Amp Simulators vs. Micing an Amp

[kcearl]

Hey...I'm sorry....I wasn't trying to leave you out in the other thread, it was just an example for Chater-La (since she asked)...
...but if it makes you feel any better, here ya go:

A. Classic Rock
B. Pop
C. Metal
D. Country
E. Alt Rock
F. Techno/Electronic



There will always be a place for you on these forums....

i just mentioned that on the right thread lol

 

[kcearl]

wow, didn't know everyone was so passionate about this. I think I'm going to mic my POD from now on to make everyone happy! Nah, I'll just make myself happy and do whatever I want!

no one is that passionate...just none of us has lives, thats why we post here

 

[aaronmcoleman]

I've been listening to a lot of classic rock stuff lately and am now convinced The Eagles, Steely Dan, ELO, and even Queen used amp sims. Led Zepplin and The Ramones did not, and the Beatles switched it up between real amps and sims. That is the final verdict.

 

[grimtraveller]

It can't be. The thread's not closed yet, ha ha !

 

[kidkage]

I agree. With some you can't tell the difference with some you can. (sims+players who use them)
Just cause someone is a commercial artist doesnt mean you wont be able to tell:
Greg L, Drugstore Fanatics? I cant tell what theyre using
Megadeth? Has the infamous sim sizzle.

 

[kidkage]

That whole- great player, great guitar, great amp, great mic, great room thing costs too much anyway. Just save yourself time and money and buy an axe-fx ultra

 

[jason14]

So most people here are saying that amp sims are ok if you have a good one but no one really mentioned which are the good ones. My buddy told me that Waves Gtr is pretty cheap now so I've been looking into it and seems cool. I know waves are good but 100 bucks seems really cheap. Any of you tried it? I'm curious to know your opinions if it sounds like the crappy pod.

 

[miroslav]

.

...people here are saying that amp sims are ok if you have a good one but no one really mentioned which are the good ones.

Yeah...I too was hoping to hear which ones people think are the high-end sims that you can't tell apart from high-end tube amps. I wouldn't mind checking them out.
(I hope no one says Line 6.... )

 

[RAMI]

I think a few were mentioned earlier. Anyway, I'm pretty sure Greg uses Guitar Rig 4.

 

[miroslav]

I've tried some of the Amplitube stuff...didn't think it was like a real amp, but again, it probably blends OK in a mix.
I would really like to hear from any folks that have some high-end tube amps, but who also find certain sims to be an equal choice quality-wise. What sims are they?
The Line 6 stuff has never done anything for me...and that includes their hybrid sim/valve amps.

Not to sound snooty...but when some folks who appear at best to only have 1 or 2 lower-end amps and have never used anything up-scale, go out of their way to talk-up sims as an equal alternative to tube amps, I just can't tell if their views are somehow skewed or misguided???
Like if some 19-year old n00b who is still living at home, is talking up the quality of sims...I wonder if he's ever even touched a high-end tube amp? It makes me wonder if those kind of folks are really comparing fairly and from a point of hands-on experience with top-quality tube amps.

I wouldn't mind having at least some high-end sims that I could use on those occasions when I'm too lazy to mess with an amp ...and then I might find a reason to also split and track some dry, DI guitars...just to experiment or even blend some real tube amp tracks with some high-end sims. That might be cool to mess with.

 

[aaronmcoleman]

I am considering a nice sim, and have no problem with the nice ones I've used in the past.

Just for reference I have a DR Z maz 18, fender twin, drri, hotrod deluxe, and an old marshal plexi, and have used dozens of others. So these opinions aren't just coming from dudes with no experience with nice amps.

 

[miroslav]

OK...so what's a "nice sim"...???

Maybe not all...but there are many opinions here on the forums from guys with little hands-on experience with anything but the entry-level equipment they have, and yet they are convinced that it's all top-quality stuff and they don't need anything better.
I mean, there's guys defending the quality of Behringer preamps and $60 microphones...so like, I'm not sure that they have very objective/experienced opinions....if you know what I mean.

 

[kcearl]

shit Miro youve got a gob on you lol

 

[miroslav]

You've had your moments too....

 

[kcearl]

You've had your moments too....

yeah but generally i try to insult the prick in question and not half the members using budget mics and entry level equipment..no wonder Greg accuses you of being a snob half the time..its how you sound

 

[miroslav]

If you read my post...I'm not insulting anyone about the gear they use. I've had my share of budget gear (and still have plenty).
What I said was...when folks who have nothing BUT a few low-budget pieces start talking them up and even ridiculing the notion that high-end equipment is needed or worth it...it's hard to accept their views as coming from a point of hands-on experience.
I mean...if they never used it, how do they know it's not worth the money or that it can really be simulated by a $100 algorithm?


Oh...not sure where/when Greg accused me of being a "fucking snob"...maybe that's some private conversation you guys had...but I've not had any bad words with Greg in quite a long time now.
If I grew up with a silver spoon in my mouth and always had nothing but the best, that'd be one thing. Actually, I was poor at one time, and as I said, had my share of low budget gear, but now I'm not, and can afford to buy-up.
If that makes me a snob....whatever...but I've simply learned that with audio gear, you get what you pay for....YMMV.

 

[grimtraveller]

If my dentist used Behringer drills, I'd still go !

I mean, there's guys defending the quality of Behringer preamps and $60 microphones...so like, I'm not sure that they have very objective/experienced opinions....

True, but at the same time, if you think that something is really good because it works for you and you've worked to ways of tweaking it {'grades of Tweakation' }, then in a way, the fact that there may be much more expensive and better quality gear to do the same job isn't really relevant or important. I agree that it's unwise to knock equipment that one has never had experience of, but not to sing the praises of level entry stuff if you're happy with it.
Funny thing ~ sometimes, you'd think that amp sims and the like were only invented a couple of years ago but they've been around at least since the early to mid 90s.

 

[kcearl]

If you read my post...I'm not insulting anyone about the gear they use. I've had my share of budget gear (and still have plenty).
What I said was...when folks who have nothing BUT a few low-budget pieces start talking them up and even ridiculing the notion that high-end equipment is needed or worth it...it's hard to accept their views as coming from a point of hands-on experience.
I mean...if they never used it, how do they know it's not worth the money or that it can really be simulated by a $100 algorithm?


Oh...not sure where/when Greg accused me of being a "fucking snob"...maybe that's some private conversation you guys had...but I've not had any bad words with Greg in quite a long time now.
If I grew up with a silver spoon in my mouth and always had nothing but the best, that'd be one thing. Actually, I was poor at one time, and as I said, had my share of low budget gear, but now I'm not, and can afford to buy-up.
If that makes me a snob....whatever...but I've simply learned that with audio gear, you get what you pay for....YMMV.

and Ive learned that its the person and not the gear that make the biggest difference...and I imagine its been around a week or so since Greg last called you an audio snob I bet..and it is how you come across Miro..

but Ive better things to do today than go 12 rounds with you so have at it mate

 

[miroslav]

True, but at the same time, if you think that something is really good because it works for you and you've worked to ways of tweaking it {'grades of Tweakation' }, then in a way, the fact that there may be much more expensive and better quality gear to do the same job isn't really relevant or important. I agree that it's unwise to knock equipment that one has never had experience of, but not to sing the praises of level entry stuff if you're happy with it.
Funny thing ~ sometimes, you'd think that amp sims and the like were only invented a couple of years ago but they've been around at least since the early to mid 90s.

I've sang the praises of low-budget gear often, and still do.
I got a $150 Fat Head ribbon that I use almost exclusively on my guitar cabs.
My sub-300 A.R.T. Pro VLA compressor kicks-ass and gets used more than any of my other (more expensive) compressors.
I've bought sub-$500 guitars on eBay many times, and loved them.

Etc...etc...etc...

But you know...if I never used a $2000 microphone...or preamp...or guitar amp....
...it would be rather foolish of me to act like my budget-stuff is as good as it gets.

Know what I mean...?

That's all I was saying.
I'm not knocking low-budget gear or anyone that uses it. I just don't always know if the opinions expressed here by some folks are really objective or purely subjective based on their own limited studio world, and there is occasionally a sort of reverse-snobbishness about using high-end/high-proceed gear, and it comes mainly from folks that can't afford it or that have never used it.
I was a n00b at one time too.

Hey, if anyone wants to experience real gear snobbery...head over to some of the pro audio forums. Most of those guys won't bother answering a n00b asking about $50 mics and whatnot. I've never been like that.

 

[miroslav]

and Ive learned that its the person and not the gear that make the biggest difference...

Yeah...I've heard that one many times before.
We all say that when we want to feel good about what we have.

...I imagine its been around a week or so since Greg last called you an audio snob I bet..and it is how you come across Miro..

Well, I must have missed when/where that happend...but I see you're keeping score.
So like...why did you have to use Greg as cover for your comment?
You wanna call me an audio snob, just go for it, no need to bring anyone else into it.

Somehow shit always swings into personal territory with you. I thought we were past all that, but yeah, I see now what you mean how you like to come into a thread looking to insult someone...but now you say you don't wanna go 12 rounds with me.
Next you'll say I started it...yeah, have at it mate!