Doing A Live Recording With This Gear

J

JUGOxx

New member
I am planning to do a live home recording restricted to this gear:

A small mixer MACKIE 402VLZ 2 Mic Preamp

Microphones available: A Shure SM 57, a Sennheiser e803, a Behringer conderser c1 and a Shure p48. I need to pick 2 microphones because of the mixer´s preamps.

Recorders:
A Power Machintosh G3 processor running Pro Tools FREE 5.0.1 with up to 8 tracks available.
A TASCAM portastudio 4 track mfp01 that records just one trs input at a time

A 30-square foot untreated room and just a couple of blankets.

What thecniques, or ideas would you suggest?

Thanks 4 all!
 
You didn't list an audio interface. How do you plan on getting the audio into/out of the computer?

What type of music? Your options will be extremely limited by that gear.
 
Also: what are you recording - how many players/singers? What's the purpose of the recording (demo, etc)?
 
Hi bouldersoundguy,
There is no audio interface in the computer besides the internal soundcard. I am planning to take the tape Outut of the mixer to the soundcard 1/8 trs In.
 
Hi, mjbphotos,
I will be recording a 6 member band Mexican folk music: Accordion, Acoustic guitar, Tuba, 2 singers and a drum kit. I will be making a live recording demo album for them.
 
It will be almost impossible to get a tolerable recording. It might sort of work if you group the accordion/guitar/tuba/singers around the C1 bluegrass style, facing the drums, and point the 57 or 903 at the drums. Pan the group and drum mics hard left and right respectively, then you can balance them somewhat in Pro Tools.
 
Hi, Bouldersoundguy, thank you for your ideas. I will be trying them for sure. Now, I am interested in this you said

bouldersoundguy said:
It will be almost impossible to get a tolerable recording.
Click to expand...

Why do you consider it? I think it would be a lot helpful If you could help me identify which are the contras that could be showing up in this experiment.

I do not want to move some degrees away from the thread but I want to ask everyone, just for it being: A pair of stereo paired mics, as the behringer ones, would do a lot better?

Again, thank you
 
JUGOxx said:
Hi, Bouldersoundguy, thank you for your ideas. I will be trying them for sure. Now, I am interested in this you said



Why do you consider it? I think it would be a lot helpful If you could help me identify which are the contras that could be showing up in this experiment.

I do not want to move some degrees away from the thread but I want to ask everyone, just for it being: A pair of stereo paired mics, as the behringer ones, would do a lot better?

Again, thank you
Click to expand...
Given your restrictions, and the nature of the job, I think that's what I'd shoot for. If these people are at all experienced or professional, they should just about mix themselves. Find the placement for the players and stereo mics where it sounds best and go. It'll be better than a cassette boombox, anyway.

bsg's suggestion is good, too, though.
 
"What thecniques, or ideas would you suggest?
Run? Ok, as others have said you need an interface but I guess with care over levels, straight into the soundcard will work.

I agree about stereo. Read up on "Co-incident stereo recording"

Dave.
 
Your limitation is going to be the soundcard in your computer. These typically have $0.69 worth of components and are not made for good audio-to-digital conversion, they're for producing the 'beeps and boops' of your computer and for passable internet audio/gaming.

As mentioned if the band is really good at managing their sound (playing to a single mic), it might work, but you are faced with a hard situation considering you ahve no experience in this.
 
Hi, mjbphotos,
Thank you for your reply. The computer is an out of date macintosh with a built in soundcard (even thou the ad for this computer talks heaven about its soundcard) but I also have a new tascam portastudio, the simplest one, mfp01, I am planning to use both recorders, computer and portastudio, so that way I could have a digital copy and an analog one as a backup, could be one sounds better that the other. This band has never recorded something but they didn´t want to do it by themselves, I will make the best of this with what i have. Also, I will try to buy a set of behringer c-2 paired mics maybe they could help me improve the miking and that way I can focus on other things concerning this proyect
 
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The band doesn't really need any recording experience. If they have experience playing as an ensemble and blending together as a unit, they should be fine. Might be nice to have somebody act as something of a conductor or more formally as a producer to make sure things go well. It is very important that these folks understand going in that the sound of the final mix is almost completely up to them. All you can do is try to capture it in the most flattering (or least offensive) way possible. There's no reason it can't end up a fairly decent document of whatever performance they manage to give, even with what you have right now.

My concern is the room. Did you really say 30 ft2? Like 5 x 6 ? How the hell are you going to get all these people plus instruments (including a drum kit!) in there to begin with? Well, at least it will be completely full of meat to absorb/diffuse some of the nasty reflections. Despite what everybody else has said, this will be your biggest problem. If there's any other place in the world that you can do this, you probably should move the session.
 
101: Setup mics, record, listen, adjust mics, repeat until it sounds acceptable.

The drums, especially cymbals, will be louder than everything else. Do anything you can to seperate/isolate them from everything else(Fiberglass insulation, drywall, couches, blankets, loaded clothes racks, sheep,..) with the best case scanario of having them in a seperate room where the band can only hear them as much as they need to to sync up. If the drummer is having problems hearing the band give him the headphones after you've got everything sounding good and are ready to hit record. Use the 57 on the drum kit as it can handle the db levels and will do a decent job. For a one mic drum setup I like to place it 6 inches to a foot from the snare pointing between the snare and hi-toms , towards the the floor tom, just over the top of the bass drum. Coming from the opposite side pointing towards the Snare/H-hat works well also. You milage many vary.

As noted by Bouldersoundguy, everybody else will have to be captured by the C1. This will probably be difficult as, unlike in a live performance, without monitors it would be difficult to judge how your distance from the mic is effecting the recording. You will need to do one of two things. Either get a headphone distribution amp so everyone can monitor (behringer $24, +closed headphones for everybody $15+each). The other option being ducktape-- Every body stands at an equal distance from the mic and plays,. monitor via headphones,. record,. check levels,. this time the mic stays still and the players are moved closer or futher from the mic to adjust thier levels in the mix,. repeat until levels are set. When you find the sweet spot for everybody use the duct tape to mark those spots so everybody stays put. Closer is generall better as you can keep the gain a little lower and hopefully capture less room sound. Cross fingers, hope for the best.


No Audio interface: I'm not a Mac guy but I would guess that the DA/AD converters on your macs sound card are probably pretty decent, I think the real trick here is A: making sure your sound card is set properly to capture audio at least at 16 or 24bit/44khz resolution through your line in, B: keeping the output of your mixer into the line on the low side, as most PC soundcards will overdrive and clip much earlier than pro-audio equalivants. This is really just being very mindful of proper gain staging. Also, please make sure your going into the macs Line-In, not the MIC input.

Good luck!
 
Hi, ashcat_lt, let me talk to you a bit about the room. The room is within a two-story house that can be used completely for recording. The thing is I do not have a Snake or pretty long cables to record in diferent rooms. So, being that said, let me talk about the room where the recording is going to take place. The room area is about 300 ft2, the volume is around 2200 ft3.
 
Hi, dyermaker8, I appreciate your help. I hopefully will get a pair of stereo paired microphones. But if not. I will try to do the best by trying diferent things. I think I will set the drum kit upstairs with an SM57 and the rest of the band downstairs with the condensor mic. In case I get the stereo paired microphones what suggestions do you have?

another question, concerning
dyermaker8 said:
please make sure your going into the macs Line-In, not the MIC input.
Click to expand...
.. The soundcard only has a 1/8 trs speaker Out and a 1/8 trs Mic symbol In. There is no Line In..Should I plug my mixer Tape Out there

Thanks
 
Because you are using a mixer, you'll basically need to get the mix 'right' there (use headphones). Is the TRS mic input on the Mac stereo?
 
Hi, mjbphotos, yes it is a stereo mic Input. I take the Tape Out from the Mackie 402VLZ via the RCA red and white connectors with a cable that has red and white RCA pins in one end and a stereo 1/8 TRS in the other end, the one I plug to the MAC mic Input.
 
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