S
slobbermonster
New member
I guess next we'll find out that the Behringer B-1 is actually built by Neumann in a secret German bunker next to Uli's house 
kidvybes
New member
...what I find interesting is the choice of microphone Tele chose to "modify"...of all the Chinese tube mics available, the Apex 460/Nady 1150 is one of the cheapest (retail price) and also one of the least liked for it's sonic character...looks to me that Tele didn't make much of an effort to "design" this new "affordable" line of mics...Rode has been modifying Chinese mics for years (actually tooling the bodies, and offering high quality components/circuits) at very reasonable prices with great results for the most part...I think what we have here is a very simple study in marketing psychology...slap a "prestigious logo" on the mic, give it a upgraded "paint job" and a $200. wood case, tweak a few inexpensive components (so it's no longer OEM), and charge about 4X the actual value (if it costs more, it MUST be better...right?)...I have a few Chinese tube mics (including the Royer modded ADK51) that I have upgraded the tubes in, with very pleasing results...but all of these mics together don't add up to the price of this one Tele/Chinese hybrid...I mean, c'mon...do we look that stupid?
...BTW, where's Chessrock with some pearls of wisdom about Chinese mics?...
...BTW, where's Chessrock with some pearls of wisdom about Chinese mics?...
PhilGood
Juice box hero
kidvybes said:
I've seen plenty of posts here and other boards where people actually DO like the Apex and Nady. Several Pro's had very nice things to say about the M16. I don't know where you heard its one of the least liked. The components and build of the Apex are NOT cheap. All the caps besides power caps are mylars. The resistors are good quality. I haven't looked at the transformer yet, but I'm sure that could be upgraded. No doubt the capsule is a shanghai.
kidvybes
New member
PhilGood said:
Actually, I posted a question as to the opinions of the 460:
https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=143587&highlight=apex+460
...as you can see, the opinions varied greatly...seems like most support from that mic comes from Canada where the mic is distributed (and therefore less expensive in Canadian dollars than the MXL/Studio Projects/ADK counterparts)...I was actually talked out of the mic by a salesman here in FL who sells the Apex line, and warned me of inconsistancy of product quality...seems the Apex product suffers from the some of the same problems as the Nady counterpart (it has been stated in another posting on Gearslutz.com that they are both supplied by the same manufacturer)...wrinkled diaphragms, lousy tubes, poor QC...seems to me, there are more proven options at similar/slightly higher pricepoints...namely the MXL V77, V69M, Studio Projects TB1, ADK GT2, and so on... just MHO
PhilGood
Juice box hero
kidvybes said:
Well, the tube it comes with IS crap and I don't like how they mislead you into thinking its something it isn't. I checked the diaphrams in both of mine and no wrinkles. I wish there was a way to see if the diaphram has good tuning.
I didn't pay full price for either of mine so that's probably where my bias comes from.
C
corban
New member
snow lizard said:
Ha, yeah L & M are all about those Apex mics. When they first started hawking Apex on me I asked on this board, and got "haven't heard of them, they probably suck." Got one anyways, and I've had little to compain about, particularly considering the price.
kidvybes
New member
PhilGood said:
Phil... I know from some of your other postings that you love to mod your mics...just curious what mods you may have made to your 460s including swapping out the tubes)...what is the total cost of those mods, and add in a custom paint job and a spiffy logo...don't forget the "rare wood case"...I'm not trying to be a wiseguy, I'm just trying to restate my original thought that none of that can justify the Tele version's cost...but, seriously, what mods have you made on the 960s?...I correspond with Flatpicker (Tim) and recently purchased one of his modded mics which I'm pleased with...and as I stated above, I have a Royer modded ADK that is KILLA!...so don't get me wrong...I appreciate the value of the Chinese products...
kidvybes
New member
And The Winner Is...
...the real winner in all this is APEX...what a great public relations coup for them!...makes you wonder if TELE owns Apex stock...the Ebay sellers of the 460 are now offering a link to the M16/460 review...but let some of that "newly discovered desireablity" flow over to the Nady camp as well...their 1150 is the exact same mic and sells for only $159...that's less than the cost of the "rare wood case" for the Tele mic!...can't argue with that kinda "value"!...
...the real winner in all this is APEX...what a great public relations coup for them!...makes you wonder if TELE owns Apex stock...the Ebay sellers of the 460 are now offering a link to the M16/460 review...but let some of that "newly discovered desireablity" flow over to the Nady camp as well...their 1150 is the exact same mic and sells for only $159...that's less than the cost of the "rare wood case" for the Tele mic!...can't argue with that kinda "value"!...
PhilGood
Juice box hero
kidvybes said:
I am in FULL agreement that Telefunken is not justified in trying to pass these off based on their name and a fresh coat of paint. Seems like quailty control is some guy testing each one going "yep. nope. yep. nope. nope.". That's $5000 @ $1000 per word!
The mods I've done are cheap so far. A real Telefunken tube can be about $60, but there are acceptable ones for $20-30. Capacitors are a few cents to a a couple bucks each. Transformers can be from $45-120. My latest is my most expensive because I'm having parts machined. The only thing I've done to the 460 was change the tube and a capacitor (the 1uF electrolytic). I'll be changing the trafos soon. Cinemag makes great versions for $45.
T
tryptophan
New member
i agree with scrubs. there's no moral dilemma here. you can charge as much as you want for a product. it's the buyer's responsibility to know if he's getting a good deal. buyer beware.
FALKEN
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BUT NOBODY HAS DONE AN A/B!!!!!!!!!
how the hell can you be saying "buyer beware" when nobody has actually listened to them side by side????????????????????
...if they are the same I am getting 2.
how the hell can you be saying "buyer beware" when nobody has actually listened to them side by side????????????????????
...if they are the same I am getting 2.
A
acorec
Banned
scrubs said:
And the "market' is doing that just now. The problem with your philosophy about "the market" is that Telefunkin will have to bear the brunt of the outcome for their foolish bullshit. They will very likely fall into the "Behringer" kind of reputation in the future. Even the mentioning of their name in a thread will bring the onslaught of bashers forward.
I have seen these two mics in pictures side by side in many more places and agree that $1400 is a total ripoff for the hardware that is presented to the consumer.
T
tryptophan
New member
FALKEN said:
......so it's telefunken's fault that you haven't a/b'ed them? oh okay i get it now
FALKEN
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did i say anything was telefunkens fault?? I am saying you guys profess that it is definitely a ripoff after seeing pictures. I am saying that out of all of these forums not a single person as a/b'd them with their ears. I will laugh my ass off if and when all of you pre-judgers are proved wrong. if you are proved correct....then it will be right and I want some of them. I just dont understand what you are saying.
kidvybes
New member
...in truth, the A/B is probably not neccessary...the mods that Tele claims have been made to the OEM (Apex/Nady) mic could not possibly compensate for the dramatic discrepancy in price...I own a few mics that have much more radical modifications (Royer/Dorsey style mods) and the difference from stock to mod (although noticeable) is less than substantial...I have also upgraded the tubes in 6 of my tube mics with expensive vintage NOS tubes and again the differences are subtle...the verdict is clear...Tele is way outta line!...that mic is not worthy (with or without the "rare wood box") of the asking price...$500-600. maybe...that's all, unless Apex decides to start charging $700-800. for the 460...then Tele might have a case...
...in the meantime...here's the REAL DEAL in affordable tube microphone technology...I know...I got mine...check it out:
http://mojaveaudio.com/ma-200.html
...in the meantime...here's the REAL DEAL in affordable tube microphone technology...I know...I got mine...check it out:
http://mojaveaudio.com/ma-200.html
T
tryptophan
New member
falken, i don't care what either of those mics sound like. my point is that it's a buyer's responsibility to be informed. the buyer must know what he's buying and if it's available elsewhere for much less money.
the seller's only responibility is to feed his inbred kids.
buyer beware. buyer be informed. or else buyer be fucked.
the seller's only responibility is to feed his inbred kids.
buyer beware. buyer be informed. or else buyer be fucked.
D
Dot
New member
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kidvybes
New member
I smell a PR coverup...
...Gearslutz.com has removed a lengthy thread in which a Tele spokesperson made a very wordy, but unconvincing case for the "cost/quality value" of it's mic as opposed to the OEM version...and now an "interview" that will shock the industry with the innovations about to be delivered by Tele...looks like a public relations storm is about to brew...should be interesting at the least...
...Gearslutz.com has removed a lengthy thread in which a Tele spokesperson made a very wordy, but unconvincing case for the "cost/quality value" of it's mic as opposed to the OEM version...and now an "interview" that will shock the industry with the innovations about to be delivered by Tele...looks like a public relations storm is about to brew...should be interesting at the least...
X
xstatic
New member
Personally, I think a lot of people have missed the point of some of the "telefunken" response. Tony clearly said that the Telefunken mic sounds different. If this is true, than they are justified in charging whatever they want. It's really up to the end user to decide whether or not this difference warrants the price difference to them or not. If not, then the cheaper mic may be a great bargain to anyone that does not think much of the difference. For me, its the sonic differences that would have me deciding whether or not it is worth the price of admission.
FALKEN
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kidvybes said:
did yours cost a grand???
I am thinking for the cost of the apex i could get two and use as drum overheads...... after all of this you dont think its probably a good mic for the money?
I'll put it this way. a squire strat sucks but it sounds more like a standard strat than any les paul does...