Basement Studio

[Eclipse4449]

Greetings, I have approximately a 25' square basement with the Furnace/AC somewhat in the center. The Walls are cement block with cement floor and using just half of this space, lets say it is the West half, the East half completely empty, 1/4 of it an enclosed utility room .

I know it is time to address the acoustics so I've looked at 12"x12"x2" foam square but according to an "AI" response

Is cloth good for soundproofing?
"Fibrous materials, encompassing felts, natural fibers like wool and cotton, and synthetic fibers such as polyester, prove highly effective in mitigating the adverse effects of sound."

I found 90"x132" Polyester Tablecloths which 90" is exactly the height of my walls and the length means I don't need a lot of them to cover my space. Can anyone comment on this as being a useable solution until possibly a better location for my setup is created.

If no I haven't purchased so no loss.
If yes this create 2 known questions off the bat. 1) Will I need to use this material divide the 2 halves of this basement? On the wall sides can this material be flush against the block wall or add a firing strip to create a gap between the wall and material?

and last will I need to carpet the floor?

Thanks in advance

​

 

[keith.rogers]

Sound "treatment" and sound "proofing" are different things, and the latter is nigh impossible in basement, whether you mean sound coming in or getting out, though concrete walls below ground will probably keep the neighbors from calling the cops. The other residents of the house that are not in the basement will hear a lot, though.

You should look at (i.e., google) sound treatment options and how to build panels to start with, if what you want to do is record in the space. Some folks are satisfied with things like moving pads, in varying thickness or layers, on basement walls to reduce flutter echo. They won't do much for bass, and will be practically useless for dividing a space, e.g., if you expect the other half to not have much sound from a band playing.

For sound treatment, *mass* is important, especially at lower frequencies. You need [non-reflective] mass to absorb sounds, and lower frequencies, having more energy, require more mass. That's why you hear mostly just bass coming from the giant speaker systems in cars, or the apartment next door/above/below yours - the higher frequencies are damped ("treated") by a combination of drywall/flooring and airspace.

What AI has left out is the thickness of those materials that are required to really reduce the energy level of the sound. A blanket isn't going to stop much but flutter echo. If you want to stop bass energy from moving from point A to B, you probably need a foot or so, or maybe less if you've got a bunch of lead sheet [metal] to put on the back sides of your panels.

All IMHO/$.02...

p.s. I don't want to stop you from setting up and recording. With close micing, the space becomes less of an issue, but hard surfaces really do need something more than egg-crate foam or you'll be pushing a rope trying to get good recordings in a basement.

 

[DM60]

Not a direct answer, but many on this board, including me use Rockwool. Stuff works really good and is easy to find and work with.

Acoustic Insulation | ROCKWOOL

Acoustic insulation protects building occupants from noise pollution and boosts comfort and privacy. Find out more about ROCKWOOL sound insulation today.

www.rockwool.com

 

[Eclipse4449]

Not a direct answer, but many on this board, including me use Rockwool. Stuff works really good and is easy to find and work with.

Acoustic Insulation | ROCKWOOL

Acoustic insulation protects building occupants from noise pollution and boosts comfort and privacy. Find out more about ROCKWOOL sound insulation today.

www.rockwool.com

This looks like a perfect product for rafters, nothing but the rafters and 1/2" hardwood flooring above my hear

 

[Eclipse4449]

Sound "treatment" and sound "proofing" are different things, and the latter is nigh impossible in basement, whether you mean sound coming in or getting out, though concrete walls below ground will probably keep the neighbors from calling the cops. The other residents of the house that are not in the basement will hear a lot, though.

You should look at (i.e., google) sound treatment options and how to build panels to start with, if what you want to do is record in the space. Some folks are satisfied with things like moving pads, in varying thickness or layers, on basement walls to reduce flutter echo. They won't do much for bass, and will be practically useless for dividing a space, e.g., if you expect the other half to not have much sound from a band playing.

For sound treatment, *mass* is important, especially at lower frequencies. You need [non-reflective] mass to absorb sounds, and lower frequencies, having more energy, require more mass. That's why you hear mostly just bass coming from the giant speaker systems in cars, or the apartment next door/above/below yours - the higher frequencies are damped ("treated") by a combination of drywall/flooring and airspace.

What AI has left out is the thickness of those materials that are required to really reduce the energy level of the sound. A blanket isn't going to stop much but flutter echo. If you want to stop bass energy from moving from point A to B, you probably need a foot or so, or maybe less if you've got a bunch of lead sheet [metal] to put on the back sides of your panels.

All IMHO/$.02...

p.s. I don't want to stop you from setting up and recording. With close micing, the space becomes less of an issue, but hard surfaces really do need something more than egg-crate foam or you'll be pushing a rope trying to get good recordings in a basement.

No I strictly mean sound treatment, other than my reply to DM60 I figure the cement block is going to play a huge roll in the sounds of my drum kit where I will have close micing and at least one overhead mic. Your description above regarding absorbing sound and thickness of material is good to know. So a simple rectangle tablecloth flush or 1 inch from the blocks and encircling the room will do very little?

I think I'm what I am really describing is what I hear because my keyboards are internal, Guitars and basses are close Mic same with my drums so the drums that take up more than an 8' triangle in the corner. (at this point I haven't figured out if I want my kit stuffed in a corner or centered/squared within the area it is going to be) (very new to all of this)

 

[DM60]

This looks like a perfect product for rafters, nothing but the rafters and 1/2" hardwood flooring above my hear

I used them and put them in a frame and covered them with a thin material and put them in the corners, hang them on the walls where I need the treatment, the material with a little handy work this is far better than foam.

 

[rob aylestone]

Typical deadening material here in the UK, that is easily available is Bolton twill - a very thick and heavy fabric, often used for pipe and drape decorative wall covering in reflective hard walled spaces to make them look nice and sound better.

Traditional advice is that sheet thickness cotton and man made fibres are acoustically transparent - as in do b**ger all to sound bar, lop the very top end off. I stuck to that advice for years until a happy accident. I had a big space and decided that initially, I would use the far end for storage of flightcases and big dump bins full of cable, batteries, mics and general audio junk. Then, a project came in that needed green screen. The unit two doors away does scaffolding. They sold me some cheap scaff and I built a floor standing structure 3" below the ceiling. My space is in a basement, so not masses of hight. I could hang lights from the horizontal scaff, and the green screen. I've got a case full of green, white, blue and black sheet type 3m x 6m cloth. I hung the green all the way around three walls and did the job. Hanging also let the creases drop out, so instead of putting it away, I got out the rest and hung the lot - 4 drops on three sides. The difference in sound was amazing. No more boxy sound, and pretty dead - not just HF but the mids too. Reflections at the bass end are perceptable, but don;t really colour the sound. This space is now my video studio - I moved in large screens, speakers, computers and a big desk and it's a great place to work in. I can do audio recordings, video recordings and edit video and use Cubase - a fully usable 2nd studio.

My old rules just don't apply. I think the success is down to the air between the drops. I clip the cloth onto the scaffolding tube, two on one side, two on the other - so a 2" gap. The black cloth is a little thicker, but not much.

Just the green cloth didn't do anything, but the third one was when I noticed, and with the final one, I realised how good it actually was.

 

[Eclipse4449]

Typical deadening material here in the UK, that is easily available is Bolton twill - a very thick and heavy fabric, often used for pipe and drape decorative wall covering in reflective hard walled spaces to make them look nice and sound better.

Traditional advice is that sheet thickness cotton and man made fibres are acoustically transparent - as in do b**ger all to sound bar, lop the very top end off. I stuck to that advice for years until a happy accident. I had a big space and decided that initially, I would use the far end for storage of flightcases and big dump bins full of cable, batteries, mics and general audio junk. Then, a project came in that needed green screen. The unit two doors away does scaffolding. They sold me some cheap scaff and I built a floor standing structure 3" below the ceiling. My space is in a basement, so not masses of hight. I could hang lights from the horizontal scaff, and the green screen. I've got a case full of green, white, blue and black sheet type 3m x 6m cloth. I hung the green all the way around three walls and did the job. Hanging also let the creases drop out, so instead of putting it away, I got out the rest and hung the lot - 4 drops on three sides. The difference in sound was amazing. No more boxy sound, and pretty dead - not just HF but the mids too. Reflections at the bass end are perceptable, but don;t really colour the sound. This space is now my video studio - I moved in large screens, speakers, computers and a big desk and it's a great place to work in. I can do audio recordings, video recordings and edit video and use Cubase - a fully usable 2nd studio.

My old rules just don't apply. I think the success is down to the air between the drops. I clip the cloth onto the scaffolding tube, two on one side, two on the other - so a 2" gap. The black cloth is a little thicker, but not much.

Just the green cloth didn't do anything, but the third one was when I noticed, and with the final one, I realised how good it actually was.

I’ll have a few questions but I’m on my mobile now until I get back home Thursday. Thanks

 

[Eclipse4449]

Thank you for your replies everyone, please stay with me, I need you opinions on my particular setup, I’ll describe as soon as I can

 

[Eclipse4449]

Typical deadening material here in the UK, that is easily available is Bolton twill - a very thick and heavy fabric, often used for pipe and drape decorative wall covering in reflective hard walled spaces to make them look nice and sound better.

Traditional advice is that sheet thickness cotton and man made fibres are acoustically transparent - as in do b**ger all to sound bar, lop the very top end off. I stuck to that advice for years until a happy accident. I had a big space and decided that initially, I would use the far end for storage of flightcases and big dump bins full of cable, batteries, mics and general audio junk. Then, a project came in that needed green screen. The unit two doors away does scaffolding. They sold me some cheap scaff and I built a floor standing structure 3" below the ceiling. My space is in a basement, so not masses of hight. I could hang lights from the horizontal scaff, and the green screen. I've got a case full of green, white, blue and black sheet type 3m x 6m cloth. I hung the green all the way around three walls and did the job. Hanging also let the creases drop out, so instead of putting it away, I got out the rest and hung the lot - 4 drops on three sides. The difference in sound was amazing. No more boxy sound, and pretty dead - not just HF but the mids too. Reflections at the bass end are perceptable, but don;t really colour the sound. This space is now my video studio - I moved in large screens, speakers, computers and a big desk and it's a great place to work in. I can do audio recordings, video recordings and edit video and use Cubase - a fully usable 2nd studio.

My old rules just don't apply. I think the success is down to the air between the drops. I clip the cloth onto the scaffolding tube, two on one side, two on the other - so a 2" gap. The black cloth is a little thicker, but not much.

Just the green cloth didn't do anything, but the third one was when I noticed, and with the final one, I realised how good it actually was.

This my friend was VERY CLOSE to my own personal situation, so no for using simple tablecloths, but based on cost and factoring installation this block wall changes temperatures through the seasons an I feel that might be a factor with adhesive backed products. Half of my basement is an empty space, minus the walled off utility room which can be used for video but I don't think sound would be a factor as I would be sync video to a track but a nice backdrop and I can see green screen coming into play in the not too distant future. So let say we are doing near the same thing and you're way ahead of me in the process. I have a lot to learn of the recording side of the house but I'll direct my questions to the appropriate thread here.
Thanks again
Ray

 

[Eclipse4449]

Good afternoon everyone,
I just to make sure how important room treatment is for my situation.
First up I have 3 midi controller/keyboards which I'm sure will be recorded within my DAW
Second 2 Bass and a 6 string would be close mic'd with the option to Direct Box these
Third my drums which are close mic'd, having 2 drum mics to account for every drum and several CAD gxl1200 mics clipped on podcast boom arms dropped from the ceiling joists to account for each cymbal, these too would be fairly close mic'd. I'm told even with so many mics it is recommended that I still need an overhead mic.

I have a Scarlett 18i20 3rd gen audio interface, and 2 Behringer Ultragain Pro 8 ADA8200 mic preamps to connect everything, soon midi interface and voice processor(because I can't sing lol) added to my rack.

I have a pair of Yamaha HS5 powered studio monitors and a Yamaha HS8 Powered sub, the monitors a a perfect 45* from my chair, perfect sweet spot.
so how much value should I place on acoustic treatment?

​

 

[rob aylestone]

Personally - you have the kit, so get it set up how you want it and record some stuff. Then critically listen to anything recorded with mics and assess if it needed deadening, 'uncolouring', fixing etc etc.
Then if you determine you have parallel wall flutters, or unpleasant reverb, or boomy bass, you can fix it. Soundproofing needs advance planning or it's too late. Sound treatment can be done to taste.

 

[TalismanRich]

Personally - you have the kit, so get it set up how you want it and record some stuff. Then critically listen to anything recorded with mics and assess if it needed deadening, 'uncolouring', fixing etc etc.
Then if you determine you have parallel wall flutters, or unpleasant reverb, or boomy bass, you can fix it. Soundproofing needs advance planning or it's too late. Sound treatment can be done to taste.

Agreed. Listening is the true test. You can make assumptions about what you "think" will happen, but "doing" is the ultimate test. 3 hard corner aren't usually the best place. It would be pretty easy to build or buy a couple of panels to dampen reflections.

A simple clap test usually points out issues pretty quickly for me.

 

[DM60]

I can't really record claps in the mixing area. I have to go to another room.

 

[TalismanRich]

I wasn't as worried about the mixing area as the recording area. If it gets captured, it's there forever. Besides, my mixing area is my recording area.

Even if it wasn't, I've got enough cable to record in the upstairs bedroom and mix in the basement. One fifty foot snake and a couple of 25 ft mic cables would cover it.

 

[DM60]

Yes, I have an old laptop with a little Presonus USB and a copy of Reaper so I can go mobile. I render what I need, setup where I need and there I can record. I think in today's world, for not much money, a simple mobile system isn't expensive.

One thing to remind most people, if you are just tracking, it doesn't take much power and if you have an old 5ish year old laptop, a Presonus USB doesn't need a wall wort, can get you a pretty good mobile rig for not much money.

 

[Eclipse4449]

This is all new to me, yesterday an electrician installed 2 new breakers and wired the basement as I wanted it, with that said "It begins!"

 

[Eclipse4449]

@rob aylestone
You mentioned above Green screens. Can I refer to you a few questions I have about recording myself playing several instruments at the same time?

 

[TapeRoll]

Here are a couple videos of my studio build from 2000. Some older pics with a few new ones showing gear upgrades. Perhaps it may be of help. Good luck with your build.
Control Room:

Live Room:

 

[TapeRoll]

Some new gear installations.