in need of some pointers in getting a better sound

[damzwarr]

hey all, I'm after some advice on a song a friend and I have come up with. this is the first time I've actually recorded vocals on a track, and so far everyone else has been happy with the (near) finished product but me. I keep playing around with it, and have like 10 versions of the same song, lol. it just doesn't sound right, or even close to nice quality. especially the vocals. it's kinda upsetting considering I've heard better on lower quality equipment. so am wanting some feedback/suggestions from people who know what they're on about like, if I've done something terribly wrong, or I need to cut or boost anything, re record something, etc.

any help's greatly appreciated, thanks.

if it helps, my equipment.
some model of alto 10 channel mixer.
behringer mic100 preamp
rode M3 mic.
m-audio delta 2496 soundcard.

and the mp3.

http://www.yousendit.com/download/dVlxNWNoSU9OMUFLSkE9PQ

 

[gecko zzed]

All the musical elements are there to make a very interesting track.

They all appear to have been recorded pretty well also.

So you have a problem with it? My guess is that you are not feeling the energy you'd expect the song to have, right?

My thoughts are these:

Despite the inherent variety in the song, there is an overall sameness about it. This is in part down to the vocals. They are sung well enough, but there isn't a lot of variation in vocal delivery. When you couple this with its fairly prominent position in the mix, it acts like a blanket over the whole song.

The percussion could provide the musical drama that the track would benefit from. At the start there is a very 'sticky' sound which doesn't provide a lot of bang. Later on in various parts there is a fuller drum sound, but it has been pushed into the distance by the amount of reverb on it. The effect is of a kit in the next room, while you are in this room.

These are the two areas I would look at first. How about doing a mix with just drums, bass and vocals, and see if you can get something interesting happening with just those three. Then add the other stuff in.

 

[damzwarr]

ah thanks for the input. I guess the thing I am least happy with IS the reverb, and how the vocals and drums sit overall. especially when I do put less reverb on. I used drumkit from hell for that recording. I do like the drums, but I don't like the effects it puts on them. but saying that, it's the snare and toms that I have the biggest gripe with.

when it comes to the vocals, I kinda have them like that to reduce the hiss, so it could quite well be clouding my judgment? we are going to re record the vocals at some point. the original vocal track was duplicated 3 times to get it to that volume. I have no idea why it recorded so quietly. is it supposed to? I'm kinda surprised they came out as clear as they did. but no doubt they could be a lot clearer if that's the case?

I also dont know why the mixer's preamp channels have decided to stop working and only produce hiss (which might be what the problem with the vocals was to begin with). can a faulty XLR cable and/or phantom power damage that sorta thing? it was fine before recording the vocals. now not even guitars want to be hearable with the other jack. ehhhh.

 

[89gtsleeper]

The gate on the vocals is a bit distracting in my very humble opinion, particularly in the beginning of the song where there is much less instrumentation. You can hear it mainly in the sudden drop of the airy high erfrequencies. If you have the ability, I would say automate a volume decrease after each section of vocals to make a more gradual gating effect. the vocals also seem a bit loud in the mix overall, but they appear to be recorded pretty well.

The snare is getting buried under the louder guitars. The snare is also pretty dark sounding, and could maybe use a shelving eq to boost all frequencies over around 1k maybe just 2 or 3 dbs.

Also, the kick is very low in the mix. It is so quite I can't even tell you what it sounds like EQ or compression wise. If you can't turn it up anymore, I would suggest using a compressor to boost the overall volume of the kick. To do this and make it sound hopefully transparent, use a very low threshold. I would put it about as low is it can go. Set the attack to be as quick as possible, and you'll have to tailor the release to personal taste. For the ratio, set it very very low also. Start with 1.1:1, and move it slowly up from there. What you're essentially going to do here is decide about how many more dbs of volume the kick needs in the mix, and set your ratio until the compressor reduces the volume by that number of decibels, then set the makeup gain to that number of decibels. If done correctly, it will dramatically increase the volume of your kick without being able to really hear much compression. The only down side to this is less dynamic range in the track, but in something like a kick on this song, the track won't really have or need much range because of its purpose in the song. Hope this helps. Other than that, I think everything sounded really great for a newcomer. Keep up the good work, and let us know what else you've got coming down the pipe!!!

 

[mixsit]

ah thanks for the input. I guess the thing I am least happy with IS the reverb, and how the vocals and drums sit overall. especially when I do put less reverb on. I used drumkit from hell for that recording. I do like the drums, but I don't like the effects it puts on them. but saying that, it's the snare and toms that I have the biggest gripe with.

when it comes to the vocals, I kinda have them like that to reduce the hiss, so it could quite well be clouding my judgment? we are going to re record the vocals at some point. the original vocal track was duplicated 3 times to get it to that volume. I have no idea why it recorded so quietly. is it supposed to? I'm kinda surprised they came out as clear as they did. but no doubt they could be a lot clearer if that's the case?

I also dont know why the mixer's preamp channels have decided to stop working and only produce hiss (which might be what the problem with the vocals was to begin with). can a faulty XLR cable and/or phantom power damage that sorta thing? it was fine before recording the vocals. now not even guitars want to be hearable with the other jack. ehhhh.

It seems you do have some hardware problems then to straighten out. (I also wondered about what seemed like noise even on the intro?) You might try eliminating things, just the mic > mixer > sound card, mic > pre > s/c, until you sort out what's going on and get back to good normal levels.
Far as the mix- I'd say (once you're not fighting noise gate issues), just strip down almost all of those effects, compression and such- Rebuild it and take it as far as you can with just basics; levels, eq and panning. (Can you automate your track levels? Go there before resorting to compression-) That should take it 75% there to a good clean mix. Then dial in the fluff.
IMHO, starting at a solid honest mix will be quite a contrast.

 

[damzwarr]

I've never really tried using any automation. I know I can in cubase, but I guess I'll have to do some reading. in the meantime, I done some changes with the suggestions hopefully I've done ok? after export, at first it kinda sounded like I was listening down a hole, but forgot about winamps eq, lol. you can at least hear the kick a lot better, and I didn't realise at first, but the toms muted themselves somehow in the previous track. odd.

anyway, I can't work out if the vocals are any better, or the snare. the snare is more noticable now though and the vocals are a bit quieter.

http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=batch_download&batch_id=dVlybUpYT2JwcFVLSkE9PQ