After all is said and done

[Jack Hammer]

The thread on old vs. new pre-amp technology certainly contained many great and valid points and was informative and enlightening. But after all has been said and done, I am fairly set on deciding to purchase for my first high end pre-amp a Universal Audio 2-610. For one thing, I tend to like the "tube sound". For another, it got a great review in MIX magazine, a magazine I have some respect for. Also, it has some EQ on it, it is stereo and has instrument inputs. Therefor, I reason, I can use it for vocals and for addng some fullness, punch and low end rumble to my bass and kick drum tracks and for adding some detail, warmth and balls to my synth and electric piano tracks both of which I use extensively.

Later on, I will probably want to add something solid state such as the Great River or Focusrite Red or possibley an Avalon.

Anyway, there it is. Meanwhile, the debate, it seems, will always rage on.

 

[20db.com]

I am fairly set on deciding to purchase for my first high end pre-amp a Universal Audio 2-610. For one thing, I tend to like the "tube sound".

Jack, I also like to have a "tube sound" as you called it, at my disposal and I would never discourage you or anyone from adding a UA if you have room in the rack.

Now I don't know what kind of music you record but I wouldn't normally recommend the 610 as your "first high end pre-amp". The only reason I say this is because it limits you to only one style of brush.

Now granted its a nice brush but if you take the desert island approach and were stuck with only that one mic pre to use I would not pick the 610. Not sure how long it will be before you add another brush but you might want to consider this issue.

While MIX might have given this a good review you have to remember this was not a shoot out and I doubt (didn't read the review) they put the 610 in context with the other mic pres they had in the rack next to it.

If I were in your situation and was getting my first high end mic pre I think I would put more weight in the "home run" or "first call" list that guys I know depend on.

I purposely am not giving you any product suggestions (althought I have my desert island pick) but instead trying to get you to think about this more in terms of the 610 being A single use product.

I think you can still get that warm sound you like but pick a mic pre with a lot more versatilty than the 610.

Lee

 

[Michael Jones]

Re: Re: After all is said and done

...Now I don't know what kind of music you record but I wouldn't normally recommend the 610 as your "first high end pre-amp"...

Lee, just out of curiosity, what would your reccommendation for a "first high end pre" be?

My first "high end" pre was a pair of audix 35102's racked by Brent Averill. Well, maybe they are not high, high end, but certainly mid - high end.

At any rate, I really like them a lot! Sure would like to audition a pair of 1073's though.

Jack, enjoy your new toy, and be sure to post some samples. I'm hope it fills all your expectations.

 

[20db.com]

Well without knowing a lot more about your setup I would be simply guessing at a recommendation and that is what I see a lot of on the forums. So it would be irresponsible of me to simply throw out a product name for your specific needs.

But, I will say I have a lot of respect for Brent and his work and while I am have not heard the Audix's my guess is you have a very nice sounding pair of mic pres that will last you a long time.

At any rate, I really like them a lot! Sure would like to audition a pair of 1073's though.

Not sure how the 1073's would sound "character wise" in comparison to your Audix but my guess is you would really love them. If you think you want a pair of 1073's [who wouldn't ] I suggest you take a serious look at the Great River MP-2NV.

It is based on the 1073 and built and designed by Dan Kennedy. This is currently my favorite mic pre and if I say any more about it you might think I am biased and spamming. But do some research on your own you will see the same glowing comments by anyone who has used one. If you believe Fletcher, I think you will find he will confirm my opinion.

I am working on a CD right now and the guy was in the studio last week and again this week, and he went on and on about how good his vocals sounded through the NV. He even sent me an email that night telling me his voice sounded so good he found he was trying different harmonys that he would never had tried before. So for me this is the BEST endorsement a piece of gear can get.

Anyway, my comments on Jacks decision were certainly not meant to discount the value of the 610 its just it has a very distinct "flavor". So for me if I only had one choice and for that kind of money I would have to pick the Great River.

Not sure if that answers your question or not but hope helps a little.

 

[Michael Jones]

Well without knowing a lot more about your setup I would be simply guessing at a recommendation and that is what I see a lot of on the forums. So it would be irresponsible of me to simply throw out a product name for your specific needs.

Of course, how silly of me.
I'd say 90% of the work I do is instrumental music for film and video. My main instrument of choice is a 7'-2" Boston Grand Piano.
My chain is this:
Mics >> audix 35102's >> Steinberg 8 I/O AD/DA converters >> RME 96/52 Sound card using ADAT optical interface >> Nuendo Recording software at 24 bit. >> Event 20/20 Bas Monitors, and Tannoy Reveal monitors for a "Second Opinion" on mixes.

Mics of choice for the piano range from paired TLM 103's to Shure SM81's to Octava MC012's in that order. (I have many other mics, but those are my favorite for my piano.)

A sample of this chain using the TLM 103's can be heard here:
http://artists3.iuma.com/site-bin/streammp3.m3u?190193

And a short sample using the SM81's can be heard here:
http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=1656&alid=-1 (look for song titled SM81eqa.mp3)

I've had my eye on the Mercenary Edition of the Great River for some time.

In addition to the above chain, I have several mic pre's available on my Yamaha O1V mixer (used primarily as a control surface for Nuendo) and they are exceptionally clean, and ummm... un-flavoured.

Any suggestions are certainly welcome.
Thanks
~Michael~

Anyway, my comments on Jacks decision were certainly not meant to discount the value of the 610 its just it has a very distinct "flavor". So for me if I only had one choice and for that kind of money I would have to pick the Great River

Understood. No harm, no foul.

 

[Jack Hammer]

Interesting view frm open mind

I endeavor to keep an open mind even after I have made a decision. It appears that the deal I was waiting to close for the money for the pre-amp is slightly delayed. Certianly it will happen soon but...In the meantime, I came across a review of the Great River MP2-NV, quite a good review actually. One consideration I am inclined to make is the versatility of any piece of equipment. My studio is mostly used for my own compositions. I have been out of the music business for nearly fifteen eyars and back in only about one year now. I have not accepted any professional assignments however, certain things appear inevitable. First is that because of certain business decisions I have made concerning my re-entry into the music business, many of my first compositions and productions are likely to be in the rap, hip hop, r&b genres. Therefore, I need large, tight bottom end (no aversion to sexual inuendo here buddy) and smooth, clear deep well rounded vocals. The Universal Audio sound is one I like and the preamp, with its built in though limited EQ, will probably do the job well.

Nevertheless, from what I have read, the MP2-NV will do all of that and give the famous "NEVE" sound as well. This is a tuff decision. As I see it, ultimately, I will probably end up with a tube pre-amp and a solid state pre-amp as well for real variety.

Anyway, I appreciate the input from everybody. Frankly, since I have been reading and sharing on this site and studying from other sources, my engineering has improved immeasurably. My tracks sound infinetly better so I have no immediate plans to discontinue hearing from all of you good people.

It is great the way everyone here shares there experience and knowledge so selflessly. Ergo the hostility towards spam, which, by the way, I do not think is involved with this particular thread. I know the posts were honest opinions and no more biased than the ordinary opinions. Bias, after all, can be mistaken for enthusiasim and true good will.

I will keep you all posted for the outcome and post a sample once I have one.

Again, thanx for all the great advice.

 

[20db.com]

Re: Interesting view frm open mind

Anyway, I appreciate the input from everybody. Frankly, since I have been reading and sharing on this site and studying from other sources, my engineering has improved immeasurably. My tracks sound infinetly better so I have no immediate plans to discontinue hearing from all of you good people.

Jack this is one of the most wonderful things about the net, it enables you to interact with people all over the world. It is so cool to be able to gain access to talent represented here and on other pro forums.

As with most things in life, the more I learn the more I realized I don't know. So I don't care how talented or experienced someone is, if they stop and listen any of us can learn some thing every day.

It is great the way everyone here shares there experience and knowledge so selflessly. Ergo the hostility towards spam, which, by the way, I do not think is involved with this particular thread. I know the posts were honest opinions and no more biased than the ordinary opinions. Bias, after all, can be mistaken for enthusiasim and true good will.[/B]

Great comments. Spam is a waste of time and most people can see right through it. On the other hand over zealot self proclaimed forum police think just because you work with audio gear professionally that your opinion is invalid.

Jack the great thing is that you are headed in the right direction. You are looking at quality pro gear and while one may sound different than another every thing you mentioned are purchases that you will be able to keep for many many years.

Good luck