"Heavy" guitar sound

  • Thread starter Thread starter Nilbog
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Nilbog

Nilbog

hello
How do I get a really Heavy, full sounding (distortion) guitar. I'm Micing my amp with an SM57, and adding a little Reverb and Delat with an ART FX1 box. My sound is just flat and weak sounding. Any ideas?
-Nilbog
 
Have you tried double, triple, quadrupleing the guitars? that may help. Also to get a good tone on tape, you need good tone coming out of your amp. what kind do you have?
 
I'm using a little Squire 15 practice amp. Yeah, I know it sucks, but it's what I got, and I can ctually get a semi-decent sound out of it. How would I go about doubling the guitar? Copy it to another track, then mix the two together on another track?
-N
p.s. You broke the chat room.
 
I'd record the track multiple times... the slight variances add a sense of depth. Try different tones and EQ on the different tracks, too. That allows both tracks to occupy it's own "sonic space".
 
Can't but agree with them Nilbog... I usually do at least 4, sometimes 6 rhythm tracks. Everyone a new take... the slight variances in how play each take will make your guitar sound awesome. I know it sound strange but it's true. When I play back one of guitar tracks by itself, I always find that there is nothing particularly special about it... but add another 5 guitars... and KAPOW!!! you're in business.

I'd personally get rid of the delay, I think a touch of reverb can be ok, but usually don't bother... I always find these tend to muddy things up a bit...

I'd also crank the volume if you don't have feedback problems and get real close with the mic.
 
Other then what was suggested ( good stuff although coopermans 6 guitar's sounds a little more like breaking down a wall to dust :) )

You can also try to:

* Compress for a in the face sound
* full volume on the amp - most amps sound more full when turned up
* try to EQ around the 500-600Hz - were most of the body and punch can lay

* Try to mix a direct and amped sound by using a DI. Then to a amp from the di's out to amp jack. Then use a mic on the amp. So you have 2 channals - 1.direct and 1.amped.
Mix them to your liking.






[This message has been edited by Shailat (edited 06-13-2000).]
 
I usually just use a heavier guitar, like a Les Paul.... :)

You may also consider using a large diaphram condenser mic too. The low end response is better. I think a boost around 200-250 works better then 500-600 like Shailat suggests, but that is more my preference. You console, and recording system in general will determine this.

I think though for the truely killer sounding guitar sounds, you gotta have it on analog tape. One of the disadvantages of digital recording is that distorted guitar just don't have that same saturated sound that analog does.

Ed
 
Ed,

Forget for a sec about the console and recording stuff etc....

I find that a boost at 200Hz tends to muddy the sound and sometimes make the sound dull. Actully a cut at 200Hz can add more punch and clarity - leaving room for the lows and highs.

What do you think !?
 
Well, I use boost around 500-800Hz with everything except Heavy Metal type stuff, then it is the 250 bump.... :). It really just depends on what type of sound you have on tape.

Ed
 
Breaking down a wall to dust - I think that's actually a very good description of how you should go about recording a good rhythm guitar sound...

I've always considered that when laying down rhythm guitar tracks you've got to have a workman-like attitude - you've just got to push on as hard as you can and get the job done - even if it does mean a lot of takes.

To my ears, there is nothing worse than have a potentially good song ruined by not taking the time to record the guitars properly. I would say that most metal bands use at least 4 guitar tracks(2L&2R).

The hard part is when all the other instruments cut out leaving one guitar - this of course is doubled... you have to be very patient making sure that that the 2 different guitar tracks sounds like only one.

Nilbog... once you've done some experimenting, why don't you post a short 10-15sec mp3 of what you can record and then we can give you some more ideas.



[This message has been edited by Cooperman (edited 06-13-2000).]
 
I'll have to agree with prick...er, I mean Sonusman about the tape. I know I was disapointed when I first got my Cakewalk going and the VS880EX. Very thin. My old Fostex 8 just makes the distorted guitar sounds phatter. Even my old Teac 4. Even my old Tascam 4. Even any old damn tape deck I have makes it sound better. Shit. And that pisses me off.
 
Hey Nilbog,
I tend to disagree with the technique of laying down multiple tracks over and over. This is good but 4 me it tends to soften(or give a stereo chorus effect) the sound. What I like to do is keep the amp turned down and double mic, one on the edge of the speaker the other towards the center of the speaker. The reason I dont like the amp full blast is that you may lose head room. Ive tried 3 mics and 4 but found that 2 is the best for me. Good luck.
 
yo, If you have a million tracks to work with, then go with the idea of layering more than 1. The only thing with that is that you gotta make sure you play it the exact same way every time. If you don't, you're whole sound will sound muddy when you're done. I use the POD. Sometimes I hate the sound coming out of it and wish I never bought it, but as I get better at finding a good tone just by playin around with everything, I realize what a piece of equiptment it is. For micing the amp, here's how you get a fuller sound. First of all, the different frequencies of the amp travel at different wavelengths. So if you put one mic right up to the speaker, you're only gonna get the highs, even though when you listen to it you hear a good sound, because you're standing further away which lets the sounds blend together. Try putting one up to the speaker, then putting a condenser in the middle of the room 5-10' from the amp. This way you'll pick up more of what you hear, plus the "natural room" sound, so you won't have to add as much reverb to the amp (also leads to muddiness). Good luck man.
 
DUN-dun-dun-DUN-dun-dun-DUN-dadda-dahdda!

Momma's talkin to me try to tell me how to live!

DUN-dun-dun-DUN-dun-dun-DUN-Dunda-DUNDA!

But I can't even hear her 'cause my head is like a sive!

(couldn't help myself!)
 
I can't help but agree with Gonzo. Multiple micing works fine for me. What I generally do is have 2 57s one real close to the amp and one say a feet (or two, depending on the gain of your amp) away. Mix them together and see which gives more of the sound you're looking for. You can even try 3 mics, one behind the amp(Only if you have an open back amp) Crank up the volume of your amp and get a really hot signal in.
 
Try to record in a "live-sounding" room rather than a dead one.

Use a close mike on the cab's speaker for definition, and a second "ambient" room mike for depth. Where you place this ambient mike is a more of an art than a science. The soud will vary greatlys as you move the mike. If possible, listen to the sounds in various differnt places. Have one person play the guitar, one person move the mike around, and a third listen to the sound being captured.

Try to catch sound bouncing off of hard wood floors ot tile walls.

Once you have both sounds on tape, you can mix and blend them until they sound the way you want them.
 
Man, You Need Tubes in your amp, and 4-10's in your cab for that PUNCH!, with an SM-57 wearin' a hole in the grille clothe. off to the side of the speaker not centered. About 4-5 tracks of it. I read where jerry cantrells (AIC) bigass chunky rhythms come from six tracks of different tone set-ups like maybe 4-12's, or 4-10's, or 2-12's, or more verb, and stuff. They gotta be different for the sonic value like pglewis was saying. They can't just be copies. :)
That's the way uh-huh! uh-huh!
 
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