As Good As A Neumann. But Cheaper

[Mark7]

Ahem

I am that guy, and I specifically stated between 1/2 and 9/10ths the Neumann prices.

Not $100 to $300.

read the thread properly in future

 

[chessrock]

I have a Shure SM-7 that I don't think sounds any worse than a Neumann -- just different. Let's just say that if I had a locker full of Neumann's, I'd probably still use the SM7 over them from time-to-time without any reservations.

I also happen to be a big fan of a company called Baltic Latvian Universal Electronics (BLUE). I think a lot of their stuff is right there in the same ballpark as the mighty N, and they tend to be a bit less expensive.

As for small diaphragm condensers, I think Taylor at the Sound Room carries a bunch of them that would fall in to the same general category. Namely his T.H.E. Audio line. Very under-rated company, by the way. Not to mention his hand-selected Oktavas he sells, which are supposedly a cut abover your average Ukulele Center floor model.

There's a whole host of solid-state Large Diaphragm Condensers that sound as good as or better than the TLM-103. Take your pick . . . Audio Technica AT4050 or 4040, Shure KSM44 (and 32) . . . Rode NT1000. There's a bunch of 'em. An SP C1 might even qualify. The TLM103 is not widely regarded as a very good value.

 

[chessparov]

acorec, with all due respect, there are plenty of examples of a
"under $100" vocal microphone outperforming the mighty Neumann's and Telefunken's.
Unless the engineers at RCA were "deluded" into using an Electro-Voice EV RE15 for all of Dolly Parton's vocals there!
She's known to have a "few" hits.
(it was kept in a special locked box there BTW)

Just one example of right voice/right microphone.
There are more examples if you wish...

Chris

 

[Mark7]

Hmm...

Are any of the Neumann mics currently in production well regarded?

Anyway. What if I swap the 103 out for an 87ai then?

 

[cavedog101]

I recently enjoyed listening to the work done by a C42 Josephson pair on an acoustic instrumental and was very impressed by the depth and clarity along with the retention of the character of the instruments involved. For the money, the Josephson was a superior choice over the KM184, which I also like.I do, however, feel that the older models of Neumann mics sound a bit more distinctive than the 'newer' stuff.I'm sure that this is an inherent quality to all 'aging' electronic equipment and since I could not have personally been around to hear some of these older models when new, it becomes a subjective take . I always did like the KM84 though...it has a certain aura in its reproduction of acoustic guitars and mandolins......I also like my AKG 451b's but will at times choose a much cheaper mic over them because it sounds better for the intended source.

I have spent many an hour using Neumann U87i's for various things.I have heard from more than one source that the 87ai is for the most part a dim representation of its older brothers and sisters.

And I second Chess' take on the simple idea that each mic is going to have some element about its individual sound that makes it the right choice at the time. I have had sessions where the 'right' vocal mic was a Shure SM58 and not the U whatever on the stand next to it.

BTW....the M149 is my personal favorite.

 

[chessparov]

Another heavyweight contender at barely under $1000,
is the AEA R84 ribbon microphone, designed and sold by Wes Dooley. Supposed to sound stunning based on early reports.
Totally different sounds than these Neumann's, but it's also a proven one (RCA 77DX, RCA 44).

Chris

 

[Mark7]

I notice a matched pair of C42s will set you back $500 less than a pair of 184s.

Funny, I always thought it'd be the other way round.

BARGAIN!

Note: At the current ROE that's only £574!

 

[Giganova]

The closest to the "Neumann sound" on my voice is the Beyer M88TG.
Chris

How can a dynamic mic sound closest to a large diaphragm condenser Neumann mic? I am puzzled.

 

[Richard Monroe]

A B.L.U.E. Dragonfly Deluxe is about half the price of a U87ai, and I'd trade the ai for it in a heartbeat. This says nothing about older U87's, which I haven't had the chance to audition, unfortunately.-Richie

 

[chessparov]

It seems the tone of a given microphone can outweigh whether it's condenser, dynamic, or ribbon based.
I first learned this from posts on RAP by Bob Ohlsson.

He would be one of the best sources for a more proper explanation. He posted that for about the first 10 years of his recording career he was a self-described "Neumann snob".
Ironically, in high school he told a famous (name not posted)
singer how Shure's suck, and Shure enough , years later at Motown he ended up using SM57's on this guy's voice because it worked better than any of the Neumanns available!
(Bob's a very nice person, and helpful to all levels BTW)

At Motown, they would put put a Unidyne III (SM57, 545) as the
talkback microphone many times, so you could tell how well it
did compared to the one of the main studio microphones on a
given voice.

The two he always tries first on a singer in addition to a Neumann U87;

1) Shure SM57 (duh!)
2) Electro-Voice EV 635a omni dynamic
(I like that one on tenors and sopranos)

IIRC, he uses a Martech pre now.

The Shure Unidyne III's were very popular, particularly with West
Coast recording studios in the 60's as a lead vocal microphone.

Chris

 

[bunyip]

This is as good as a NEUMANN !!!!!!!!!

These guys are selling 5 UNITS at cost
I bought one at $899 am a little peeved but it has a beutiful sound

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=41466&item=2541840925

wattssnr (ebay ID)

 

[Fletcher]

Re: Re: As Good As A Neumann. But Cheaper

Neumann are the best there is.

Not by a long shot... [while we're here... may I suggest you skip the Kool-Aid?]

 

[Mark7]

Re: Re: As Good As A Neumann. But Cheaper

Neumann are the best there is.

At what? Laurel sitting!?

 

[acorec]

Re: Re: Re: As Good As A Neumann. But Cheaper

The examples that are given for the cheap shit mics always boils down to one friggin guy (or girl, or trumpet, or etc. ) that the cheapies sound good on. I suggest to all the peolpe who really love the chinese cheap mics that they should only use these in your studio and forget the real mics. Pro studios may use Shure, EV and some others, but these are not in the current crop of welfare mics. Nuemans, BLUE and mics in this price range have way more flexability than the cheapos. As for the TLM103, most every major studio uses them and it was (and is) a very popular mic among pros. When I got mine, I searched to see the reviews and who uses them. I could read for days on the peolpe who use them, their applications, etc. Maybe only on this BBS would it be a bad mic. But, when you leave the "home rec" world, it is a highly reguarded mic.

 

[Giganova]

Re: This is as good as a NEUMANN !!!!!!!!!

[ooops -- wrong "as good as a Neumann" thread]

 

[acorec]

Ahem

I am that guy, and I specifically stated between 1/2 and 9/10ths the Neumann prices.

Not $100 to $300.

read the thread properly in future

You should read your own post. How is soundeluxe 1/2 to 9/10 the price of neuman? It is MORE expensive at $2500. I can get a U87 for $1800!

 

[Mark7]

Hmmph

The Soundelux (note, no E) U99 is a sweepable pattern tube mic that can be bought from a (ahem) well known East Coast pro audio store for $2,500. The Neumann equivalent (the M149) goes for over $3,000. A U87 from Beautician's Trend will set you back more than the U99 as well.

In other words. It's a bloody good deal.

 

[DJL]

Well, I figured my price range would keep the gear snobs quiet (except for those amongst them who think Neumann are shonky builders of worthless trash ). Plus we don't get to hear much about great mid priced gear any more what with all the best condenser under $100 threads.

I agree, but I would think that even a true hardcore microphone junkie who has many Neumann, RCA, Soundelux, AEA, Eathworks, Coles, Blue, Josephson Brauner, T.H.E., Larson, Royer, Schoepps and etc would still enjoy some of the cheaper costing microphones.

Also, I think one of the neat things about microphones is that they all sound a little different and some are very unique…. So I would think that even a true hardcore microphone junkie would enjoy looking for different sounding microphones to add to their collection even if it was one of those cheap Chinese made microphones like the Marshall MXL603S. I would think it's more about how a microphone preforms than how much it cost or who it's made buy.

 

[Mark7]

And, just in case your blood isn't hot enough yet old chap, go take a look at the prices on the Lawson site (especially the L47MP).

I hear a few people like them.

 

[Mark7]

I agree, but I would think that even a true hardcore microphone junkie who has many Neumann, RCA, Soundelux, AEA, Eathworks, Coles, Blue, Josephson Brauner, T.H.E., Larson, Royer, Schoepps and etc would still enjoy some of the cheaper costing microphones.

Also, I think one of the neat things about microphones is that they all sound a little different and some are very unique…. So I would think that even a true hardcore microphone junkie would enjoy looking for different sounding microphones to add to their collection even if it was one of those cheap Chinese made microphones like the Marshall MXL603S. I would think it's more about how a microphone preforms than how much it cost or who it's made buy.

Kudos for that DJ!