Kick drum bleeding into overheads

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bone

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Hiya,
How can I avoid the kick from bleeding into the overheads? I have two Oktava MK-012-01. A 57 on the snare, and a d-112 on the kick. The overheads pick up everything and I want them for just cymbols and toms.

Thanx guys

Bone
 
I want the bleed as I feel that's where most of the tone of the kit comes from but that's neither here nor there. You can try rolling off the low end of the overhead tracks.
 
No offense bone, but this moves contrary to most theories one might read about utilization of overheads, namely, you want to get at least 75% of your sound from your overheads for the whole kit and use the kick, snare, hi-hat and tom mics (if you have them) for accents.

That said, here are some ideas:

Do you have the pads on the 012's?

Could you use the pads on your board/pre in addition to the ones on the mic?

Bass rolloff in your mixer/pre/software?

Dampener rings for the kick?
 
i think your problem is your expectations.

with a 4 mic technique you are gonna get bleed in all the mics, and especially in the OHs.

you want the bleed.

love the bleed.
 
bone said:
The overheads pick up everything and I want them for just cymbols and toms.

Click to expand...




overheads are supposed to pick up everything. there is no way you will be able to keep the kick out of them. they need to be placed where the kit is most balanced. start with your overheads, once you have them sounding good, add kick drum, then snare, then toms, etc.
 
If you mix at the computer, you might try to cancel the BD out...

Time-align a copy of the BD track so that it is exactly the same (in amplitude AND time) as the BD in the OH (may help a lot if you have single BD hits). Then invert the copied track. The bass drum should be gone then...

Will be LOADS of work, though...

aXel
 
Sorry, double post (F*** my computer - first it says 'server not found' and then there are two posts...)

aXel
 
volltreffer said:
If you mix at the computer, you might try to cancel the BD out...

Will be LOADS of work, though...
Click to expand...
Not to mention that you will be left with a mono overhead track.

Either work with the bleed or use midi triggers for the bass and snare drum. Rolling off low frequencies will do nothing. The bass drum sound is quite present all the way up past 2000/3000 khz.

Overhead bleed is quite normal and even desireable. If you don't like the "room" sound that the overheads give to your bass drum, treat the room until you do like it.
 
Well, if you were just going for the cymbols and hi-hat with the overheads, and had the toms miked, this would be easy. But you can't keep the toms and not keep the kick. If you have too much kick you could try sidechaining a compressor in, but I don't think it'll sound very good. Try damping down your kick and easing up a bit on the pedal.
RD
 
I think the real issue is to ask yourself why you want the kick and snare out of the overheads in the first place. Is that the only way to get the sound you are going for? Do you even have a clearly defined "goal" sound in your head? If your sound really does need midi-like separation, would a live performance on midi pads be a better idea?
 
I always try and make sure that I have the WHOLE kit in the overheads.

As mentioned,... somewhat anyway,...the overheads are the most important mics in your set-up. Well,..I believe anyway. But,..i guess it depends what you want your drums to sound like.

Maybe Chibi Nappa's right. You ought to go the electronic route.

Take 'er easy,...
Calwood
 
thanx guys

I recorded a local band Sunday and wanted the kick to sound like it did on their other cd's. I can get that sound only when I listen to the kick solo and after it's eq'd. The drummer told me they used trigers to get that sound but I didn't understand how they mic'd the cymbols without getting any bleeding of other drums? They must have used like a 57 on each cymbol...maybe?
 
I wish I could get MORE kick in my overheads. But I have resorted to a LDC about 5' out. It kicks ass for the kick and toms.
 
Re: thanx guys

bone said:
I recorded a local band Sunday and wanted the kick to sound like it did on their other cd's. I can get that sound only when I listen to the kick solo and after it's eq'd. The drummer told me they used trigers to get that sound but I didn't understand how they mic'd the cymbols without getting any bleeding of other drums? They must have used like a 57 on each cymbol...maybe?
Click to expand...

If the kick track is dry/tight/processed and hot in the mix relative to the cymbols, a little bleed in the top mics could be largely covered up.
Wayne
 
If the kick sounds good when soloed but bad when mixed with the OH's you probably have some phase problems. Try inverting the phase on the kick track and the good kick sound should come back.
 
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