Just picked up my first analog deck

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pappy999

New member
I just got my TSR-8 today. It looks to be in perfect shape. It came with 9 rolls of 3m 996 tape (is that good stuff???). I hooked it up and everything seems to work fine. Motors move smoothly and all lights and meters are OK. My first (of many) questions are:

It has rca ins. Where would I find a decent snake that has, say, trs-rca x8 so I can hook it up to my mixer?

I tried recording just a little and it seems very muffled sounding. I ran a regular rca cable from my smaller mixer into the tascam and recorded a sequence of vocals off an sm-57. The meters on the recorder indicated decent volume. When I played back into my monitors it sounded about 1/8 the original loudness that I monitored through my mixer. Is there something I am missing? How do you monitor the sound going onto tape during tracking?

I am pretty excited to give this a try. Thanks for all your help on this forum in making my decision.

Phil
 
Congrats! did you get it off ebay? because i was watching a lot of those auctions...

I just bought a couple of HOSA snakes at guitar center that go from 1/4" to rca for my tsr-8. i think they were only like $20 each, but i cant remember.

I hate to say this, but i am having a similar problem with my tsr8. It plays back fine, but recordings sound muffled and noisy. i have another thread going begging for help with mine. ive gotten some good advice so far- if you want to check it out here it is....
http://www.homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=230133

also, i dont think you can monitor whats actually going on to the tape with a TSR-8 because it only has two heads. You can just monitor input.

im no expert, so everyone please correct me if i'm wrong.

PS. one thing I'm learning right now is not to use old tape. i was using ampex 456, which is what the TSR is usually calibrated for (unless the previos owner changed it) but it was used and it damaged my machine. I dont know anything about 996.
 
pappy999 said:
I just got my TSR-8 today. It looks to be in perfect shape. It came with 9 rolls of 3m 996 tape (is that good stuff???). I hooked it up and everything seems to work fine. Motors move smoothly and all lights and meters are OK. My first (of many) questions are:

It has rca ins. Where would I find a decent snake that has, say, trs-rca x8 so I can hook it up to my mixer?

I tried recording just a little and it seems very muffled sounding. I ran a regular rca cable from my smaller mixer into the tascam and recorded a sequence of vocals off an sm-57. The meters on the recorder indicated decent volume. When I played back into my monitors it sounded about 1/8 the original loudness that I monitored through my mixer. Is there something I am missing? How do you monitor the sound going onto tape during tracking?

I am pretty excited to give this a try. Thanks for all your help on this forum in making my decision.

Phil
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Someone else here can tell you more about that type of tape, but you might wanna check your heads make sure there is no gunk built up on it. It could be bad.
 
I got it off ebay. I picked it up locally for $350 with 9 tapes. The tapes seem to be on the old side. They are a bit oxidized and sticky. Any suggestions for restoring this old tape? They are unused. I have heard of putting the tape into a luke warm oven to loosen the oxidization. Will this work or should I just buy some new tape? I also should probably do some maintenance to the machine being that it has not been used in a year. What should I do to it?
 
pappy999 said:
I got it off ebay. I picked it up locally for $350 with 9 tapes. The tapes seem to be on the old side. They are a bit oxidized and sticky. Any suggestions for restoring this old tape? They are unused. I have heard of putting the tape into a luke warm oven to loosen the oxidization. Will this work or should I just buy some new tape? I also should probably do some maintenance to the machine being that it has not been used in a year. What should I do to it?
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The machine will probably need calibration. And you can bake the tapes-what are they? Your best bet is to buy and work with new tape though for any serious projects. ;)
 
pappy999 said:
I got it off ebay. I picked it up locally for $350 with 9 tapes. The tapes seem to be on the old side. They are a bit oxidized and sticky. Any suggestions for restoring this old tape? They are unused. I have heard of putting the tape into a luke warm oven to loosen the oxidization. Will this work or should I just buy some new tape? I also should probably do some maintenance to the machine being that it has not been used in a year. What should I do to it?
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Unless you have precious material recorded on the tapes, which obviously exhibit sticky shed, I'd toss the tape and keep the empty reels. Just suck the tape off with a vacuum.

Yes, you can bake them but I'd only do it, again, if you wish to preserve and transfer the material on them.

Get brand new Quantegy or RMGI tape. I believe your TSR-8 was originally setup for Quantegy 456 so you may use that and also RMGI SM911. Both can be used interchangeably.

Hopefully your TSR-8 was not reset to another tape, by the previous owner and had not drifted too much.

As far as cleaning, maintenance:

I'd also recommend not using the q-tips but rather the lint free makup remover cotton pads you see at just about any store. Use those, with better than 90% alcohol (I use 99%) and go over the heads and every other area the tape contacts, except the rubber pinch roller, on which you should not use the alcohol. Instead, just take a clean lint free cloth (like microfibre*), moisten it with warm water (drain excess) and clean the pinch roller with it, until all you see is the dark rubber. Remember to drain all excess alcohol and water from the pads / cloth before applying and make sure no lint is left over and that the tape path is dry. Clean the heads in the direction of tape travel and until all of the above are sparkling clean. One needs to be very good at routine cleaning (after every recording session is a good standby).

*you can also use microfibre cloth, dampened in alcohol, for harder to clean areas of the tape path

As fred s already pointed out, it ideally should be calibrated but lets get those few problem issues sorted out first, with things you can do yourself.

If all is good after this minimal work and recorded sounds (to the new tape) are A-ok then you should also, ideally, replace the pinch roller and capstan belt. Buy them only from TASCAM direct.
 
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I agree you should start with new tape. Look at baking as more for recovering something previously recorded. You're asking for trouble by starting new with old, sticky shed tape.

In previous threads I’ve recommended skipping the free tape offer when purchasing machines to save on shipping. Cut your loses and use the reel flanges for pancakes of new tape. Tape sold in pancake (no reel) is much cheaper.

I don't know what the exact numbers are, but a good percentage of problems people have with open reel machines is entirely due to old, bad tape. I've seen it here and many other forums and groups over the years. I’d even venture to say there are some who sadly have never figured out what was going on and abandoned analog prematurely, thinking they had a bad machine.
 
i think i was watching the auction where you bought the machine. it was a guy in new york right? didn't it say on that auction that he had re-biased the machine to 996 and that he is an electronics tech?
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That's the one. So I really need some new 996 tape for this machine to work properly. Are the 9 reels I have really unsalvagable? I will try cleaning the machine first. I am going to try the tape bake to see if that works. What temp should i put my oven at and for how long. I am thinking 150 degrees for 10 mins. Anything above 200 will prob melt the tape, right? Am I wasting my time doing this? Anyone know where to get this 996 tape new?
 
You can't use a conventional gas or electric kitchen oven. 150 degrees F is too hot, and the temp will actually rise above that for short periods as the oven tries to maintain a nominal 150 degrees. In addition natural gas contains too much moisture (if you’re using gas).

I have doubts that 996 has classic sticky shed that will respond to baking, but I have heard some claims to that effect. Some older tape has heavy oxide shedding, even though the binder has not broken down. AMPEX 499 is known for this type of shedding. It will still cause you problems by covering the heads in oxide dust, but isn’t as bad as sticky shed. Usually cleaning the tape path and even the tape will fix the problem.

If you want to try and treat the tape by baking you’ll need a food dehydrator… but you’re wasting your time, as you shouldn’t even be considering using defective tape for recording new material. Bottom line… unless you need to recover previously recorded material use new tape.

IMO, high-output tape like 996 or 499 is a waste of resources since the TSR-8 has such nicely integrated dbx noise reduction. Probably the best use of your money would be to have it recalibrated to the factory recommended Quantegy 456 or RMGI 911, and buy new tape. Another possibility is if the machine has been running 996 all this time the heads may be gone. That class of tape is hard on these machines and accelerates head wear.
 
pappy999 said:
That's the one. So I really need some new 996 tape for this machine to work properly. Are the 9 reels I have really unsalvagable? I will try cleaning the machine first. I am going to try the tape bake to see if that works. What temp should i put my oven at and for how long. I am thinking 150 degrees for 10 mins. Anything above 200 will prob melt the tape, right? Am I wasting my time doing this? Anyone know where to get this 996 tape new?
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996 is a very high output +9 tape. The Quantegy 499 and BASF SM900 can be used in its place. You do NOT need to find some old stock 996.

From my research it seems most Scotch/3m tapes had some shedding issues but there is no mention of the 996 so I don't know. You surely can bake it. There is a link here somewhere on this forum. I'll have to find it. But I'd only bake as a way to transfer some important recordings and not as a way to reuse tape for further and ongoing recordings. If I, personally, would have any doubts, I would only keep the the empty reels and toss the tape and buy new one.

If you really want to try the 996 then observe closely for any sticky shedding while the tape is running on your recorder. If any problems, clean the recorder again and toss the tape collection.

One other thing: High output tapes such as 3M 996, QUANTEGY 499 and RMGI SM900 are physically more difficult to pull through the mechanism on a typical TEAC / TASCAM recorder, as the result of more stiffer and heavier tape due to more oxide, resulting in accelerated head wear and wearing out of the motors over time. I would readjust for a lower operating level tape such as the RMGI SM911 or SM468 and certainly not pin the meters while recording.
 
pappy999 said:
So I could buy some Quantegy 499 and I won't have to rebias my machine?
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Technically speaking, but since it's a good idea to have your machine calibrated as a first step it's practically a moot point. When you buy a used machine you don’t really know where it is calibration wise until you have it checked out.

:)
 
It sounds like the azimuth could be out of alignment, which causes phase issues. I'd have the thing fully calibrated both electrically and mechanically.
 
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