out of sync over a few measures sounds more like sample rate mismatch than a clocking error. Or it could be dropping massive amounts of data.
 
bouldersoundguy said:
Just to clarify, is everything going through the M-Audio interface, including playback? Do sample rates match for everything, from interface to samples to session?

Going out of sync over a few measures sounds more like sample rate mismatch than a clocking error. Or it could be dropping massive amounts of data.
Click to expand...
The newest driver/m-audio program doesn't allow you to select bit depth or sample rate. Just buffer/latency, but it states it's running in 44100 and the bit depth default is 24.
In Audition, my session is 44100 and the only options are 16 bit or 32 bit for recording/mixng. I have 32 bit recording/mixing selected. According to what I've read, Audition 1.5 doesn't record in 32 bit. Instead it defaults to 24 when 32 bit is selected.
Until posting on this forum, I had 16 bit selected. It appears 32 has less latency.
Which is backwards from everything I've ever been told.
It's just really weird to me that things work perfectly fine for the first verse/chorus. It's only after I've recorded 30-50 tracks that the latency starts acting up.
On the song I made a couple days ago, the latency didn't start happening until the 3rd verse. Once I saved everything and re-opened Audition & the M-Audio program the latency was much better. I almost wonder if somehow Windows is disabling/forcing shutdown of the M-audio program/driver at random. Like it's supposed to always be active. Sometimes it randomly closes itself. In system services, I have it set to autorun. I'm not sure how/why it's randomly closing itself.
 
I suspect the problem is using recently updated drivers with 20 year old software on an OS that's 4 years past extended support. It's just not reasonable to expect stable operation. Sorry.
 
purplepeople said:
I almost wonder if somehow Windows is disabling/forcing shutdown of the M-audio program/driver at random. Like it's supposed to always be active. Sometimes it randomly closes itself. In system services, I have it set to autorun. I'm not sure how/why it's randomly closing itself.
Click to expand...
windows sound system is overriding it. But check the system log to see if there is a hardware fault involved.
I stop using windows 7 when they started screwing with the OS with updates. I switched to Windows Server for my DAWs. The advantage of that is the windows audio modules are not installed so they never get in the way.Plus everything runs faster and more smoothly. I picked up a single license from the gamer's outlet at a cheap price. https://www.gamers-outlet.net/en/buy-microsoft-windows-server-standard-2022
 
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