balanced to unbalanced

T

thecuriouscouch

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i heard that an unbalanced cable works better on picking up the kick? true untrue? if so how can you make a balanced mic cable..unbalanced? any ideas? thanks, john
 
The only thing I could think of is that when you go from balanced to unbalanced, you loose 6db of signal. I suppose if you were clipping the mic pre, you could unbalance the line and basicly have a 6db pad. But I have never had that problem...EVER. If the clip light lights up every once in a while on the preamp with a kick drum, don't worry about it. Thank the stars that you have a drummer that hits.
 
It is part true becouse an unbalanced system obtain all the features,(frequencies),and the balanced-system was created to filter for the purpose of controlling noises,feedback,overtones,etc.The unbalanced would get the whole body of the sound without discreminating.The problem is in knowing how to control it with the Eq.,and the equipments for mixing and mastering..Dr. Zaragemca
 
zaragemca said:
It is part true becouse an unbalanced system obtain all the features,(frequencies),and the balanced-system was created to filter for the purpose of controlling noises,feedback,overtones,etc.The unbalanced would get the whole body of the sound without discreminating.The problem is in knowing how to control it with the Eq.,and the equipments for mixing and mastering..Dr. Zaragemca
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Sorry - but you have no idea what you're talking about - a balanced signal doesn't have ANY inherent "filtering" at all.........
 
Man, this is some great stuff.

I'm gonna' have to go out and get me a bunch of unbalanced mic cable.

So glad I come here.
 
Then in that case you are going to have to explain why an unbalanced system, (which was created before the balanced one),usully have more db,humming,hissing,than the balanced.
 
A balanced cable has NO FILTERING. It simply sends two OPPOSITE, but identical (balanced) signals. The common mode radiated noise is cancelled when the two opposite signals are subtracted together. Using a unbalanced cable drops half your signal strength (-6dB) because the receiving end is only getting one of the two signals, in addition to all the noise it's picked up.
Short version is there is NO ADVANTAGE TO USING A UNBALANCED MIC CABLE.
 
zaragemca said:
It is part true becouse an unbalanced system obtain all the features,(frequencies),and the balanced-system was created to filter for the purpose of controlling noises,feedback,overtones,etc.The unbalanced would get the whole body of the sound without discreminating.The problem is in knowing how to control it with the Eq.,and the equipments for mixing and mastering..Dr. Zaragemca
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A balanced system only eliminates noise picked up by the cable. It doesn't do anything about feedback, overtones, etc... It's main feature is that it gets rid of line noise WITHOUT employing a filter.
 
First,I didn't say that an unbalance was more advantage...now thanks for the explanation.. "the common MODE RADIATED NOISE IS CANCELLED WHEN THE TWO OPPOSITE SIGNALS ARE SUBSTRACTED TOGETHER", isn't that a type of filtering feature? which I was talking in relation to the noise,hissing,humming,etc., go back to my post to see it, I said that.But in recording part of that is used (by some engineer), for the body of the track,(when knowing how to controlled).And you missed the part when I say that regardless,still is going to need the equipments for mixing and mastering. FOR Fairview brother,part of what is called feedback,are overtones,hissing,humming,etc., pick it up by the mics from the environment, created by the spectrum of sounds.Some of them not even obtain through the ears.Gerry Zaragemca
 
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I'm selling unbalanced mic cables that have the "balancing filter" feature built right in.

$10/foot, raw.

PM me. ;)
 
Allow me to retort

"It is part true becouse an unbalanced system obtain all the features,(frequencies)"

A balanced system obtains all the features and frequencies of the ORIGINAL SIGNAL, just like unbalanced. The difference is that balanced rejects injection of other "features" such as EM noise in addition to the original signal.

"and the balanced-system was created to filter for the purpose of controlling noises,feedback,overtones,etc."

Controlling noise yes, and only noise injected to the original signal while travelling down the cable. All original "noise" will still be transfered. Balanced does nothing to control feedback or overtones.

"The unbalanced would get the whole body of the sound without discreminating.The problem is in knowing how to control it with the Eq.,and the equipments for mixing and mastering.."

Again you would get "the whole body of the sound" of the ORIGINAL SIGNAL, what you don't have is the stuff an unbalanced cable picks up along the way which is all but universally considered undesirable. You would be hard pressed to do less damage to the integrity of the original signal trying to use EQ and other tools to remove the radiated noise, rather than blocking it in the first place using balanced cables.

"the common MODE RADIATED NOISE IS CANCELLED WHEN THE TWO OPPOSITE SIGNALS ARE SUBSTRACTED TOGETHER, isn't that a type of filtering feature"

I would call this rejection, not filtering. The definition can be argued. I would take filtering to mean removal of components of the original signal.
 
Resh1, you are mostly in agreement with what I said,..now for the purpose of grammatical understanding, when you are rejecting,you are filtering,when you are filtering,you are rejecting something.Dr.Zaragemca
 
no you're not. the actual definition of filtering is rejecting signals, vibrations, or radiations of certain frequencies while allowing others to pass. the balancing circuit does not remove only CERTAIN frequencies. it cancels anything that might be picked up in the cable on the way down to the circuit. to make it simple...a balanced cable flips one signal out of phase while keeping the copy of the signal dry (+ and - wires of the cable). Any noise picked up down the cable will most likely occur on both + and - wires. When the signal gets to the balancing circuit in your mixer or whatever, it flips the - wire back in phase with the + wire. Now the noise on the - wire is directly out of phase with the + wire...canceling eachother out...and of course adding the two original signals to eachother creating a gain before even hitting the preamp

simple, but ingenious
 
zaragemca said:
Resh1, you are mostly in agreement with what I said,..
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I am?

zaragemca said:
now for the purpose of grammatical understanding, when you are rejecting,you are filtering,when you are filtering,you are rejecting something.Dr.Zaragemca
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I agree, to an extent

When you are filtering you are removing part of the "something." When you are rejecting you are keeping other things else from entering "something."

You can argue that the "something" is the signal plus radiated noise reaching the final destination, in which case a balanced cable can be called a filter.

My interpretation is the "something" is the original signal and you are preventing the noise from becoming part of the original signal, hence rejection.

While filtering may be interpreted as rejection and vice versa, I don't think, however, that they are the same thing.
 
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