Hope you don't mind some noob-questions!

[Logicman991]

Ok, so I've just recently started getting into recording. I have played guitar for about 4 years and played around with Logic Pro a lot without really getting too much into the recording part of the DAW. The last few days I have searched forums trying to learn some of the basics in recording, and I'm for the moment focusing primarily on electric guitar recording, considering guitar is the only instrument i can play and the only one i have. I'm using an SM57 for the recording, a Fast Track Ultra preamp and my DAW is Logic Pro.

So far i have experimented with different mic-placements on the amp and played around with panning and EQ and mixing in general. I have not achieved the sound I'm looking for yet, and i know that, with the equipment i have, it should be possible to get an at least decent quality recording. I really want to learn more about recording so i can get a good sound, and now I felt the best way to continue learning was to join a recording forum and read and make threads.

So I've just listed up some questions that i could think of right now. If some of you would take your time to answer at least 1 of the questions I'd be more than happy!
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- I'm currently using a cheap Epiphone guitar that, when i bought it, had a decent sound, but now the screw at where the jack goes in has fallen of, i think there are some internal damages because it's been through some abuse, and the sound is -- although not THAT bad -- crap compared to more expensive guitars. So the question here is; exactly how important is the guitar for how the quality of the recoding will end up? I mean, would I notice a very big difference if I had a guitar that costed around 1000$ opposed the the 300-400$ guitar i have now? And what about strings and guitar jack? Any difference there?

- What exactly does "quad tracking" mean?

- I've read that many people like to duplicate the rhythm track so there are two; one panned hard left and one hard right. By this, does it mean to actually just copy the track in the DAW, or does it mean to record new audio and make sure to play so that it will get identical with the first track?
And also I've read that, to make the two tracks distinguishable, it can be effective to add different effects(EQ also?) to them. What could i for example do to distinguish them?

- So it's pretty common to have two tracks with rhythm guitar panned hard to each side, but what about panning the lead guitar? So far I've experimented and found out that if there is a guitar on top of the rhythm, it can sound good to pan it 100% to one of the sides. And by the way, I've understood now that it's quite normal having two rhythm tracks, but what about lead?

- What are some basic rules of EQing guitars in a mix? I know what EQing is and have experimented quite a lot with it, but i have no clue how to EQ properly to make the mix sound better. Instead, i often make things sound worse when touching the EQ, so sometimes i just stick with the preset "classic guitar improvement", and although it sometimes work in some degree, i would like to learn how to use EQ by myself to achieve a good sound.

If i come up with more questions, I'll just post 'em in this thread.

 

[gazzab]

- I've read that many people like to duplicate the rhythm track so there are two; one panned hard left and one hard right. By this, does it mean to actually just copy the track in the DAW, or does it mean to record new audio and make sure to play so that it will get identical with the first track?
And also I've read that, to make the two tracks distinguishable, it can be effective to add different effects(EQ also?) to them. What could i for example do to distinguish them?

- So it's pretty common to have two tracks with rhythm guitar panned hard to each side, but what about panning the lead guitar? So far I've experimented and found out that if there is a guitar on top of the rhythm, it can sound good to pan it 100% to one of the sides. And by the way, I've understood now that it's quite normal having two rhythm tracks, but what about lead?

- What are some basic rules of EQing guitars in a mix? I know what EQing is and have experimented quite a lot with it, but i have no clue how to EQ properly to make the mix sound better. Instead, i often make things sound worse when touching the EQ, so sometimes i just stick with the preset "classic guitar improvement", and although it sometimes work in some degree, i would like to learn how to use EQ by myself to achieve a good sound.

If i come up with more questions, I'll just post 'em in this thread.

These are about the only questions I can try and answer

If you set up two audio tracks in Logic and lock them both to record, you can record onto both tracks then pan them hard left and hard right. I'm not too sure about 'distinguishing' them from eachother.

Panning the lead guitar would depend on how you want it to sit in the mix with the other instruments (if there are any). If I had other instruments or other guitar parts I'd pan it maybe 70% one way, with the other guitar parts 70% the other way, and other instruments panned different amounts either side depending on where they sound best. It's all subjective really, I don't think there's a 'right' way of doing it but it can be helpful to pan instruments which are playing the same notes/frequencies on opposite sides to eachother.

When I use an EQ I make a thin spike in it and turn the gain up all the way, then run it up and down the frequencies whilst playing the recording to find the spot that makes it sound how I want it to sound, then I play around with the waveform until it sounds best. Sometimes it's good to add several spikes in different areas to boost the volume of different frequencies and 'beef up' the sound. Also, if you're getting some frequencies which are interfering with other sounds in the mix (like getting a strong low end from a lead guitar that interferes with your bass guitar) it might be worth reducing that frequency or getting rid of it altogether.

I'm sure there are far more experienced people who can help you with the rest

 

[Chili]

would I notice a very big difference if I had a guitar that costed around 1000$ opposed the the 300-400$ guitar i have now?

I am, by far, NOT an expert on guitars and others might jump in with better advice, but I say don't judge the tone of a guitar by its price tag. If you said it sounded good when you first got it, it probably still sounds the same now. (With the exception of some repairs, I guess)

I've read that many people like to duplicate the rhythm track so there are two

There are two ways to accomplish this, both yield a different sound. The first is to copy an existing track and add a delay by 'nudging' one track a few milliseconds, then panning both tracks to opposite extremes. This gives a very wide stereo feel to one guitar. The other way is to play the guitar part twice using either the same sound from amp and guitar, or a different sound. Then pan the two tracks opposite each other. This gives a more lush, full guitar sound. What you don't want to do is just copy and paste a track. That will do nothing except raise teh volume which you can do with the fader.

but what about lead?

Panning the lead guitar is something done by preference. Experiment, if it sounds good, it is good. I usually leave my solo instruments straight up the middle.

What are some basic rules of EQing guitars in a mix?

The only rule I follow is to cut the low freq's on guitars so they don't compete with the bass or kick. But there are no rules for anything, just guidelines. You do what you have to make your mix sound good. EQ'ing is only part of the equation. You also have levels, space/panning, time-domain, etc to adjust to place your tracks in the sound stage.

Welcome to the site.

 

[Paulie Jay]

I am, by far, NOT an expert on guitars and others might jump in with better advice, but I say don't judge the tone of a guitar by its price tag. If you said it sounded good when you first got it, it probably still sounds the same now. (With the exception of some repairs, I guess)

I'll second this. While there is an expectation that the more money you spend on a guitar the better the tone should be (and in many cases this is quite correct, but the term "better" is subjective), the important thing to decide is what kind of tone do you want? If you like what you hear, that's all that matters. You might find that the tone you really want may only be achieved via a $3000 custom job, or it might be achieved with a $100 pawn shop special and a 1 watt battery powered mini Marshall amp.

 

[Chibi Nappa]

- I'm currently using a cheap Epiphone guitar that, when i bought it, had a decent sound, but now the screw at where the jack goes in has fallen of, i think there are some internal damages because it's been through some abuse, and the sound is -- although not THAT bad -- crap compared to more expensive guitars. So the question here is; exactly how important is the guitar for how the quality of the recoding will end up? I mean, would I notice a very big difference if I had a guitar that costed around 1000$ opposed the the 300-400$ guitar i have now? And what about strings and guitar jack? Any difference there?

Price tag is not an entirely reliable indicator, but the guitar itself is extremely important.

- I've read that many people like to duplicate the rhythm track so there are two; one panned hard left and one hard right. By this, does it mean to actually just copy the track in the DAW, or does it mean to record new audio and make sure to play so that it will get identical with the first track?

99.999% of the time it means actually playing the part twice and recording it twice. Many times with a different guitar, amp, performer, or any combination of the above.

So it's pretty common to have two tracks with rhythm guitar panned hard to each side, but what about panning the lead guitar? So far I've experimented and found out that if there is a guitar on top of the rhythm, it can sound good to pan it 100% to one of the sides. And by the way, I've understood now that it's quite normal having two rhythm tracks, but what about lead?

It takes half a lifetime to learn about song arrangement, so I can't give any kind of meaningful answer here aside from listen to a huge variety of professional CDs and try and understand why they double what they double. I imagine there are just as many times when a double lead works as there are that a single rhythm works. You could probably make any song work that way if you built the arrangement around it.

The important thing is to have a purpose for what you do. Don't double "X" just because "you're supposed to double 'X'". You double something because there is an empty space in your song arrangement and a new, different part doesn't make musical sense.

- What are some basic rules of EQing guitars in a mix? I know what EQing is and have experimented quite a lot with it, but i have no clue how to EQ properly to make the mix sound better. Instead, i often make things sound worse when touching the EQ, so sometimes i just stick with the preset "classic guitar improvement", and although it sometimes work in some degree, i would like to learn how to use EQ by myself to achieve a good sound.

EQ doesn't really work like other effects. You can say "how do I distort a guitar" and I could at least point you in a direction, but not so with EQ.

You want to try and do your "EQ" when you record. Different mics change the EQ. Different placement of the mics change the EQ. Different pickup selections change the EQ. The EQ knobs on your guitar amp change the EQ (obviously). And so on.

The point is that after you record it, you should not have to use any EQ at all. But since the world is not perfect, there is a good chance that anybody will miss the mark more often than not. You mix EQ corrects your "miss". Since there is no way of knowing where or how a recording misses until the recording is made, there is no way to say whether a low cut or a high boost will correct it.

You record the correct sound to begin with.
You nudge it into place with EQ since nobody's perfect.

 

[Chibi Nappa]

a 1 watt battery powered mini Marshall amp.

Lol. Ain't it the truth? I did two KILLER tracks with one of those this weekend.

 

[AlanSwenson]

I'll second this. While there is an expectation that the more money you spend on a guitar the better the tone should be (and in many cases this is quite correct, but the term "better" is subjective), the important thing to decide is what kind of tone do you want? If you like what you hear, that's all that matters. You might find that the tone you really want may only be achieved via a $3000 custom job, or it might be achieved with a $100 pawn shop special and a 1 watt battery powered mini Marshall amp.

Plus you can't just upgrade your guitar... the sm57 will still be good for any guitar but maybe you don't have an awesome amp and now once you upgrade the amp to the way you want it you need to upgrade your preamp to get a cleaner tone. Then after you do all that, you'll think if only I bought a $12,000 guitar and a neve console and so on. . . the grass will always be greener.

 

[Logicman991]

Thanks for all the answers, definitely learned a lot from them!

I got some others that i forgot to ask:

- I already have an sm57, but i have seen some vids where people use two and claim that it gives a better sound(yes, know it's a matter of preference). Would i notice much difference in using 1 and 2 sm57's? So much that it may be worth buying a second?

- I may have misunderstood the terms stereo and mono a little, so this may sound really stupid: If I have two rhythm-tracks recorded in stereo, does the same principles go for panning? Could i still pan them hard left and hard right?

- If you record instruments in mono and pan them to different sides, does that mean the instruments alone is in mono but the song as a whole is stereo?

 

[Armistice]

It takes half a lifetime to learn about song arrangement

What, you mean there's no EzySongArranger program or plug-in?

That sux man...

Can someone get onto it?

 

[Logicman991]

You record the correct sound to begin with.
You nudge it into place with EQ since nobody's perfect.

Btw, this goes against some of the things I've seen many people do. They for example cut the lows on the guitar to make room for the bass and so on.

 

[LDS]

Doubling guitar tracks by recording them multiple times can be a great tool - if your playing is consistent enough ( I know mine rarely is). If done properly, it can make the guitar sound absolutley huge. Miss by just a little bit and the guitar can sound very thin and wimpy.

A great example of how doubled (and tripled and even more) tracks of guitar can enhance sound is Joe Satriani's "Flying in a Blue Dream" CD. Listen to the tracks on it panned hard left and then hard right, and you can pick up all kinds of tricks. Satch is a master at layering multiple takes of guitar.

As far as your guitar goes, do everything you can to make it sound as good as possible live. Bad output jacks and faulty wiring can lead to inconsistent tone and volume, you probably need to get those looked at. Usually the fix is quick and inexpensive.

 

[Chibi Nappa]

Btw, this goes against some of the things I've seen many people do. They for example cut the lows on the guitar to make room for the bass and so on.

Many people still have much to learn.


Don't use a guitar tone that fights with the bass in the first place.
Don't write a song arrangement that puts the guitar and bass at odds in the first place.

It could be as simple as turning down the bass knob on the guitar amp. Note that this is a different beast than turning down the bass on an already recorded guitar track.
It could be as simple as instructing the guitar player to play less notes for a measure or two when the bass does a fill.

Don't assume that the bass and guitar even want to be out of each other's way in the first place. A lot of 80's and 90's hard rock sort of blended the bass and guitars together just as a "big sound". Listen to Appetite for Destruction of Siamese Dream. Many of those basses are quite happy masquerading as low guitar notes.



The point is you shouldn't record something that doesn't work.