How important is the bass guitar in your songs ?

I'm a drummer. My job is to work with the bass player to lock in the song's time and to create a groove. That being said, when I record, the only thing that matters is the drums, the bass, and the singer. I can hear the whole song when the bass player is doing their job, laying down the bottom, and the whole song's drive and soul is present even before I bring in any chordal instruments or lead instruments. The truth is; and guitar players will object; but no one...no one remembers the guitar solo. No one sings along with it, and no one picks a song as a favorite because of the guitar solo, even Eddie Van Halen's marvelous work on "Thriller" notwithstanding. The solos and chords are all part of the flavor, but not of the heart of a song. The bass is. It is everything. It is the orchestra. It is the soul. It is the heartbeat. I tell all singers, to put together your band first get the best drummer you can afford, and let them pick the bass player. Then go looking for the keys and guitars and horns.
NewYorkRod

grimtraveller said:
Does the bass play an important role in your songs and arrangements or is it kind of a shadow for the guitar riffs or rhythm ? Does it act as a countermelody or perform a strict 'rhythm team' function ?
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Rod Norman said:
I'm a drummer. My job is to work with the bass player to lock in the song's time and to create a groove. That being said, when I record, the only thing that matters is the drums, the bass, and the singer. I can hear the whole song when the bass player is doing their job, laying down the bottom, and the whole song's drive and soul is present even before I bring in any chordal instruments or lead instruments. The truth is; and guitar players will object; but no one...no one remembers the guitar solo. No one sings along with it, and no one picks a song as a favorite because of the guitar solo, even Eddie Van Halen's marvelous work on "Thriller" notwithstanding. The solos and chords are all part of the flavor, but not of the heart of a song. The bass is. It is everything. It is the orchestra. It is the soul. It is the heartbeat. I tell all singers, to put together your band first get the best drummer you can afford, and let them pick the bass player. Then go looking for the keys and guitars and horns.
NewYorkRod
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that's pretty true although I have to point out no one remembers the bass specifically either.
The song may be successful because of the bass, but no one really remembers the song for that.
 
grimtraveller said:
Does the bass play an important role in your songs and arrangements or is it kind of a shadow for the guitar riffs or rhythm ? Does it act as a countermelody or perform a strict 'rhythm team' function ?
Click to expand...



Without a Bass to drive it, and steer it into the right groove; there is no song.
 
I used to love listening to John Entwistle. The guy did absolutely innovative stuff. Later I got into Steve Harris, Geddy Lee, a little of Stanley Clarke and I always thought Andy West was way underrated. These guys pioneered "lead bass" and the "roaming" bass line. Never a huge fan of the Cliff Williams style of bass in music (how many A's can you play in a row?), and so I write a lot of stuff that is like the former and very little like the latter. But either way, bass is either used to hold the rhythm or drive the music with the drums while the keys and guitars counterpoint on the top. Just the way I've always played it. A lot of people tell me they can tell I'm a keyboardist by what I write, and I guess that's true. Been playing piano since 4 and guitar only 6 years...But I played bass for a living for 15 years.
 
"..love listening to John Entwistle. The guy did absolutely innovative stuff. Later I got into Steve Harris, Geddy Lee, a little of Stanley Clarke and I always thought Andy West was way underrated. These guys pioneered "lead bass" and the "roaming" bass line."




Precisely.
 
I saw a band on SNL the other night that used no bass. Two loud clean-ish guitars, two keyboards, drums. Not my kind of music, but it sure didn't miss the bass gtr at all.
 
not having bass guitar is not the same thing as not having bass.
I've seen lots of bands that used keys for bass.
hell ... the Rascals back in the 60's had no bass guitar so it's hardly a new thing.
But they had bass ..... they just got it from somewhere other than a bass guitar.
 
Lt. Bob said:
not having bass guitar is not the same thing as not having bass.
I've seen lots of bands that used keys for bass.
hell ... the Rascals back in the 60's had no bass guitar so it's hardly a new thing.
But they had bass ..... they just got it from somewhere other than a bass guitar.
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Right, but that's why I mentioned the Cramps and White Stripes. The Cramps originally had no bass gtr, or anything really even resembling a bass sound, and it still sounded fine. It was wild ass trippy psychobilly, but it still sounded full with two guitars. Later, they did eventually get a bass player and while they still sounded good, it wasn't the same. The White Stripes is just two people. Guitar and drums. I don't know if they pipe in some low end something live, or use bass on their records, but there's no real bass sound on their stuff that I know of.

Here's some old school Cramps.
 
Lt. Bob said:
that's pretty interesting stuff.
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Dude, The Cramps were bad ass. They pretty much invented psychobilly as we know it today. They got a little more "traditional" in their later years, but their early stuff is just wicked. Hasil Adkins did some dark stuff way back in the day, but The Cramps really brought it to the masses. No one was infusing horror movies, rockabilly, and punk before they came along. Great stuff in my opinion. Definitely one of my favorites. RIP Lux. :(
 
As a bassist, the bass has long held a truly important place in my stuff. I've composed many songs on just the bass, still do from time to time. I'm not really a fan of lead bass per se although there are some little doodles here and there that are brilliant. There are just so many different kinds of bass playing.
In 1990 I got into a band called Lifetime {it was the late 60s/early 70s outfit John McLaughlin was in before he formed the Mahavishnu Orchestra. He was simultaneously with Miles Davies} that had just guitar, organ and drums. The idea of no bass intrigued me conceptually but on their early albums, Khalid Yasin {Larry Young} the organist played the bass parts with the foot pedals on the organ, kind of like Ray Manzarek of the Doors. While many of the songs on the LPs "Emergency" and "Turn it over" are wicked {on some of the latter, Jack Bruce plays bass guitar}, not having a double bass or bass guitar but having bass parts feels, unconvincing, if I just concentrate on the bass. I wasn't disappointed with the albums, they're damn good, but conceptually it didn't feel like something amazing not having a bass guitar.
Then the following year, I got into Irish folk and folk rock and I came upon an obscure but legendary album by a duo called Callinan~Flynn called "Freedom's lament". I remember reading a review of it inTower records' free magazine that described it as "Irish folk played on rock instruments", which intrigued me no end but which turned out to be somewhat deceptive. Anyway, on a couple of the songs, there's the two guys playing acoustic guitars and a drummer drumming. It was the first time I recall being conscious of that kind of combination and I loved it. It kind of resonated with me and when I got around to recording the following year, it naturally followed that some of the songs carried that kind of bassless sound. In the ensuing year I'd been jamming with just me on acoustic guitar and my mate on drums so it felt very natural to me. It still does when I choose to utilize that format.
What I sometimes found was that I loved the sound of the acoustic guitar's chords but once the song was filled out, especially with the bass, the beauty of the chords would disappear. I've done a few either remakes of songs involving no bass guitar or used the same chord structures in other songs, with no bass in those parts to highlight the guitar chords.
 
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