Has anyone heard the M-Audio BX8s?

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TheDewd said:
Well, this is one of the reasons I mix with high quality headphone systems.....

People should definitely spend more time establishing a "as flat as possible" monitoring environment.
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Just curious...in your quest for flatness, have you ever looked at the response curves of high quality headphones?
 
stevetat said:
Just curious...in your quest for flatness, have you ever looked at the response curves of high quality headphones?
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Yes, they are diffuse-field equalised to compensate for the proximity effect of the drivers to the ears. The result (when combined with the proximity effect) is a near perfect flat response.
 
TheDewd said:
Yes, they are diffuse-field equalised to compensate for the proximity effect of the drivers to the ears. The result (when combined with the proximity effect) is a near perfect flat response.
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And you measure that how...?
 
stevetat said:
And you measure that how...?
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How do you measure ?
With instruments, artifical ears and test benches.
How do you think the engineers tweak the diffuse-field curve?
They test and try out what it takes so that the resulting measured curve from the artificial ear is as flat as possible.
 
TheDewd said:
How do you measure ?
With instruments, artifical ears and test benches.
How do you think the engineers decide the diffuse-field cirve?
They test and try out what it takes so that the resulting measured curve from the artificial ear is as flat as possible.
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I know how I measure...I have a KEMAR head and SYSid acousitc analyzer.

The question was, how do YOU measure?
 
stevetat said:
I know how I measure...I have a KEMAR head and SYSid acousitc analyzer.

The question was, how do YOU measure?
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I trust the engineers that made the headphones I use.
 
I vote that Dewd's new handle be "Tokyo Rose". Or maybe "Baghdad Bob."

G.
 
stevetat said:
Well, anyway....the point is that even high quality headsets are far from flat (in spite of TheDewd's claims to the contrary).

Follow the link to a site showing response curves for a bunch of popular designs from AKG, Beyer, Etymotic, Grado, Koss, Sennheiser, etc...

http://www.headphone.com/technical/product-measurements/build-a-graph/
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Yes, some of them are far from flat, that's because of the diffuse-field equalization used on the best models.
The proximity effect directly opposes the diffuse-field equalization that is showing in these graphs and form a flat frequency response.
Also, I highly doubt you can get this flat of a frequency response with speakers, unless you pay $200k for room treatment and HUGE far field monitors with triamping. There is NO WAY small chineese asian cheapo nearfields will get even CLOSE to this flat.

Headphones are made to compensate for the ears and isolate the room.
Speakers, when put into a less than perfect room, tend to sound bad and speaker manufacturers don't take into account the morphology of the headphone user...so there you go...all in all, headphones are much flatter than monitors $ for $

Obviously, a great tuned room with far fields would be my preference over headphones, but who has this luxury ?
 
Dewd, you never cease to amaze me just how much disinformation you can spread in one day. You are prolific, I'll give you that. :rolleyes:

G.
 
TheDewd said:
Yes, some of them are far from flat, that's because of the diffuse-field equalization used on the best models.
The proximity effect directly opposes the diffuse-field equalization that is showing in these graphs and form a flat frequency response.
Also, I highly doubt you can get this flat of a frequency response with speakers, unless you pay $200k for room treatment and HUGE far field monitors with triamping. There is NO WAY small chineese asian cheapo nearfields will get even CLOSE to this flat.

Headphones are made to compensate for the ears and isolate the room.
Speakers, when put into a less than perfect room, tend to sound bad and speaker manufacturers don't take into account the morphology of the headphone user...so there you go...all in all, headphones are much flatter than monitors $ for $

Obviously, a great tuned room with far fields would be my preference over headphones, but who has this luxury ?
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so you mix with headphones?
I honestly can't see the positives of doing so out weighing the negatives of what you get in the end
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
Dewd, you never cease to amaze me just how much disinformation you can spread in one day. You are prolific, I'll give you that. :rolleyes:

G.
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Disinformation ?
It's not my fault if headphones are flatter than monitors $ for $....you have to accept things like they are.
 
I think I will just start mixing with my eyes....Get me one of them Spectro-McAnylizers or something....
 
Dogman said:
I think I will just start mixing with my eyes....Get me one of them Spectro-McAnylizers or something....
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Well, as we learn in engineering school, you have to use as much input as you can, under all circumstances.
Use your ears, eyes, nose, whatever...but don't rely on only ONE source or you will end up compensating the wrong way.

This HAR-BAL stuff is very interesting as it exposes where your mix and tracking is lacking in terms of frequency balance.
 
TheDewd said:
Disinformation ?
It's not my fault if headphones are flatter than monitors $ for $....you have to accept things like they are.
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So you are pretty much the only person I have ever seen among thousands of recording folks who thinks that headphones are a good option for mixing. Welcome to the majority of one.









TheDewd said:
Well, as we learn in engineering school,
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What engineering school did you go to? And is that where they taught you to use headphones to mix. And to they recommend taking a year to make something good enough to post on a message board for others to hear?
 
Thunder33 said:
So you are pretty much the only person I have ever seen among thousands of recording folks who thinks that headphones are a good option for mixing. Welcome to the majority of one.











What engineering school did you go to? And is that where they taught you to use headphones to mix. And to they recommend taking a year to make something good enough to post on a message board for others to hear?
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First, I'm not one to follow the pack and say like every other dude. I make my own opinion and stick to it. You don't change mentalities by sticking to the pack.

Second, it's electrical engineering, not sound engineering (which isn't considered engineering here in Canada anyways...). I'm a self-made home recordist and I do this as a hobby, serious nonetheless, but it's not my main occupation. I do not own a studio and I do not mix other people's shit. I do everything by myself (tracking, mixing, mastering) and am proud of it and what I do, my bandmates and people/producers that get to listen to my band's demos agree. So if you are waiting for me to satisfy you, better get back to mixing on your Pulsartech $70 monitors...

Ohh..and don't forget to improve that guitar tone I was talking about in another post...
 
TheDewd said:
First, I'm not one to follow the pack and say like every other dude. I make my own opinion and stick to it. You don't change mentalities by sticking to the pack.

Second, it's electrical engineering, not sound engineering (which isn't considered engineering here in Canada anyways...). I'm a self-made home recordist and I do this as a hobby, serious nonetheless, but it's not my main occupation. I do not own a studio and I do not mix other people's shit. I do everything by myself (tracking, mixing, mastering) and am proud of it and what I do, my bandmates and people/producers that get to listen to my band's demos agree. So if you are waiting for me to satisfy you, better get back to mixing on your Pulsartech $70 monitors...

Ohh..and don't forget to improve that guitar tone I was talking about in another post...
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I figured you would weasel out like that.
 
Thunder33 said:
I figured you would weasel out like that.
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Weasel? Well, when you desperatly try to rub someone's ego and that this particular someone is mature enough so that he doesn't mind getting his ego rubbed, you get stuck in a hole...like you are trying to get myself push out mixes...hahaha...you act like a kid dude...seriously, I've had arguments with almost everyone on this board and you are the most childish along with BlueBear.

So, how are your pulsartech monitors and guitar tone --> playing your game...
 
TheDewd said:
Weasel? Well, when you desperatly try to rub someone's ego and that this particular someone is mature enough so that he doesn't mind getting his ego rubbed, you get stuck in a hole...like you are trying to get myself push out mixes...hahaha...you act like a kid dude...seriously, I've had arguments with almost everyone on this board and you are the most childish along with BlueBear.

So, how are your pulsartech monitors and guitar tone --> playing your game...
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Yeah. Keep weaseling. Nice rep.
 
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