DavidK
New member
Cool tune. I will join everyone else in saying boost the vox. Drums could be a hair louder too. The song itself is very good and interesting words. The sax is pretty funky, I wasnt expecting it 
true-eurt
Maneater
Okay...pm on the way!!Freudian Slip said:Would I offer if I wasn't? Ya I have it downloaded just for youJust pm me your email.
F.S.
Thank you very very much Freud!!!
B
bigbubba
New member
RayC,
Cool song. The chorus is pretty catchy in places. Like "pop" catchy. Which is a good thing.
1 - Cool song.
2 - Nice rhythm palying. Very nice.
3 - The tamborines (or what-have-you during the chorus) is nice.
4 - Nice kick.
Suggestions.
1 - Reduce the rhythm guitar in volume by 4-5dbs. The way it's played, it's a rhythm driver and not the main focus. The focus is the lyrics and the vocal passion. Especially during the chorus.
2 - Raise the vox by about 3-4db.
3 - Raise the cymbals to about the same vol. as the tambs.
1 & 2 might sound cool if you really lower the rhythm during the verses and the then raise it some during the chorus. Even with slightly different verb or Chorus effect added.
4 - The trumpet (someone said horns) solo is cool and a touch louder than the rest of the band. I don't know what the proper fix is. I'd add a touch verb and lower the vol. And to let it shine still, lower the rhythm even more than your previously lowered (in part 1) level during this part.
The chorus has some nice lyrics that have that substance that needs to be heard rather than ignored.
Cool song. The chorus is pretty catchy in places. Like "pop" catchy. Which is a good thing.
1 - Cool song.
2 - Nice rhythm palying. Very nice.
3 - The tamborines (or what-have-you during the chorus) is nice.
4 - Nice kick.
Suggestions.
1 - Reduce the rhythm guitar in volume by 4-5dbs. The way it's played, it's a rhythm driver and not the main focus. The focus is the lyrics and the vocal passion. Especially during the chorus.
2 - Raise the vox by about 3-4db.
3 - Raise the cymbals to about the same vol. as the tambs.
1 & 2 might sound cool if you really lower the rhythm during the verses and the then raise it some during the chorus. Even with slightly different verb or Chorus effect added.
4 - The trumpet (someone said horns) solo is cool and a touch louder than the rest of the band. I don't know what the proper fix is. I'd add a touch verb and lower the vol. And to let it shine still, lower the rhythm even more than your previously lowered (in part 1) level during this part.
The chorus has some nice lyrics that have that substance that needs to be heard rather than ignored.
rayc
retroreprobate
Hi All,
I've attempted to address all suggestions starting with Timothy's from the last thread.
The result is here:
http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4326936&q=hi
bigbubba,
I hope Tim's EQing addresses the guitar levels/vocal combat. situation. Thanks for the detail esp re the cymbals. I've rasied the crash & dropped the ride - let me know if it's close.
DavidK,
I've lifted the drums except in the solo where I've lowered them a bit. the vox - hopefully are dealt with - let me know & thanks for the kind words.
When's the CD out?
SnakeDog5050,
I've lifted the tambourine & dropped the sax a little & added a bit of verb to it jsut a hair or three. You're very generous in your praise - thanks.
ido1957,
Thanks mate - your recommendatiosn are very close to Timothy's so I've tried his 1st. Let me know it it matched what you conjured up (I often do the same in WMP - when critiquing - it's a rule of thumb thing).
Dogman,
I've lifted the tambourine so it's clearer & the crash as well as a little bass player nudge to the bass. thanks for the kind, & patient, words.
RAMI,
What can I say Rami. It's a machine & it stuffed up, Oh, & I didn't notice - bad me. I can't even punch a rhythm into it like people usually do to drummers - bad drummer joke I know - but it was around for a long time so I couldn't resist. Now on the other hand you are a multi rhythmic (at least one per limb & at one time) humachine with talent added - how could Roland compete. Post Patch of Ground people will always say but on Patch you...
Gorty,
I can't hear the vocal levels objectively anymore so please let me know if they are approaching the mark. Ta for the double plus good vibes.
Freudian Slip,
Do you know Freud's cure for "hysterical" women? If not look it up for a laugh. Thanks for helping True - that's what the game's all about after all.
True,
Sorry about the hysterical line but Freud's methods were pretty amusing as were the assumptions behind them. I'm having a littl trouble with the link now. It's faster, at the moment at least, if you use the link in the signature line.
The ride is bugging me mightily - it's not as loud in the wave file.
Ok folks keep me informed....
I've attempted to address all suggestions starting with Timothy's from the last thread.
The result is here:
http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4326936&q=hi
bigbubba,
I hope Tim's EQing addresses the guitar levels/vocal combat. situation. Thanks for the detail esp re the cymbals. I've rasied the crash & dropped the ride - let me know if it's close.
DavidK,
I've lifted the drums except in the solo where I've lowered them a bit. the vox - hopefully are dealt with - let me know & thanks for the kind words.
When's the CD out?
SnakeDog5050,
I've lifted the tambourine & dropped the sax a little & added a bit of verb to it jsut a hair or three. You're very generous in your praise - thanks.
ido1957,
Thanks mate - your recommendatiosn are very close to Timothy's so I've tried his 1st. Let me know it it matched what you conjured up (I often do the same in WMP - when critiquing - it's a rule of thumb thing).
Dogman,
I've lifted the tambourine so it's clearer & the crash as well as a little bass player nudge to the bass. thanks for the kind, & patient, words.
RAMI,
What can I say Rami. It's a machine & it stuffed up, Oh, & I didn't notice - bad me. I can't even punch a rhythm into it like people usually do to drummers - bad drummer joke I know - but it was around for a long time so I couldn't resist. Now on the other hand you are a multi rhythmic (at least one per limb & at one time) humachine with talent added - how could Roland compete. Post Patch of Ground people will always say but on Patch you...
Gorty,
I can't hear the vocal levels objectively anymore so please let me know if they are approaching the mark. Ta for the double plus good vibes.
Freudian Slip,
Do you know Freud's cure for "hysterical" women? If not look it up for a laugh. Thanks for helping True - that's what the game's all about after all.
True,
Sorry about the hysterical line but Freud's methods were pretty amusing as were the assumptions behind them. I'm having a littl trouble with the link now. It's faster, at the moment at least, if you use the link in the signature line.
The ride is bugging me mightily - it's not as loud in the wave file.
Ok folks keep me informed....
B
Bulls Hit
Well-known member
This is pretty cool rayc. I like your vocal melodies. The kick is effective, and I thought the levels of everything were pretty much right on.
Have you considered introducing a snare, say after the horn break? I can hear a tambo later on but it's not quite doing it. Also, the whole song is fairly homogenous, as in the levels stay the same through out. If you could lift the intensity towards the end, maybe with a 2nd guitar, snare on 2 & 4.....this is just what I'm hearing. Feel free to ignore these ramblings
Have you considered introducing a snare, say after the horn break? I can hear a tambo later on but it's not quite doing it. Also, the whole song is fairly homogenous, as in the levels stay the same through out. If you could lift the intensity towards the end, maybe with a 2nd guitar, snare on 2 & 4.....this is just what I'm hearing. Feel free to ignore these ramblings
rayc
retroreprobate
Rami - Hope I didn't tease too much. This songs creates a contrast with Patch - one propulsive the next more skittish. I also am aware that you have things HAPPENING. Wow, looking forward to that little metal & plastic disc!!!!
STRINE translation...on Ido's thread coming up. Oh, I've planned the disc of Uhluru for you & am part way through converting it to burn.
Bulls Hit,
I have to admit I haven't even listened for a snare. I'm a little short on attention span of late. I'll re listen. I've OD'd snare before when needed so will focus on the percussive riddem over the next couple of days.
STRINE translation...on Ido's thread coming up. Oh, I've planned the disc of Uhluru for you & am part way through converting it to burn.
Bulls Hit,
I have to admit I haven't even listened for a snare. I'm a little short on attention span of late. I'll re listen. I've OD'd snare before when needed so will focus on the percussive riddem over the next couple of days.
R
RAMI
Guest
RayC...You can never tease too much.
This song suits the pumping rythm of a drum machine, gives it a driving feel. Bull's suggestion of a snare coming in is great. I didn't think of it, but now that he mentions it, it can lift the tune to another level, after or during the solo.
This song suits the pumping rythm of a drum machine, gives it a driving feel. Bull's suggestion of a snare coming in is great. I didn't think of it, but now that he mentions it, it can lift the tune to another level, after or during the solo.
Freudian Slip
New member
Much more thumping for sure! The levels sound pretty good to me. I wouldn't go any louder on the vocals. Theres a couple of spots on the verge of being too high in the mix nothing bad though. Look who's talking the king of out front vocals 
I still hear the funky drum rythem in the horn part. Is this a midi triggered drum machince from a computer or what? If so can you convert to audio and cut and paste the kick in there from a different part of the song?
I love the way the guitar is strummed/muted on this. It's very cool.
The over all volume seems to be way up.
Oh ya, it there a missing vocal line tward the end? I dont remember it being that way a week ago.
Sorry if you covered any of this and I failed to read it.
Sounding great. This song is getting stuck in my head
Later
F.S.
I still hear the funky drum rythem in the horn part. Is this a midi triggered drum machince from a computer or what? If so can you convert to audio and cut and paste the kick in there from a different part of the song?
I love the way the guitar is strummed/muted on this. It's very cool.
The over all volume seems to be way up.
Oh ya, it there a missing vocal line tward the end? I dont remember it being that way a week ago.
Sorry if you covered any of this and I failed to read it.
Sounding great. This song is getting stuck in my head
Later
F.S.
Freudian Slip
New member
Hey Rayc.
I just read your email so never mind the whole midi quiestion on the drums.
I have never used midi either. Too complicated for me
The drum should be an easy edit...... Unless you did what I used to do and did not have your meter set in cw when recording. Then it becomes a real pain. I've taken to using fruity loops and lining up the bpm with cw. That gives me a decent click track that I can keep or replace with real drums if I can get my drummer over here
Best thing is that it makes editing like woking with leggos.
Well anyhoo.
Keep it up.
F.S.
I just read your email so never mind the whole midi quiestion on the drums.
I have never used midi either. Too complicated for me
The drum should be an easy edit...... Unless you did what I used to do and did not have your meter set in cw when recording. Then it becomes a real pain. I've taken to using fruity loops and lining up the bpm with cw. That gives me a decent click track that I can keep or replace with real drums if I can get my drummer over here
Best thing is that it makes editing like woking with leggos.
Well anyhoo.
Keep it up.
F.S.
ido1957
9K Gold Member
This latest mix is good - but- I find the levels on the verses are lower than the chorus'. The eq did bring the vocals out nicely though.
Now I've listened a couple time to see - which one would I go for, or would I leave it with the difference???? That's a tough one.
.....the verses have that quality where they vocals are nicely audible but you need to focus on the words to make them out - a very normal mix for many songs. Most songs are mixed on albums like that.
.....the chorus' spring forth with powerful words and they ride nicely over the music. They are clear and clean and totally grab your attention.
My vote goes with the level on the chorus'......but this is just my humble opinion. Either way though I would say it's now your choice as producer.
It would be cool if we could get some more feedback from more ears here....
Especially if I am totally off track - which I may be......
Now I've listened a couple time to see - which one would I go for, or would I leave it with the difference???? That's a tough one.
.....the verses have that quality where they vocals are nicely audible but you need to focus on the words to make them out - a very normal mix for many songs. Most songs are mixed on albums like that.
.....the chorus' spring forth with powerful words and they ride nicely over the music. They are clear and clean and totally grab your attention.
My vote goes with the level on the chorus'......but this is just my humble opinion. Either way though I would say it's now your choice as producer.
It would be cool if we could get some more feedback from more ears here....
Especially if I am totally off track - which I may be......
B
bigbubba
New member
I like the new mix. The only suggestion is to lower the rhythm guitar just a little behind the trumpet/sax/horn solo to let it shine thru better. Just like EQ helps carve areas in different freqs. the volume carving should help focus different things and telling a story.
Freudian Slip
New member
there is a big difference between the first verse and first Chorus as far as the the level on the vocals.
I actually think (and you'll hate me for this) that everything past the 1st verse may be a little loud. I think you are in danger of mixing away your style. I think for your sound having the vocals a bit below the mix is not a bad thing. You have a certain style that is catchy to me. I would move very slow from here. 1/2db moves and try to even it out a bit. I personally would lean tward aligning things with the first verse. It sounds like that would require working with the guitar and some other things in the mix. You may try splitting the difference.
I know this will not be the most popular position but, I don't want to see you mix away your first impression and style that I heard a week or so ago.
Alot of help I am
F.S.
I actually think (and you'll hate me for this) that everything past the 1st verse may be a little loud. I think you are in danger of mixing away your style. I think for your sound having the vocals a bit below the mix is not a bad thing. You have a certain style that is catchy to me. I would move very slow from here. 1/2db moves and try to even it out a bit. I personally would lean tward aligning things with the first verse. It sounds like that would require working with the guitar and some other things in the mix. You may try splitting the difference.
I know this will not be the most popular position but, I don't want to see you mix away your first impression and style that I heard a week or so ago.
Alot of help I am
F.S.
true-eurt
Maneater
I don't like to read other's post, until after I have listened and posted mine...but couldn't help but read Freud's as I clicked on to post.
I agree with him on the vocals, and about mixing away your style. Remember when I posted in the other thread, about how your vox had a soft overtone that drew one in closer to listen..? I love that about your voice. Your unique sound sets you apart and combined with your instrumental style...signature!!! That is a good thing. You and your bud have some good sounds going on here. You have a sig-sound.
The bass you have added kicks some mighty butt!! I absolutely love it and would not change it in anyway!!
The high-hat(?) hits sound out of the mix until 1:51...then fits like a glove until around 2:44. I am still trying to figure that one out. The ride is great all the way through!!
Your voice sounds clear and good on this version, but that subtleness(I think your sig vox) has been diminished somewhat and that subtleness was cool. I hope you still have the vox from the first version, posted in the last thread.
I want to keep listening though...I may have a change of ears.
I love the percussion you have added(minus the cymbal crash) and still love the sax!! There is a faltering moment at 2:24 with the axe..just for a note or two..noticable but not a big deal I don't think.
What happens with the vox at 4:04...a recording bump?
I love this tune!!! It is so hooky!!
I agree with him on the vocals, and about mixing away your style. Remember when I posted in the other thread, about how your vox had a soft overtone that drew one in closer to listen..? I love that about your voice. Your unique sound sets you apart and combined with your instrumental style...signature!!! That is a good thing. You and your bud have some good sounds going on here. You have a sig-sound.
The bass you have added kicks some mighty butt!! I absolutely love it and would not change it in anyway!!
The high-hat(?) hits sound out of the mix until 1:51...then fits like a glove until around 2:44. I am still trying to figure that one out. The ride is great all the way through!!
Your voice sounds clear and good on this version, but that subtleness(I think your sig vox) has been diminished somewhat and that subtleness was cool. I hope you still have the vox from the first version, posted in the last thread.
I want to keep listening though...I may have a change of ears.
I love the percussion you have added(minus the cymbal crash) and still love the sax!! There is a faltering moment at 2:24 with the axe..just for a note or two..noticable but not a big deal I don't think.
What happens with the vox at 4:04...a recording bump?
I love this tune!!! It is so hooky!!
Last edited:
B
bigbubba
New member
In light of several others that have mentioned, I was listening to this last nite and I was thinking that the vox are a little louder for your style. I was listening from outside the room to see what sounds travel farther out. But I was thinking that it's good that the vox can be understood from that far. But it's slightly louder for your style. While I think that's cool, it would be good to mention that I also see what others are talking about.
Freud, has a good point about mixing away your style when mixing much. Maybe you do wanna watch out for that.
On a different note, I had a really terrible homerecorder signature sound in the beginning that I worked hard on getting away from. I think I have a new "homerecorder" signature sound. But you can't be pro working on mixing skills part time.
Freud, has a good point about mixing away your style when mixing much. Maybe you do wanna watch out for that.
On a different note, I had a really terrible homerecorder signature sound in the beginning that I worked hard on getting away from. I think I have a new "homerecorder" signature sound. But you can't be pro working on mixing skills part time.
true-eurt
Maneater
I am having another listen.
Ray, by no means does this sound bad or anything. Everything is clear and defined and up in overall volume. I think I am just stuck on the other version.
Kudos for a great arrangement...(the sax was an ingenius addition). Your voice is unique. You have the bass down to a perfection. The guitars sound good and the keys are good too. Percussion really took the tune up and out. Other than a few tiny points listed above, I think it is a cool song. The voice thing, is a personal preference more than a recording issue.
Upon relistening, I noticed the axe volume came up at 1:57. I did not notice that last night. My ears are most likely fried.
True
Ray, by no means does this sound bad or anything. Everything is clear and defined and up in overall volume. I think I am just stuck on the other version.
Kudos for a great arrangement...(the sax was an ingenius addition). Your voice is unique. You have the bass down to a perfection. The guitars sound good and the keys are good too. Percussion really took the tune up and out. Other than a few tiny points listed above, I think it is a cool song. The voice thing, is a personal preference more than a recording issue.
Upon relistening, I noticed the axe volume came up at 1:57. I did not notice that last night. My ears are most likely fried.
True
Freudian Slip
New member
true-eurt said:Ray, by no means does this sound bad or anything. Everything is clear and defined and up in overall volume. I think I am just stuck on the other version.
True
Ya I hope my comment wasn't taken badly. It is a much cleaner mix now. There are things I like better in this mix and thinks I like better from the old.
You gave us too much time for the old one to grow on us
It's honestly stuck in my head. I have listened to it at least a couple times a day for a week 
F.S.
rayc
retroreprobate
Hi Folks,
I've been thinking & listening. I'm aware of the concern about mixing my own sound away & have had similar concerns. I have save this mixing at a few different stages as I had similar concerns. I am, however, interested to see where this will go. This is the 1st Camel Comm mix that has really pushed the boundaries of my comfort zone but that's good too. I'm learning heaps & will follow this & people's suggestions through to a conclusion. It may not be MY conclusion, but it will be a consensus & will contain elements that I should consider in the future.
I have the mix of the original version I posted - it was made from a stereo mix of a 4 track tape & then some augmentation & a barrel full of reverb. I liked it when I did it but knew it didn't work too well for many people's ears. I still like it though it does make me cringe occasionally.
By the end of this thread, which I take seriously enough to actually work at, I'll have a mix. Judging from the results to date it'll be fairly good too. Maybe even one I'll run with. I'll then be in a position to compare it to the original mix, & post that A-B too to see what elements from both might make the Dromedary this time.
I've been too work busy this week (hell week in the system down here) to actually do more that read & listen but I'll be active by week's end.
Thanks for the ideas, concern & for finding a germ of uniqueness in my stuff.
I've been thinking & listening. I'm aware of the concern about mixing my own sound away & have had similar concerns. I have save this mixing at a few different stages as I had similar concerns. I am, however, interested to see where this will go. This is the 1st Camel Comm mix that has really pushed the boundaries of my comfort zone but that's good too. I'm learning heaps & will follow this & people's suggestions through to a conclusion. It may not be MY conclusion, but it will be a consensus & will contain elements that I should consider in the future.
I have the mix of the original version I posted - it was made from a stereo mix of a 4 track tape & then some augmentation & a barrel full of reverb. I liked it when I did it but knew it didn't work too well for many people's ears. I still like it though it does make me cringe occasionally.
By the end of this thread, which I take seriously enough to actually work at, I'll have a mix. Judging from the results to date it'll be fairly good too. Maybe even one I'll run with. I'll then be in a position to compare it to the original mix, & post that A-B too to see what elements from both might make the Dromedary this time.
I've been too work busy this week (hell week in the system down here) to actually do more that read & listen but I'll be active by week's end.
Thanks for the ideas, concern & for finding a germ of uniqueness in my stuff.