Is there such a thing as "the wrong mic"?

D

DM1

New member
Checking out drBill's awesome drum-mic shootout got me curious. With only a couple of exceptions, the samples ALL sound usable. I could probably pick favorites, or at least exclude a few that I'm not crazy about, but I'd be hard pressed to call any of the examples an obvious winner.

So I wonder: All other things being equal, do you think the wrong mic selection could ever (or has ever) held a song back?

It seems that mic selection is 90% a matter of taste - as evidenced by the lack of consistency among the commenters in drBill's thread. And there are so many tastes to consider: The artist's, the engineers', the listeners'. All of which are influenced as much by non-musical factors, like current fashions, "schools of thought", listening environment... "Correct," "proper," or "best" must be almost meaningless in this context.

Is it actually possible for an engineer to screw up, and use the wrong mic?
 
DM1 said:
So I wonder: All other things being equal, do you think the wrong mic selection could ever (or has ever) held a song back?
Click to expand...

Doubtful. Unless of course it's broken and the sound is absolutely horrible or not there at all.

DM1 said:
It seems that mic selection is 90% a matter of taste - as evidenced by the lack of consistency among the commenters in drBill's thread. And there are so many tastes to consider: The artist's, the engineers', the listeners'. All of which are influenced as much by non-musical factors, like current fashions, "schools of thought", listening environment... "Correct," "proper," or "best" must be almost meaningless in this context.
Click to expand...

I'd argue that there could be a "best at hand for the current situation." Case in point:
I had a singer in the studio that just didn't sound right through every fancy mic I had - U67, Sony C37A, RCA 77DX were among those we tried. The sound wasn't bad but these mics and others of the same stature were not really cutting it. Out of desperation we tried an SM 58. Bingo! She sounded great. Is an SM 58 a better mic than a U-67? No way but on that singer the Neumann and all the other heavy hitters had to take a back seat for the job.
DM1 said:
Is it actually possible for an engineer to screw up, and use the wrong mic?
Click to expand...

Possible but unlikely, assuming he or she has enough recording smarts.
 
For there to be a "wrong mic", there has to be a "right mic". One cannot exist without the other.

The only reasonable definition of a "right mic" I can think of is the best available mic for capturing closest to the kind of sound that the engineer is looking for.

That would make the "wrong mic" the opposite of that.

G.
 
wrong mic??? hum? Well you would not want a d112 on violin I would not tend to think.It's a matter of which is better suited. A rolls royce will get you 2 miles down the road alright but a 67 bug may do it wiser given the investment ( maybe a bad analogy) but... I think it is a combination of what the artist/engineer is looking for. A lot of artist dont know an sm57 from a u67.. Some are very enlightened. So what you are trying to achieve will dictate the correct answer.
 
I've changed mics on numerous occasions. Not because one mic was better than another, but because one mic was better for what I was trying to do. Know your mics, learn what mic works best for certain applications, and use whichever mic responds best to the sounds and frequencies you are trying to record. Any good engineer (and most of the rest of us) understands this concept and uses the best mic for the job at hand.
 
Ah OK, I could word myself better.

SouthSIDE Glen said:
...the best available mic for capturing closest to the kind of sound that the engineer is looking for.
Click to expand...
Dani Pace said:
Any good engineer (and most of the rest of us) understands this concept and uses the best mic for the job at hand.
Click to expand...
I get the importance of parity between the engineer's vision and mic selection. But what happens when the mics are so close that it's a toss-up? I mean, "best" in this context, at some point becomes a matter of taste, right?

Or, if I have a choice between two equally qualified mic selections, are there instances when choosing one over the other will be the difference in a song's success, even though it's not apparant to me at the time?

Like, in drBill's thread, the differences between the Sputnik and AM62 as room mics are so slight that I can't believe they're meaningful. And as an amateur, that worries me a little. Pro engineers border on dogmatic about the importance of proper mic selection, and sometimes seem to dwell on esoteric nuances. Yet I can't imagine a circumstance when I'd specifically choose the Sputnik over the Am62 (or vice versa.)

So I'm not sure if it's because after a certain point, it's just a matter of taste. Or, if it's because I lack the ability, or imagination, to see how these small differences ACTUALLY REALLY MATTER. (And huge caveat: I'm assuming "all other things being equal." That is, the band and engineer know what they're doing.) If it comes down to a matter of taste, there's something reassuring about that. :) But what I'm ultimately trying to understand is, when the differences between mics are vanishingly small, are there still times when those differences matter?
 
Also, if the mic works and I'm singing into it, it's the wrong mic. For my voice, in order to not ruin a recording, the mic needs to be completely broken and unusable.
 
legionserial said:
Also, if the mic works and I'm singing into it, it's the wrong mic. For my voice, in order to not ruin a recording, the mic needs to be completely broken and unusable.
Click to expand...

So, if you incorrectly close mic inside a kick drum with a cheap ribbon or LDC, you will produce the right mic to record legionserial's vocals with.

This thread is a wonderful journey of discovery.
 
DM1 said:
I get the importance of parity between the engineer's vision and mic selection. But what happens when the mics are so close that it's a toss-up? I mean, "best" in this context, at some point becomes a matter of taste, right?

Or, if I have a choice between two equally qualified mic selections, are there instances when choosing one over the other will be the difference in a song's success, even though it's not apparant to me at the time?
Click to expand...
Mic selection will virtually NEVER be the difference in a song's success. If the song and the performance is good enough, one could record it with a room bugging device stuck in a table lamp and it would still be a success. OTOH, you can use the absolutely best mics in the world using the most advanced techniques, but if you're using them on your average hack garage band, the song will never be a success.

As far as picking between two mics that "sound the same", there are other considerations that the engineer may need to consider, such as what preamps are available to use. You might not want to choose the ribbon mic if the only preamp channel you have left gives you only 50dB of gain, for example. Or if you know that MicA and MicB sound the same only when run through this signal chain, but through that signal chain the perform differently (not uncommon). Which BTW, leads to:
DM1 said:
Like, in drBill's thread
Click to expand...
First of all, I have a rule of thumb that works pretty well 99% of the time: you can't take anyone who uses the word "awesome" in their thread titles or descriptions of technical subjects very seriously. (That goes double for anyone who uses the word "epic" for anything other than a movie of a grand scale.) ;)

So I have not read this "awsome" thread, but unless he has taken mic preamps into consideration as well, and included several different preamps in his shoutouts, the comparisons between mics would be quite unfair.
DM1 said:
But what I'm ultimately trying to understand is, when the differences between mics are vanishingly small, are there still times when those differences matter?
Click to expand...
Everything matters, it's just a question as to degree. Teeny-weeny differences in mic sound won't matter much when you're recording the next wall of sound by Distortion Killed My Mother in One-Hitter Gary's basement into his studio-in-a-box. When you're recording Yo Yo Ma soloing in the old Studio A tracking room of The Record Plant through the U.S.S. Rupert Neve, you might actually want to take your time and split the hairs between the mics.

G.
 
listening to mic samples can be hit and miss depending on your monitoring chain and how well your room is treated acousticaly. Also the samples might be in mp3 format further degrading the quailty.

Listening to sound files of mics V's putting the different mics up on an instrument and hearing them back through your monitoring chain could be night and day.

It's like having an old television and one of them adverts come on for a new HDTV and suddenly the picture looks amazing on your old TV.....why would you need the new HDTV when the results look useable on your old TV? same thing goes for mics, unless you can do the test in first person then someone elses results are neither here nor there.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
Teeny-weeny differences in mic sound won't matter much when you're recording the next wall of sound by Distortion Killed My Mother in One-Hitter Gary's basement into his studio-in-a-box. When you're recording Yo Yo Ma soloing in the old Studio A tracking room of The Record Plant through the U.S.S. Rupert Neve, you might actually want to take your time and split the hairs between the mics.

G.
Click to expand...
I can attest to the wall of sound comment - it doesn't much matter which mic you choose for bands like that...as long as you observe good tracking practices, and get good tones on the instruments - you can use cheap-depot micos all day long with excellent results.

I hope that some day I get a chance to record something other than a wall of sound....or a rapper, so that I can see firsthand what people are always talking about in threads like this...dynamic range and what not - someday I'll record something that doesn't call for a mix that makes the VU lights hit 0db....and stay there.......the whole time. (only a very slight exaggeration).

Dare to dream, I suppose.
 
The sensitivity of a mic also has a lot to do with how it is used. You don't need a mic that will pick up a gnat fart at 100 yards to cloce mic a guitar amp. On the flip side, the dynamic mike you use for a screamer who likes to eat the mic wont be of much use for capturing room ambience.
 
DM1 said:
So I wonder: All other things being equal, do you think the wrong mic selection could ever (or has ever) held a song back?
Is it actually possible for an engineer to screw up, and use the wrong mic?
Click to expand...

I don't think there is such a thing...IF, it sounds like you want it too! ;-)

I'm MY personal case...it's usually a SM57! :D
 
Theres no wrong mic if you like what you hear then its the right mic. I guess then if you dont like what you hear its probably the wrong mic.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top