iZoTope Ozone 3 Released

  • Thread starter Thread starter Qwerty
  • Start date Start date
Qwerty said:
Ozone 2.0 sucked because it added even more options, was still a resource hog and still had it's own character which it imparted on tracks
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Did you try unchecking the "Analog modeling"-box? Makes one hell of a difference.
 
Only in V3, I'm afraid..... And it does sound reasonably clean too.

Q.
 
Well... there seems to be mixed reviews of Ozone here. Lot's of good reviews on the Cakewalk forum.

I'm considering picking up Ozone 3. It seems that the dithering module is worth the price of the whole plug-in.

I don't see Waves Masters offering that.

Any comments?

Thanks.
 
moskus said:
No, Waves only has the best dither-plugin around... ;)
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Okay... I just read the L2 manual. I know... "RTFM!" And I see what you mean.

I'm a little concerned about spending that much money. and I'm a little concerned about the problems with Pace copy protection on a Hyper-threading system.

I've got HT disabled right now, but when Sonar3 releases the HT version, I'll be turning it back on.

I'm aware of the following HT work-around from Cakewalk's Ron Kuper:

I've done some investigation and come up with a work-around for the crashes
and blue-screens some people have been seeing with PACE copy protection and
SONAR 3 in HT enabled systems.

To prevent this crash from happening, please add the following registry
value:

HKEY_CURRENT_USERS\Software\Cakewalk Music Software\SONAR Producer\3.0
EnableMultiprocHT (REG_DWORD) = 1

This key instructs SONAR 3 to truly treat an HT processor as 2 processors.
Not doing so seems to cause PACE some grief.

Thanks for your patience.

--
Ron Kuper
Cakewalk
http://www.cakewalk.com
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I can only hope that if I overcome my fear of spending that much money, that the above work-around really does work and my system will remain stable.

I'm thinking about the Platinum Bundle.

Did I mention I was a little concerned about the money? :eek:
 
moskus said:
No, Waves only has the best dither-plugin around... ;)
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dither is the most overrated thing in recording...despite what dither you use i guarantee you won't hear the difference unless your in a great room with great monitors...if dither is what is swaying you to getting the masters bundle you money is better spent somewhere else

check this out if you want some dither

http://www.cranesong.com/analogdither.html
 
Hey, don't complain to me! I have a 16 bit system... :D


Anyway, I don't think dither is overrated. Okay, at 16 bit it's getting really hard to hear, but say you reduce the bitrate from 16 to 8 bits. If you don't hear the difference "to dither or not to dither" you are veeery close to deaf. ;)
 
well i mean 24-16

i'll dither with POW-R dither in samplitude

IDR in waves

or the dither in Timeworks...

for the life of me i don't know which is which...

i'm tryna order the cranesong thing...for about 35..w/ shipping can' t really go wrong...and now i can put cranesong to the list of equipment i have :eek:
 
I still think you'll notice when you just reduce it from 24 to 16 without dithering... ;)
 
Guys,

I've been spending a lot of time hanging out on the Mastering Web Board, following the technical musings of Glenn Meadows, Bob Katz, Alan Silverman, and the like [ http://webbd.nls.net/webboard/wbpx.dll/~mastering/ ] and reading the many informative articles on Bob Katz's web site [ digido.com ], and reading Mr. Katz's book "Mastering Audio, the Art And The Science", not to mention the manuals by Waves and Ozone that pertain to mastering... and no one else seems to feel that dither doesn't matter. ;)

Quite the opposite.

As my critical listening skills improve, I'm hearing a digital harshness after "mastering" and converting from 24 to 16 bit. I'm reading so much because I want to understand all the possible sources of the harshness.

I think my recording space needs more acoustic treatment.
I think my patch-bay and cables could be better.
I think my AD/DCs should be Apogee, Lavry, or CraneSong.
I think my mastering plugs need replacing.
I think if the new mastering plugs process at a higher bit rate than my host app, then it would help a great deal if the processed wave forms were treated with real-time dithering as with the Waves L2 UltraMaximizer.
I think the detailed explanations of the importance of really good dithering algorithms in the Ozone and Waves L2 manuals make a great deal of sense.

I'm pretty sure dithering matters.:D
 
i just ordered the cranesong cd..i'll let yall know if its any better then any of the other dither plug-ins
 
SteveD said:
no one else seems to feel that dither doesn't matter. ;)


I'm pretty sure dithering matters.:D
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well i meant if you used 2 different dithers on the same song and played it on a regular home stereo to regular home listeners they won't know the difference

also it was meant to mean that mixing is more important then what dither you use if your recording sounds like crap or not...i.e george massenberg can truncate from 24-16 while you use the best dither out and i guarantee you his mix will KILL yours....YMMV
 
Teacher said:
well i meant if you used 2 different dithers on the same song and played it on a regular home stereo to regular home listeners they won't know the difference

also it was meant to mean that mixing is more important then what dither you use if your recording sounds like crap or not...i.e george massenberg can truncate from 24-16 while you use the best dither out and i guarantee you his mix will KILL yours....YMMV
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Don't know if I agree with the first part. but I DEFINITELY agree with the second part!:)

What are you using for "mastering" cds?
 
SteveD said:
Don't know if I agree with the first part. but I DEFINITELY agree with the second part!:)

What are you using for "mastering" cds?
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you think average home listeners can hear the difference between IDR, POW-r UV22 etc...? when i get the cranesong CD i'll do a test cranesong vs. idr vs. pow-r vs. timeworks dither..

what do you mean mastering cds?...what CD's do i burn my 'final copy' on? if so CDr's
 
Teacher said:
you think average home listeners can hear the difference between IDR, POW-r UV22 etc...? when i get the cranesong CD i'll do a test cranesong vs. idr vs. pow-r vs. timeworks dither..

what do you mean mastering cds?...what CD's do i burn my 'final copy' on? if so CDr's
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Like I said... I DON'T KNOW about the first part... I don't know whether average people hear a difference. But I think my clients can. I think musicians can... at least those that have any hearing left. ;)

Here's an interesting poll... Have you seen this?

http://www.24-96.net/dither/

The second part... Sorry,

Let me re-phrase the question:

What system, process, or plugins do you use to finish a project that will not be sent to a mastering house? (If you don't mind sharing your trade secrets).
 
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More interesting stuff regarding dither and truncation build-up in plugs:
Actually, how any plug in handles non-integer values (ie fractions) is a very big deal. Simply rounding to the closest whole number available is the second worst solution. The worst solution is to simply chop off the numbers at an arbitrary cut off point (truncation). Plugs that truncate sound like ass. Plugs that round simply sound cheap.

As much as folks would like to forget dither, and as wierd as it is to handle conceptually, it's a necessary evil. Waves Renaissance plugs do it automatically, and Waves IDR is designed to avoid "build up".

Some folks believe that dither below 24 bits is inaudible and thus a waste of time. This perspective can be supported in multitrack mixing: The sum of 10-100 tracks of audio generate enormous numbers, and the low level detail on any individual track is lost, and the least significant bit (ie quietest sounds) is even LESS significant when you consider the dynamic scaling necessary to fit 48 or 56 fixed or 64 float bits into a 24 bit signal. Hence the digi recommendation not to worry about it until the very last step, where this scaling occurs.

This idea falls apart in a couple circumstances: If you're mastering or working with just a few tracks, that detail remains in the number space, and can easily be fit and can be necessary. Second, if every track is using lots of plug-ins and were recorded at non-optimal levels chains of cheap truncated plugs will push the truncation errors into audible range (normalizing at the track level will exacerbate these problems, by making quantization distortion audible, alongside the truncation).

The dirty little secret: These accumulated errors are quite audible, and are responsible for the hard to nail down myth about ProTool's mix bus sounding bad. PT sounds fine. It's the crap you put between the fader and the master, and the narrow plug window that mess things up. Digi's actually done a great job cleaning up that bus and making a solid number cruncher. They've done a less good job defining TDM2 as yet another 24 bit bus. 32 bit float is computationally a little neater, so VST, MAS and AudioUnits all have a huge edge at the channel level over TDM systems. DirectX can do 64 float I think, which is near ideal. Had they bumped it to 48 they'd have halved track counts (already halved by HD), but truly removed the need to worry about dither between plug ins (the LSB at 64 or 48 bits is so far down it's truly irrelevant). As it is, your mix will only sound as good as the most prominent cheap plug, or longest chains of them. Doh!

When you need to dither: Anytime your signal changes bit depth. When does this happen? Any gain change turns your 16 or 24 bit fixed point source file into a 32 float or 48 fixed point word. Any plug in or DSP. Any mixing operations. Virtually EVERYTHING you do expands the remainder/product of math operations. Good coders know this and design plugs to elegantly deal with remainders in a way that won't build up noise.

Unfortunately sticking a Waves IDR or MOTU Quan Jr between your T-Raxx plugs isn't going to get it done. You need plugs written properly to start with. Better to just forget it if it's not there, and rely on the bus dither to do it's best. Most Waves plugs fall into that category: the Renn line automagically dithers, while other plugs give you a choice of IDR options. Typically the ones with options are things like L1 or L2 which are used at the end of the chain.

In general, flat or non-noise shaped dithers are best at the track level. Gentle noise shaping is ok for 24 bit mix busses. Aggressive noise shaping (IDR t2 Ultra, POW-R, Megabitmax, SBM) should be avoided until mastering.

If anyone would like a primer on how/why it works, I'll give it a shot.

-d-
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Read it all here: http://boards.cincymusic.com/index.php?showtopic=8125
 
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