Drum module questions

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Executivos

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I asked some questions about drum modules and triggers a few weeks ago, and then decided to buy an alesis dm5. I got it, it works great, but it's a little more than I need. I'd really like to use my own sounds which means I'm going to be using the trigger ins to the midi out and bypassing the sounds completely. I've heard mentions of units that do just that. Trigger to midi, and that's it...no sounds at cheaper price. Anybody know of these units?

BTW if anyone wants an Alesis dm5, it's in near mint shape..$215 plus shipping unless you live in la.
 
I'm not sure I get your question, but I know you can assign a midi sound to any kinda trigger. If you wanna assign a software tuba or a bad muffler sound to a trigger, you can.
 
my question is...with the dm5 i can plug all my triggers into it, and it works, and aside from generating sounds on board, it also sends a midi signal out. Thats all I'm using it for...I've heard that there are devices under $100 bucks that will simply accept all my triggers and send them out using midi, and that have no sounds, (as I'm not using the dm5 for it's sounds)]

I just haven't been able to find the unit that does this...
 
How are you using triggers?
Drum type pads?
What type sequenser?
If drum trigs, you don't have to go into the DM5. I think you can go into your comp or breakout box and assign the locations.
 
Yeah drum type pads, but I made them myself...remo practice pads with piezo elements inside them. I to get them into my computer I'd need all 8 inputs....I guess it would work. I'm looking for something, so that I can save my 8 audio inputs for gtr bass vocals etc and just use midi.
 
Executivos said:
I've heard mentions of units that do just that. Trigger to midi, and that's it...no sounds at cheaper price. Anybody know of these units?
Click to expand...

I'd love to know where these types of units are too.
 
I think what you might be looking for is a keyboard controller.
It will trigger midiout data that will play internal samples from your computer soundbanks or trigger anything that its connected to via midi. but it does not have its own sound generator. It's silent.
You could also just buy a cheap midi keyboard for this, even a used one. Is this what your looking for. I know Mars music has em if you got one close by, or go online.
 
Digital Cowboy said:
I think what you might be looking for is a keyboard controller.
It will trigger midiout data that will play internal samples from your computer soundbanks or trigger anything that its connected to via midi. but it does not have its own sound generator. It's silent.
You could also just buy a cheap midi keyboard for this, even a used one. Is this what your looking for. I know Mars music has em if you got one close by, or go online.
Click to expand...

I think the unit we want is a "Trigger-to-MIDI Converter". Look for that phrase on http://www.harmony-central.com/Drums/EDW/Articles/MIDI-Introduction.html It's the same principal as a dumb keyboard controller (no built-in sounds), but you need inputs that take the signals from your trigger pads and pedals. See the "MIDI KITI Pro" trigger-to-midi convertor at http://www.alternatemode.com/accessories.shtml as an example (which I just found and haven't investigated further yet).

Regards,
rathpy
 
yeah the midi kiti pro is what im looking for. (yes I need trigger inputs....)

The problem is.....it's $199, the dm5 I have does the same thing but with sounds and I paid 175 for it. I've heard there are units for around $75-$80....thats what I'm looking for.
 
Executivos said:
I'd really like to use my own sounds which means I'm going to be using the trigger ins to the midi out and bypassing the sounds completely. I've heard mentions of units that do just that. Trigger to midi, and that's it...no sounds at cheaper price. Anybody know of these units?
Click to expand...

You're thinking of a TMI (Trigger to MIDI Interface).
The only one available is a KIT you have to build from http://www.paia.com.

There used to be one made by Akai. I believe it was the ME35-T.
They quit making it...nobody wanted to pay $300 for a TMI at the time.

The Alesis is a useless piece of crap when it comes to Triggering MIDI. It's so slow at converting the signal it isn't funny...I know, because that was exactly what i bought my DM5's to do.

The Fastest Trigger to MIDI available is Boom Theory's Space Muffins 0.0.
Al Adinolfi has done some great work in the TMI field.


Tim
 
Re: Re: Drum module questions

Tim Brown said:
The Alesis is a useless piece of crap when it comes to Triggering MIDI. It's so slow at converting the signal it isn't funny...I know, because that was exactly what i bought my DM5's to do.
Click to expand...
Ouch. I had that idea too... my drummer owns one and has a set of triggers. Figured it would be easier to record the drums that way instead of buying $1500 worth of mics and sound card, only to record in a room that sounds like poo anyway.

I understand there is a delay from the actual triggering until the signal reaches my computer and records MIDI data. I don't care that much if it's slow as long as it is consistent... drums go down before all other instruments so a little latency won't matter. What I want to know if the DM-5 has a constant delay on every note, or is it inconsequential?

Also, how much of a delay would it be if I sent a MIDI signal to the DM-5 and recorded from the audio outputs?

TIA
 
Actually I've been using the alesis to run triggers and then out to midi and it works fine, there's no delay as far as I can tell.

Could it be that you're confusing the alesis's latency with your sound card's latency?

If I use some programs there's a great deal of latency because I'm not using a low latency asio sound card...BUT It's an sblive and if you use sound fonts as your sampler, it works EXTREMELY well.

My band just had our first "quiet" practice last night...

Digital drums (I built the pads myself) into the alesis dm5, midi out to the sblive with a nice dw sound font kit, then into protools

Bass direct into protools

Guitar to pod pro into protools

Vocal mics into protools.

I have one of those hafler 4 channel headphone amps so we all got our own mix, through headphones...

That was one of the best sounding practices I've had...we could all hear everything perfectly....Very easy to write songs.

Anyway it was all live and there was no lag in the dm5 module.
 
Executivos said:
I have one of those hafler 4 channel headphone amps so we all got our own mix, through headphones...
Click to expand...
Now that's a quiet rehearsal.

Executivos, would you care to elaborate on how you built your digital pads? Or maybe point to the web site that might describe it. I'd be also interested on how you go with half-open hi-hat sounds.

Regards,
rathpy
 
pads....

Remo practice pads...then you buy peizo buzzers at radio shack (.70 to $2 or so) open up the practice pad, take the head off and there's foam about an inch think. Cut it so it's two discs about 1/2 inch each. Then you take the buzzer, and rip open the placstic casing...there's a little metal thing in there about the size of a quarter and two wires coming from it.

Basically that thing vibrates and creates a little electic signal. If you put that in between the foam pads it will work but then the strike zone is small (you have to hit the drum dead center) Hot glue that to a wasted cdr (or a cd you don't like anymore) or the lid of the coffee can...Then if you hit anywhere above the cd, it vibrates which transfers to the piezo. Anyway you put that cd/glued piece between the two pads of foam, drill a hole in the bottom of the practice pad for the wires and solder them to a female 1/4 phone jack, close it all up and you have very nice pads. You can use diff sizes, and because it's a remo practice pad it has semi-tunable heads.


http://www.electronicdrums.com/pads/pads2.htm

http://people.bu.edu/dizon/drum.html

The 10" pads are like $12, 12" pads are about $15...

As a hi hat pedal I'm using a keyboard sustain pedal and it it TERRIBLE. (it was only $5) I'll be buying a real elec drum hi hat pedal very soon.
 
Last edited:
Gidge.....maybe I'm missing something...???? I posted that link G.
 
nope, im missing something...a brain:D

all i saw was the first link, my bad!!!!
 
Thanks for the rundown on the DIY pads. :)

btw, I briefly tried the hi-hat of low-end Yamaha kit recenlty. It seemed to have quite a number of graduations of half-open-ness. I'm not sure how all that information would be transferred by a trigger. I'd imagine that the brain/sampler would have to be smart enough and programmed for all these intermediate half-open sounds. I'm just guessing about this, as I'm just learning how it all works...and rambling on.

Regards,
rathpy
 
yeah the module would have to understand a pedal that's half open.

You can get closed to the same effect with velocity samples (atleast the ones I use)

If you leave it open but hit it lightly, it sounds close to being halfway open
 
Damn! I would have traded you a Roland hat pedal for that amp.

:cool:
 
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