kick mine

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jeffmaher

jeffmaher

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http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=825703&content=music

"nambypamby...."

A working project. No flash. Just trying to get good sounds. Everything as recorded, dry, no EQ. All panned between 66% of ctr. Master: Light compression. 1.8/-12 ..and a little large room mastering verb, and track-mashing w/ hard limiter...just the tippy-tops, here and there. A support for a vocal thing. Now you can kick my arse.

Thinking of Cookie Monster vox. :^)
 
Pretty nice.

The only thing that stuck out to me was the "drums". They're very robotic, like you have no accents or dynamics at all. All the hits seem to be the exact same volume. It's expecially noticeable on the "ride cymbal". Another thing is, you have hi-hat and ride cymbal playing at the same time. That would never happen from a real drummer.

Everything esle sounds pretty nice.
 
I'm not a good drummer..I played those parts on an electronic kit...but I have crappy touch...kept nailing 127 on the snare hits. To lazy to set the sensitivity. I need a real kit. Gonna need a platform that can quantize audio tracks. :^)

But the ride....I replaced the original ride data, and kept an eye on the velocity graph....I think they varied a lot????? I'll check it! TX

The HH is playing 'sock' closings on 2&4 of the bridge, and 4/4 on the outtro. Good drummers do that. Right? Maybe the sample is just too hit-like?

Going back to listen to where you direct me....TX
 
Ah yes, you may be right about the "foot" hi-hats. But they do sound like "hits" to me. See if you can get a softer hi-hat sound for that.

I find the most telling sign of programmed drums is the lack of varying velocity on the ride/hi-hat during a beat. I used to program drums when I couldn't record the real thing (living in an apartment, etc....) and took a lot of time to make sure that I (usually) made the 1,2,3,4 a lot louder than the "&'s", if you know what I mean. You might have done that on your ride, but it still seemed to be a little mechanical. Maybe try a larger difference in velocity between the loud hits (1,2,3,4), and the softer hits "&".

The drum sound itself is pretty good. Just needs a bit more of a human touch.
 
Roger that. I listened to your drums. Gonna try to model as close as possible to your sounds on the kit...and steal some of your accents and fills..... I gotta get it right. TX
 
I'm not a good drummer..I played those parts on an electronic kit..

Considering those 2 factors, it's a pretty damn good job you did. It's certainly not a BAD drum track by any stretch of the imagination.
 
This is very nice.

Has a nice Tempted by a Fruit of Another vibe to it. Production is superclean, and it punches nicely. Mix sounds very balanced. I would love to hear some vocals, but it's nice and chill as is.
 
Yeah I agree with Rami. The drums sound robotic. It's a nice song, and the mix is good, but the whole thing seems kind of like........well......one of those demo songs that comes on a cheap Casio keyboard. I don't know if maybe it's because it lacks vocals or just lacks the finishing touches, but it sounds kind of...cheesey. Sorry man. I'm really not trying to be harsh or anything. It's just that none of it really sounds natural at all. Maybe it's the robot drums, but it seems like a bunch of MIDI instruments. :o
 
Workin' on it. Modeled the Rami drum sound. And I think I approached some of that real-sound...how close is not clear...the tunings are different...but the character is closer.....but it seems to be a stock formula with my samples: drop the upper mids, boost the low mids, and put a slap spike at about 2k. Softer hats...and added some sloppy snare and tom figures.

I ended up re-recording the midi to audio tracks...and used the volume knob to fudge velocities....quicker than doing it in midi. I'm sure there's a way to gang-select certain notes and apply velocity changes.....

You tell it like it is, Greg. You were the first guy to help me out here. And I respect your opinion. You are really good at playing and recording. Not my thing, but the best of it's type.

I have to be careful not to make this thing too busy or show-casey. It's production music for voice-over. But a little more steam would be nice. I think the new bass part will go a long way to making it move better. Post when I get the temp up. TX!
 
This is very nice.

Has a nice Tempted by a Fruit of Another vibe to it. Production is superclean, and it punches nicely. Mix sounds very balanced. I would love to hear some vocals, but it's nice and chill as is.

I was listening to Tower of Power...and tried to get that stain on the drums. But Squeeze was a model, too. And the vocal in straight Michael McDonald....with huge harmony parts...real big..which is another reason it's laid back...aside from being a sad song about heartbreak.

I'm re-doing the rooty bass to include a lot more pedalling on thirds and fifths...just like "Tempted", actually! The B3 part is , like, a direct theft. :^)

Workin' it....TX
 
If this is bed music for a voice over then you've done really well. If it's the rythm track for a song with vocals there needs to be a few changes. It is a bit too "MIDI-ish" for my tastes, but the clean, Straty guitar part is excellent. Cool little spiky fills and good tone. I like the drums save for the ride cymbal sample; it just jumps out of the left speaker and sounds harsh. Very clean recording though and nice and punchy.:)
 
sure....cookie monster:D
Recording sounds crystal clear to me. Of course Greg and Rami know what they're talking about regarding drums. But real nice tune.

Joey :):):):)
 
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=825703&content=music

Under correct title: "When Your Heart Breaks".

New mix and other stuff. I think this qualifies as a done instrumental version...if it works on monitors tomorrow. And if you don't draw my ear to too much suckworthiness....

Compressed electric. Drunk drummer..manual mode. New bass part. Strings gone. Two electric R&L for big finich..and a leetle acoustic thingy in the breakdown. Headphone mix...check it tomorrow.

RAMI...the tone of the drums after modeling didn't work a lot with the mix...sounded dull because of the rest of the tune...so I went back to original kick and snr. Not the right mix for your kit...or I didn't get the sweetness I thought I had.
 
Tempted is a good ref point - it has a languid feel back from the beat where as this current is a politely machine perfect feel.
For the given task there's no prob at all but if you were making a pice eof listen to me music there'd be a need for a bit more playing around the beat from the lead instruments.
It's very nicely done though.
I can't get any part of my head around Midi!
 
I just went to an mp3 downwload site and listened to 30 seconds of "Tempted". Thanks for the spark. The record is brighter 1k to 8k, roughly; but that groove is simpler than mine! And there are strings, too! [an octave higher than the ones I triad and discarded..note to self] If it were a stand-alone listening instrumental, I'd get a 335 and do a Larry Carlton treatment. But the thing is meant for vox support and voice-over.

Everytime I hear somebody say MIDI is not with it, I think about Leo Fender and Les Paul with their abominatious e-lectric guitars. At least half of what you hear on pop radio , TV, movies, radio, etc, is midi construction. Albeit gigabyte samples, supercomputers and dreamworks-soundcards... and more expertise than I have. And, honestly, when I listen to Dave Garabaldi, eg, it's as tight as any midi groove.....with artful flex and superior imagination. The flex/imagination is the tough thing...but there are programmers who can get it. I'll get there, or die trying. [Dave, et al, are metronomic...and usually play to one on the records they do]

I can't afford to go spend a few grand on a kit, mics and all that jazz. And that's just drums. Add a good piano. CRAZY!!! And who can afford, at this level, to pay players to do your tracks?

One recordist I know personally got a few gold records hangin' on his basemant wall. All midi...except for the voices. Another bud is pullin' tens of thousands on garage rock creations. All direct-in and midi. He's a drummer, and he uses pads. You have heard him on TV.

I'm not making radio play wonders. Just workin' music. Using what I have, and trying to get the best out of it. 98% of the humans not recording in their basements [and probably half of the guys on this forum...including me] can't tell the diff. [I can't tell a Bud light from a Heinekin..] And, just like electric guitars and pianos, I believe midi is just another vehicle in an artist's hands. It's OK that it sounds like what it is, sometimes, I think.

I mean, RAMI said he listens to hits on the ride and variations on the snare to figure out if he's listening to the real thing.....before he even allows the music to get past the filter, seemingly....as if all ideas and constructions not using real cans are automatically bereft of merit, whatsoever! [my take from context...reserve the right to err]

I hear some 'real' drum tracks on posted tunes about which the 'real deal' clan rave. Occasionally, they really suck. Sound awful, and unlike anything I ever heard on a professionally recorded tune. I think you guys get stuck sometimes. But that's just my opinion. I still love yoos. And appreciate the advice n' stuff.

Now, there's nothing I love more than hearing a real upright, well-tuned cans with a big rivet ride, and a Steinway....with some smokin' jazzers playing them...live, or on a good record [Les McCann at the Bohemian Caverns comes to mind.] But there's music in other things, and vehicles of expression. Malmsteen just wouldn't sound the same on nylon. He should be using gut, anyway... :^)

2c. [I have less than $5,000 invested in my 'studio'. I think I'm doin' OK!]

ps...all the guitars and bass guitar are real.
 
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I mean, RAMI said he listens to hits on the ride and variations on the snare to figure out if he's listening to the real thing.....before he even allows the music to get past the filter, seemingly...

Um....no.........I don't listen to anything to figure out if the drums sound real. Either the drums sound real or they don't. And if they don't, it could be for a number of reasons. In your case, it was because all the hits were very un-dynamic, which made the track sound robotic. I didn't "listen for it". It just popped out at me.
 
I just went to an mp3 downwload site and listened to 30 seconds of "Tempted". Thanks for the spark. The record is brighter 1k to 8k, roughly; but that groove is simpler than mine! And there are strings, too! [an octave higher than the ones I triad and discarded..note to self] If it were a stand-alone listening instrumental, I'd get a 335 and do a Larry Carlton treatment. But the thing is meant for vox support and voice-over.

Everytime I hear somebody say MIDI is not with it, I think about Leo Fender and Les Paul with their abominatious e-lectric guitars. At least half of what you hear on pop radio , TV, movies, radio, etc, is midi construction. Albeit gigabyte samples, supercomputers and dreamworks-soundcards... and more expertise than I have. And, honestly, when I listen to Dave Garabaldi, eg, it's as tight as any midi groove.....with artful flex and superior imagination. The flex/imagination is the tough thing...but there are programmers who can get it. I'll get there, or die trying. [Dave, et al, are metronomic...and usually play to one on the records they do]

I can't afford to go spend a few grand on a kit, mics and all that jazz. And that's just drums. Add a good piano. CRAZY!!! And who can afford, at this level, to pay players to do your tracks?

One recordist I know personally got a few gold records hangin' on his basemant wall. All midi...except for the voices. Another bud is pullin' tens of thousands on garage rock creations. All direct-in and midi. He's a drummer, and he uses pads. You have heard him on TV.

I'm not making radio play wonders. Just workin' music. Using what I have, and trying to get the best out of it. 98% of the humans not recording in their basements [and probably half of the guys on this forum...including me] can't tell the diff. [I can't tell a Bud light from a Heinekin..] And, just like electric guitars and pianos, I believe midi is just another vehicle in an artist's hands. It's OK that it sounds like what it is, sometimes, I think.

I mean, RAMI said he listens to hits on the ride and variations on the snare to figure out if he's listening to the real thing.....before he even allows the music to get past the filter, seemingly....as if all ideas and constructions not using real cans are automatically bereft of merit, whatsoever! [my take from context...reserve the right to err]

I hear some 'real' drum tracks on posted tunes about which the 'real deal' clan rave. Occasionally, they really suck. Sound awful, and unlike anything I ever heard on a professionally recorded tune. I think you guys get stuck sometimes. But that's just my opinion. I still love yoos. And appreciate the advice n' stuff.

Now, there's nothing I love more than hearing a real upright, well-tuned cans with a big rivet ride, and a Steinway....with some smokin' jazzers playing them...live, or on a good record [Les McCann at the Bohemian Caverns comes to mind.] But there's music in other things, and vehicles of expression. Malmsteen just wouldn't sound the same on nylon. He should be using gut, anyway... :^)

2c. [I have less than $5,000 invested in my 'studio'. I think I'm doin' OK!]

ps...all the guitars and bass guitar are real.

Lol. Re-fucking-lax dude. No one's shitting on you for using midi. You use what you have. Use these constructive comments to get better. That's the point, right? If an actual drummer tells you that your drums sound robotic, then it's probably true. I mean, who would know better, right? Humanize your stuff. I don't know shit about MIDI, but I know that I've heard some stuff in here that would fool even the pickiest listener. You often give nice, detailed critiques of other people's stuff. Accept some for yours.
 
OK! Knickers never were in a twist. It wasn't the critiques: just the tacit implication...a drumbeat [arf].... that all things MIDI are sub-standard. That's how mic-purists come across to me sometimes.

"...[N]ever wrap my head around anything MIDI..." DOA?

Just sayin'....reserve right to be wrong. :^)
 
Hi Jeff,
You're probably way beyond this, so I offer it with some hesitation. Recently Lukas and I were listening to one of the Inside Home Recording podcasts, and there was a really cool segment on midi drums. He was actually using a drum sequencer, I think, instead of an electric kit like you have, but I figure both are using midi. Lukas is a drummer, and could hear some of the add-ons (that I couldn't hear) - the ghost rolls in particular, but I was just impressed with how much it changed the liveliness and feel of the track as he explained what he was going to do, and then played it back. I think it was #62 or 63. I subscribe to the podcasts, and delete most of them from my playlist after I listen to them, so I don't have it any more - but they are free at itunes.

Btw, congrats on getting one of your tunes played on the radio! I checked out your web site, and you are one, very busy, guy!
 
Thanks! I'm assuming those podcasts are available on this site? Never noticed them....actually, don't know exactly what a podcast is! Guess I'll find out.

My problem is imagining what I want. I hear something, say I gotta use it, and can't seem to remember what the cool fill was. What I have to do is get really serious about things, and NOTATE groovey drum fills that I hear real drummers play...and recreate them. One used, I think I'll be able to imagine that good phrase, and improvise on it. All I really ever did was play time on drums...never got to fancy stuff. So I hit a wall with creative fills...cuz my brain never got wired with 'em. And I'll have to actually take the time to adjust the sensitivity on my pads, and actually make time to practice, and gain a touch, to keep from spiking the velocity every hit....which leads to editing work...and additional production time....and never with result as good as actual, real-time randomness.

Thanks for the heads-up!
 
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