Classic Snare

Nakatira

Nakatira

That Norwegian Bastard
I'm on a everlasting journey to make all the stuff I record sound as 70's as possible.

I'm listeing to the snare sound on some of the Beatles records (Abby Road) and Pink Floyd (Dark side of the moon), and they all got this crisp high end on the snare, that sound beautiful IMO.

I cant say I've heard it in many recordings in these later years.

Most people probbably use a Dynamic (sm57 or simular) today, I read somewhere that Roger taylor (Queen) Used condensors Neumann U87 to be exact) on his whole kit for Night at the Opera 75.

So is it fair to assume that they used Condensors on the snares in those days to capture that crispy sound?
 
I don't think the sounds you hear on a record are due to just the mics. They do a lot of stuff to that snare after it's recorded. I doubt the snare sounded exactly like that when it was being recorded.
 
Ignoring the fact that "Beatles" cannot much define a 70's sound unless you count Wings and the various solo careers ( ;) )....sorry, just needelin' :D. One of these days we'll have one thread that doesn't mention the mopheads even once and I'll die of a heart attack with a smile on my face....

Seriously, though; first off, there is a tendency to tune the snares themselves differently these days than back then. I'd say you'd probably get 90% of the way there by finding the sound that you want on a recording and tuning your snare as close as you can get it to that sound.

Second, there are still a *lot* of recordings in the 70s that treat the drum kit as one instrument and do not individually mic every element. I can't say specifically which ones are which; but many of those hits from the early and mid 70s are just one or two OHs, which could easily be either LDCs, LDDs or SDCs.

G.
 
Depending on what equipment you have to hand, experiment. The way a snare or any other part of the drum sounds when played live can be different to what it sounds like on a recording. As Saads points out, all kinds of processing can be applied to the snare after it's actually recorded and sometimes blended in with the original sound. Different people have varying feelings about this, the spectrum of "always" to "sacrilege" being a wide and diverse one. You'd be surprized what some compression, reverb or delay can do. You may hate it, you may not. Try different things {there's loads of interesting drum advice on this site and others} and see what you can come up with.
 
for what it's worth, I just switched over from a wood snare to a steel (I think - it says "ludalloy" - 1979 Ludwig Supraphonic is the year/make/model), and I perceive the sound of the Supraphonic to be a lot closer to what you're describing than the wood one was.
 
When I think beatles abbey road snare, I think very DEAD sounding. No, not in a bad way. There doesnt seem to be much reverb on it if any. Maybe just the room mic. The snare is tuned actually pretty low it seems. There is NO ring at all that I can hear. All I hear is a little whoosh (as in like 200-300 hz)from the top head and also that brightness, probably from the snares being miked.

You could probably read about how they got that snare sound. There's a book that talks about what they did for the track ( microphones, compressor, room, tape deck, preamps and snare drum). Probably even the dampening on the snare.

I understand some of these measures (ie. tape deck, compressor and mic) are likely out of reach but the steps you can take .. as in snare drum, mic placement, drum tuning can probably get you in the ballpark of the sound you're looking for.

Good luck, I'm sure this can become an endless pursuit :laughings:
 
Erockrazor +1. I'm not a big Beatles listener, but I certainly love DSOTM. That is a dry, dry kit. There isn't much ring on the snare, either.
 
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Nakatira said:
I'm on a everlasting journey to make all the stuff I record sound as 70's as possible.

I'm listeing to the snare sound on some of the Beatles records (Abby Road) and Pink Floyd (Dark side of the moon), and they all got this crisp high end on the snare, that sound beautiful IMO.

I cant say I've heard it in many recordings in these later years.

Most people probbably use a Dynamic (sm57 or simular) today, I read somewhere that Roger taylor (Queen) Used condensors Neumann U87 to be exact) on his whole kit for Night at the Opera 75.

So is it fair to assume that they used Condensors on the snares in those days to capture that crispy sound?
Click to expand...

Most of those old bands used deep, metal shelled (probably supraphonic) snares with heavy batter heads and what sounds like loose-ish snare wires. They also paid attention to room sound and used room mics. They also had access to pro level mics, pres, engineers, etc. Good luck.
 
What do I remember about those snare sounds?
No facts at all just the speculation of a lot of drummers one in particular said to get a good Ringo drum sound, that hand towels and such where placed or just draped over the top head of the drums and when this drummer did that it was kind of close but still.............
 
Just found a cool video on youtube (searched "ringos drum sound"). Guy creates a cool little dampening device to get that deadened drum sound. Might be a good start for you. Even interesting for me as I dont like much ringing going on with my snare sound.

 
Nakatira said:
I'm on a everlasting journey to make all the stuff I record sound as 70's as possible.

I'm listeing to the snare sound on some of the Beatles records (Abby Road) and Pink Floyd (Dark side of the moon), and they all got this crisp high end on the snare, that sound beautiful IMO.

I cant say I've heard it in many recordings in these later years.

Most people probbably use a Dynamic (sm57 or simular) today, I read somewhere that Roger taylor (Queen) Used condensors Neumann U87 to be exact) on his whole kit for Night at the Opera 75.

So is it fair to assume that they used Condensors on the snares in those days to capture that crispy sound?
Click to expand...

Alan Parsons mentioned a Neumann KM84 being his secret weapon on snare. That may very well account for the crispy high end we're hearing on DSOTM.
 
Emerick also had fun with hitting the compressor hard on the drums. and i believe he used only overheads but he moved them in closer than normal (or closer than was allowed at EMI back in the day)
 
Yeah, the snare on Abbey Road and to a lesser extent DSTOM were dry and relatively low tuned, though they had nice overtones that made them crisp at the same time.

I've found that my overhead mics tend to bring out more of the high end out of the snare, where my close mic brings out the body.
 
Starting with the Revolver album, Geoff Emerick began using a KM56 under the snare in addition to the standard D20 on the kik and the D19c overhead. Tea towels were used on the snare top to deaden the ring. He also did move the mics in closer to the kit. he also began the use of the Fairchild limiters on the drums instead of the Altecs.

KM84 for the top on the DSOTM snare. 70's drum sound is, as has been said, deep metal snares with heavy top skins or at least heavily damped tops, tight thin resonants and a high count strainer. Some used these looser than others but a high count of strands ensures you get that razz on every hit.

Mic under the snare will ensure this also. With a couple of well placed overheads, an under snare mic and a kik mic you have the early seventies sound of pop.
 
Definitely try a condenser, I like the studio projects b1 - it can take the spl. I'd use a 414 if I had one.

I rig it up next to a 57 or an MD-421.
 
Man, I'm no expert on recording drums yet and I've got a shit Chinese set in a poor position in a compromised room but I have found I'm getting a lot closer to the snare sound I want (tight, dry, crack) with an electret condenser pointing horizontally across the center of face of the snare in the way that ez showed in that recent post he made.

I'm still experimenting. Currently I've got most of the mike head above the snare rim with it about 1/2" out from the edge. I used to use a 57 in the 'over the batter position pointing at 45 odd degrees' method but it got too much of that indie 'tock' for my liking. I wanted a lot more of the wires.

The wooden snare has a new coated Remo Ambassador batter and a thin clear Remo resonant. It's still got whatever snare wires were that came with it. It has an aftermarket adjustable damper clamped down on the batter to cut down the ring. I've got a little plywood/foam barrier sitting on top of the snare mike head to cut down a bit of the hats and crash spill. The rest of the kit is miked in the Glyn Johns method.

For me it's never going to be a 'pro' sound given the cheap kit and the room but comparatively, with compression and eq, the whole drum sound is now lot closer to what I'd always envisaged than anything I'd managed before. It's quite useable for what I do with it.

:)
 

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Besides all the good suggestions here, I think (though I may be wrong) that we're not hearing a snare mic on those records. Even if they placed a snare mic, what I hear when I hear Floyd sounds like the snare we hear is mostly overheads, not in your face the way a snare mic would sound.
 
stefolof said:
Alan Parsons mentioned a Neumann KM84 being his secret weapon on snare. That may very well account for the crispy high end we're hearing on DSOTM.
Click to expand...

That mic sounds like the actual drum, or better. It does something very magical to the high end.

People used all kinds of snares - Rogers are fantastic, and I love Gretsch wood snares.

I think the most common snare would be a 5x14 Supraphonic, and the most common heads were probably Remo Ambassadors.

One trick that sounds good every once in awhile is to put a leather wallet on the snare head. I use duct tape and cut up pieces of a lambswool car seat cover on my snare.
 
Erockrazor said:
Just found a cool video on youtube (searched "ringos drum sound"). Guy creates a cool little dampening device to get that deadened drum sound. Might be a good start for you. Even interesting for me as I dont like much ringing going on with my snare sound.

Click to expand...


Wholy shit, thats it.

Trying it straight away:)
 
Thanks guys, a lot of good info here.

I'll defenitly try the steel snare, and a few condensors.

and as some has mentioned, it has probbably more to do with the snare than the recording the mic placement or the tweaking.

that paper aluminum foile thing sounded awsome:)
 
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