How do people mix on hardware mixers??

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BBlack

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I always read about and see people mixing tracks on hardware mixers. I'm so used to programs like Logic so I don't really understand. Are they running the instruments into the mixer, the mixer into an external multitrack, and running the multitrack back into the mixer to be able to use the controls on the mixer to adjust levels/EQ of the already recorded tracks? Or are they using a multitrack recorder with a built-in mixing board....

I'm really confused. I'd like for someone to clear this up for me.

And hopefully my question makes sense..

Thanks
 
Both. Some people would be running the tracks from the computer into a mixer to use the mixer's eq etc... but other people might only have a few inputs into their computer but a zillion drum mics so they'll use a mixer to submix the mics onto a few computer tracks.

In the old days you'd have a huge board, say 48 channels, and you'd have say 20 mics plugged into it from your drums, vocal mics, direct ins from a bass, etc... and on the mixer you'd adjust stuff like the compression so you could record the sound loud and get less tape hiss.
Those tracks would go direct out to a 24 ch reel to reel tape recorder, and then the outputs of the reel to reel, the recorded tracks, would come back into the mixer. Then you'd play the tracks on the reel to reel and mix on the board... adjusting volumes, eq, compression, reverb panning etc... and mix down to a second tape recorder, a two track reel to reel, and that would be your master. This was about where the industry had arrived by around 1980. The sound was very good.

All computer recording came from that basic game plan.

I run the tracks out of the computer into a mixer in order to use old analog gear that I have that I like to use. I don't use a mixer going into the computer. If you can get your sound entirely from the computer you're fine without a mixer. :)
 
BBlack said:
How do people mix on hardware mixers??
Click to expand...

With pleasure. :)

You pretty much have the idea...mics/intruments go into the mixer per channel, and so do the inputs/outputs of a multitrack tape deck or a DAW with multiple A/D/A channels.

I use both...tracking to a tape deck while using the mixer primarily for cue mixes and rough EQ/FX during the tracking phase...then I'll dump my tape tracks into my DAW, do my edits and then I mix from the DAW back out through my console using the mixer and outboard gear for EQ & processing, not any DAW plug-ins.
I can still use the DAW for some processing too, like for small sections and spot stuff, and also for some level automation type of stuff, but the bulk of the mixdwin is down with the console and outboard gear.

I then record that final stereo mix to a 2-track tape deck and simultaneoulsy output the playback from the tape deck into the DAW and record that also digitally.
 
I use hardware mixers almost exclusively (DAW stuff is just not intuitive to me). Usually I do my stuff using 2 inputs at a time (one mic and one direct, or 2 stereo line), so it's easy to just go right into the digital recorder. When I do my drum parts though I use 4 mics so I set up a sub-mix on an analog 4 track, cue the recorder back into it so I can play along with the guitar part in headphones. This way I can listen back over the drum mix and adjust levels of each particular mic, before 2-tracking it back into the digital recorder. The digital is a 'workstation' with knobs and sliders and effect sends and all that, but only 2 inputs, so I have to line in the drum submix separately once I'm happy with the mic balance. Once all the tracks are assembled to the hard disk recorder, mixing is just the same as with a DAW, except you run a real effect send/return loop instead of plug-ins. Mastering is done by running a line out of the final recorder, through all the EQ and compression stuff, and back into the other recorder. Having 2 mixer/recorders to jump back and forth between makes life much easier. The older extremely expensive recorders could do both at the same time the way they were routed, but the budget buy setup I use its just much easier to bounce back and forth between 2 recorders with built in mixing boards, adjusting a bit each time as I go.
 
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Just an an FYI for the OP, there are two types of console.

The in-line, and the split.

The in-line console uses the channel strip to track through and mix down to a master tape. After tracking, to monitor what you just recorded the channel is set up to receive the signal from the tape machine just by pressing a 'tape' or 'flip' button on that particular channel strip.

The split console uses one set of channels to track through to the machine, and a separate set of channels farther down on the desk for the tape returns.

Any console with enough channels can be set up as a split board, but some are designed that way.
 
dintymoore said:
In the old days
Click to expand...

I guess that makes me an old fart.

Having done it both ways i do not prefer mixing the old way. once the project was set up in the board and processing was routed you had to stay on that project till you were happy with it. I like being able to work on a mix for awhile, save it, go to another mix, save it, etc.
 
Alright....man this is confusing. Where on the mixer do the cables come from coming out of the mixer into the tape deck, and where do they come out of the tape deck and where do they come back into the mixer? I don't think I can use my computer for what I've been describing, because I don't have an external sound card, therefore I can only bring in the final stereo mix. Can a compact mixer, say, a Mackie 1202 be used for the final mix? Or is it only the big desk consoles that have all the ins and outs for that?

I'd like to record in all analog (apart from digitalizing the final mix), and I'd like to use an outboard mixer to mix. Could someone list the necessary pieces of equipment I'd need for that to make some decent recordings? I'm willing to go retro.
 
To be honest there's probably little point in doing this with a cheap/compact mixer, and that's even if you can find one with the necessary I/O like you are asking about. This kind of setup is only really worth it if you can go all-out and buy a decent console and some nice outboard - the kind of setup that is way out of the budget of most of us home recordists - but for the kind of setup you're asking about, I think you'd going to be severely limiting yourself in numerous ways by trying to chase down such a path.

Why don't you want to continue recording using a computer? You could get a control surface to give you some tactile control over the mix.
 
I think you're right. I just sort of discovered Firewire Interfaces and I'm thinking I'll sell all I have right now and invest in one of those.

BUT do I need an external soundcard to plug it into? Or can it go directly into the computer's line-in?

AND does it record onto separate tracks in a program like Logic? Like if I were to record my band, everything mic'd and running into the interface, could I record each instrument on a separate track and mix?

THANK YOU ALL!
 
BBlack said:
BUT do I need an external soundcard to plug it into?
Click to expand...
No, a interface is an external soundcard.

BBlack said:
Or can it go directly into the computer's line-in?
Click to expand...
No, you completely bypass your current soundcard. It plugs into Firewire, hence being a Firewire interface :p (...or you could get a USB interface).

BBlack said:
AND does it record onto separate tracks in a program like Logic? Like if I were to record my band, everything mic'd and running into the interface, could I record each instrument on a separate track and mix?
Click to expand...
With 99% of interfaces, yes. This is their purpose!

Just be wary of the other 1%, which are some of the cheaper 'USB mixers' that only send the stereo mix over USB and not the discrete channels.
 
I commend anyone who can mix with a mouse.

Me, I like mah knobs. So such thing as too many knobs. Knobs, are good karma.

And faders, which are knobs but they go long wise :)
 
Well I'm thinking about the MOTU 8Pre.

I need to sell my Yamaha minidisc 4 track though...

ANYONE?
 
clivus said:
I guess that makes me an old fart.

Having done it both ways i do not prefer mixing the old way. once the project was set up in the board and processing was routed you had to stay on that project till you were happy with it. I like being able to work on a mix for awhile, save it, go to another mix, save it, etc.
Click to expand...

That's what they invented total recall for :D ;)
 
i have a question then, say when you have the 24 ch tape machine going back into the desk and you are mixing, if there is one part really bugging, like a kick you just cant get the EQ right on, if you play the tape like 100 times (bit drastic) to mix it, will the sound lose quality from overplaying the tape? and if so would it be noticeable?

i dont have any tape machines or anything, its just a general curiosity
 
Yes, the oxide wears with every pass. The Rumours multi-track tape experienced this from very long mixing sessions. It was so bad the highs were disappearing and the bass was losing its punch.

They had a safety copy in reserve.
 
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