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RSMITH123
New member
Wally,
Are you causing trouble again???????
Are you causing trouble again???????
W
Wallycleaver
New member
RSMITH123 said:Wally,
Are you causing trouble again???????
Not me!
Zeke, I'm sure you know what I mean. I'll rephrase it to "Almost all"
R
Recording Engineer
Moderator
Damn...
Ed ought to appreciate this:
Truthfully... If it were me... And it may eventually be... If the C1 sounds just as good (remember the words "good" and "different" don't mean the same thing) to ME as an MXL V77 ($295 @ 8th Street) or ESPECIALLY an AT4033 on a variety of sound sources, then it's worth it to me. If not, I'd forget about the C1!
Then again, if I though it was worth it... I saw the price difference between the C1 and C3 at one place... If the C3 in cardioid sounds the same as the C1, then I MAY even forget about the C1 and go with the C3! Who knows...
Ed ought to appreciate this:
Truthfully... If it were me... And it may eventually be... If the C1 sounds just as good (remember the words "good" and "different" don't mean the same thing) to ME as an MXL V77 ($295 @ 8th Street) or ESPECIALLY an AT4033 on a variety of sound sources, then it's worth it to me. If not, I'd forget about the C1!
Then again, if I though it was worth it... I saw the price difference between the C1 and C3 at one place... If the C3 in cardioid sounds the same as the C1, then I MAY even forget about the C1 and go with the C3! Who knows...
R
Recording Engineer
Moderator
Then Again...
I see how much C414-EBs are going for now days and can't help but wonder the how the C3 compares to one of these C414-EBs going for so cheap!
I see how much C414-EBs are going for now days and can't help but wonder the how the C3 compares to one of these C414-EBs going for so cheap!
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trebles
New member
All go to the first link read about it all then look at the second link compare the two and search for a similar company name you want to save money heres how
http://www.studioprojectsusa.com/
http://www.797audio.com/html/V_Enlish.htm
Im sure after a little thought you will work out how to buy mics cheap that work and from where
Regards Wayne
http://www.studioprojectsusa.com/
http://www.797audio.com/html/V_Enlish.htm
Im sure after a little thought you will work out how to buy mics cheap that work and from where
Regards Wayne
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trebles
New member
R
Recording Engineer
Moderator
Whoa?
trebles/Wayne
What you saying? If it's what I think you are, I thought everyone knew.
trebles/Wayne
What you saying? If it's what I think you are, I thought everyone knew.
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VirtualSamana
New member
Curious
The pro rec article touched on this a bit but I'm interested to hear all ya'alls input.
If the copy cat mic's were availible in the US and
delivered the same quality as the real thing
with low low prices
would you buy them?
Are 797's ethics different than someone who pirates software and then sells it on ebay for 1/4 of the price?
The pro rec article touched on this a bit but I'm interested to hear all ya'alls input.
If the copy cat mic's were availible in the US and
delivered the same quality as the real thing
with low low prices
would you buy them?
Are 797's ethics different than someone who pirates software and then sells it on ebay for 1/4 of the price?
T
trebles
New member
The url as appears above is a url i found early on somewhere on these boards when i went to the first url and the company spoke about who they were doing business with this jogged my memoreyand i then remembered the post i originally saw in here.
The way it seems is like this take a good look at the condensor
mics on the second site see if you can see any mics any of which you already own or rave about some of the model names also look quite similar i remember seeing somewhere a price sheet that contained prices and models of their mics and i tell you what they got cheaper by the dozen and that aint no joke.
Now given the reputation this company seems to be building for itself before too long its going to be dam hard to buy these mics at the prices they can sell them to you for now if it were me id be getting a fund together reasearching the mics they have which seem to be either direct copies of major branded mics or maybe they are actually the branded models missing a few obvious finishing touches so its going to take someone to really reasearch this right.
If everyone who wants a few mics chucks in some dollars into the fund you can do a bulk purchase super cheap and by the time you all got your quota of mics each i am quite sure it would be worth it to all who were brave enough to take a punt i know for sure id be putting my money into something like this try and buy those same mics with badges intact and iam sure you will pay quite a few more dollars per piece anyway its just my opionion right or wrong nothing ventured nothing gained
The way it seems is like this take a good look at the condensor
mics on the second site see if you can see any mics any of which you already own or rave about some of the model names also look quite similar i remember seeing somewhere a price sheet that contained prices and models of their mics and i tell you what they got cheaper by the dozen and that aint no joke.
Now given the reputation this company seems to be building for itself before too long its going to be dam hard to buy these mics at the prices they can sell them to you for now if it were me id be getting a fund together reasearching the mics they have which seem to be either direct copies of major branded mics or maybe they are actually the branded models missing a few obvious finishing touches so its going to take someone to really reasearch this right.
If everyone who wants a few mics chucks in some dollars into the fund you can do a bulk purchase super cheap and by the time you all got your quota of mics each i am quite sure it would be worth it to all who were brave enough to take a punt i know for sure id be putting my money into something like this try and buy those same mics with badges intact and iam sure you will pay quite a few more dollars per piece anyway its just my opionion right or wrong nothing ventured nothing gained
R
Recording Engineer
Moderator
Ahhh...
I see what you're saying, and again, I thought everyone knew...
More than likely, those are my posts you saw previously; me bringing info from rec.audio.pro I read, plus some other stuff next to from probably the 2nd best source (1st being 797 themselves) directly from the horse's mouth.
And your idea is exactly what probably a few different groups did... I was in one for a CR998 and I believe Harvey was in the same one for 2 CR998s if I remember correctly. About a week before it was all to go down, the guy who was collecting all the money backed-out as he heard MXL was releasing the V77 in about a month or 2 and supposidly the V77 was to be the exact same mic as the CR998 for not much more than we were going to be paying; I pretty much agreed... Obviously, the V77 is the CR100 as we all know now.
But we couldn't try again then as there was a deadline set by 797 because they were expecting some US Distributors in the next few months after... That never happened either... I'm sure the AKG look 'a like logo was a major factor in that; not to mention many other things.
Last I heard from that 2nd to best source was that 797 probably wasn't going to try and enter the world market right now as they have so much demand for OEMs (as we have obviously seen) and I'm sure Ma's (797) experience on r.a.p. didn't help either; not to mention many other things again.
So 797 did this "group" buy before but I don't know if they'll do it now or if they are already doing it again now... BUT, I don't know how they got away legally with the logo thing then or if they could now even if they're willing to sell like that now. Though I think it was probably a "slip through the cracks" before everyone is looking sort of thing... But now that everyone knows, I think everyone's eyes are on them...
About would I buy them if they were available? Well, I already did! 2 CR998s. And so have you with your Rode, MXL, ADK, Studio Projects, , BPM, etc. Some of them EXACTLY the same, some the same but with different housings and/or grills, some with mods, etc. Who does what? 8 of 10 won't say a thing, 1 won't say much, and 1 will say a damn lot! So, who knows what really is exactly what... We all suspect some stuff... I'm sure a lot is true and a lot not; but if it's not, it's more than likely some other Chinese company.
About 797 branded being exact copies... From what I've heard and gathered is that they're all pretty much 797 designs inside the familiar housings and grills. Of course, they may be based slightly or greatly on familiar mics and they may or may not be based on the familiar housings and grills used for the particular models; I'm sure each 797 model differs on that. In fact, if Stephen Paul decides to say what he found in my CR998 publically or privately, you'll see what I mean...
Anyhow, that's just a little bit... Hope it helps.
Weston Ray aka Recording Engineer
I see what you're saying, and again, I thought everyone knew...
More than likely, those are my posts you saw previously; me bringing info from rec.audio.pro I read, plus some other stuff next to from probably the 2nd best source (1st being 797 themselves) directly from the horse's mouth.
And your idea is exactly what probably a few different groups did... I was in one for a CR998 and I believe Harvey was in the same one for 2 CR998s if I remember correctly. About a week before it was all to go down, the guy who was collecting all the money backed-out as he heard MXL was releasing the V77 in about a month or 2 and supposidly the V77 was to be the exact same mic as the CR998 for not much more than we were going to be paying; I pretty much agreed... Obviously, the V77 is the CR100 as we all know now.
But we couldn't try again then as there was a deadline set by 797 because they were expecting some US Distributors in the next few months after... That never happened either... I'm sure the AKG look 'a like logo was a major factor in that; not to mention many other things.
Last I heard from that 2nd to best source was that 797 probably wasn't going to try and enter the world market right now as they have so much demand for OEMs (as we have obviously seen) and I'm sure Ma's (797) experience on r.a.p. didn't help either; not to mention many other things again.
So 797 did this "group" buy before but I don't know if they'll do it now or if they are already doing it again now... BUT, I don't know how they got away legally with the logo thing then or if they could now even if they're willing to sell like that now. Though I think it was probably a "slip through the cracks" before everyone is looking sort of thing... But now that everyone knows, I think everyone's eyes are on them...
About would I buy them if they were available? Well, I already did! 2 CR998s. And so have you with your Rode, MXL, ADK, Studio Projects, , BPM, etc. Some of them EXACTLY the same, some the same but with different housings and/or grills, some with mods, etc. Who does what? 8 of 10 won't say a thing, 1 won't say much, and 1 will say a damn lot! So, who knows what really is exactly what... We all suspect some stuff... I'm sure a lot is true and a lot not; but if it's not, it's more than likely some other Chinese company.
About 797 branded being exact copies... From what I've heard and gathered is that they're all pretty much 797 designs inside the familiar housings and grills. Of course, they may be based slightly or greatly on familiar mics and they may or may not be based on the familiar housings and grills used for the particular models; I'm sure each 797 model differs on that. In fact, if Stephen Paul decides to say what he found in my CR998 publically or privately, you'll see what I mean...
Anyhow, that's just a little bit... Hope it helps.
Weston Ray aka Recording Engineer
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trebles
New member
797 Are after all a business the people id be looking more closely at would be the major manufacturers it may just be them who are to blame here.
Take a look at those mics and compare them you be the judge
as i said before they can be literaly bought cheaper by the dozen from the people above.
dont know about anyone else here but i will buy a few and try them before i knock them given how cheap they are to buy in bulk
When you think about it a product that attains any legendary status does so because people somewhere along the way used it seems these days most everyone waits for others to buy and use stuff before they rush out and buy it themselves i cannot fully blame all for fence sitting but when its so obvious who is making these mics and how much cheaper you could buy them if a few people got together here then it seems crazy why people would just sit and speculate.
As for the studio projects c1 if there was no other way to buy it cheap id buy it from who sells them and give them a go i dont feel anyone would go through all the trouble that they did to give us all a dud report on anything in here ive found most people quite helpfull in here and id give the mic a fair go before anyone condems it to the depths of ebay
hmmmm software companies dont they release all that wonderfull stuff we use full of bugs or so it seems and how much customer service do we really get after we have coughed up the folding green stuff oh yeah by the time you buy it install it all and learn it and fix all its bugs your ready to start all over makes you wonder whos controlling who and for ethics gee i wont even start on that one anyone who ever had a problem with software might agree or compatability problems for that matter theres another wonderfull topic.
I agree the the likes of Neumann got there for a reason but when someone from the other end of town shows you it can be done too you all should be jumping for joy not shutting the gates on them everyone seems to complains how much it all cost for equipment wells heres your chance to turn the tables on the majors and see if what they are selling really stacks up o well i know the first few mics on my list and where they will be coming from.
regards Wayne
Melbourne Australia
ausrock
Well-known member
Trebles,
a word of warning here.
There are a number of "plain brand" large condenser mics already on the market here selling quite a bit cheaper than the Studio Projects mics. And you can bet they are the result of "bulk buying" of the shelf at 797, Sunking (I think thats the name) and possibly a third Chinese/Taiwanese manufacturer.
Marshall mics, to my knoweldge aren't yet available here unfortunately, although Yorkville are marketing their Apex range, again cheaper than the SP mics.
Now I'll probably get flamed for saying the following, but SP has said in the past that they spent considerable time and effort convincing 797 to make the SP mics to PMI Audio Groups specs, rather than buy off the shelf and I think this is one reason the SP mics are getting such a positive response from people who have tried them.
Consequently, if you can manage to purchase direct from 797, or their kind, you run a great risk of getting what you pay for.........a cheap mic with a cheapish sound. Also, have a good look at the costs involved in importing.
Sorry to rain on your parade, but that's the way it is.
Peace.............ChrisO
a word of warning here.
There are a number of "plain brand" large condenser mics already on the market here selling quite a bit cheaper than the Studio Projects mics. And you can bet they are the result of "bulk buying" of the shelf at 797, Sunking (I think thats the name) and possibly a third Chinese/Taiwanese manufacturer.
Marshall mics, to my knoweldge aren't yet available here unfortunately, although Yorkville are marketing their Apex range, again cheaper than the SP mics.
Now I'll probably get flamed for saying the following, but SP has said in the past that they spent considerable time and effort convincing 797 to make the SP mics to PMI Audio Groups specs, rather than buy off the shelf and I think this is one reason the SP mics are getting such a positive response from people who have tried them.
Consequently, if you can manage to purchase direct from 797, or their kind, you run a great risk of getting what you pay for.........a cheap mic with a cheapish sound. Also, have a good look at the costs involved in importing.
Sorry to rain on your parade, but that's the way it is.
Peace.............ChrisO
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trebles
New member
Heres the email guys 797 replied to me so take a read at what they said they never said that bulk buying is impossible either and if we knew the exact models to pick out we may be in front on this one.
ive imported things slightly different to the way they maybe do things i may try them again with an idea lets see what they say
heres what they said anyway in reply to my email to them
Dear Sir.
Maybe you can contact with Alan Hyatt: alan@pmiaudio.com
Studio Projects
23773 Madison Street
Torrance, CA 90505
310-373-9129 fax: 310-373-4714
toll free: 877-563-6335 www.studioprojectsusa.com
e-mail: info@studioprojectsusa.com
the studio Project C1,C3,T3 are made by 797audio.
To buy one or two pcs mic from us is difficult(customs clearance,shipping etc and the cost is high).
Best regards
Jessica.
www.797audio.com
regards Wayne
ive imported things slightly different to the way they maybe do things i may try them again with an idea lets see what they say
heres what they said anyway in reply to my email to them
Dear Sir.
Maybe you can contact with Alan Hyatt: alan@pmiaudio.com
Studio Projects
23773 Madison Street
Torrance, CA 90505
310-373-9129 fax: 310-373-4714
toll free: 877-563-6335 www.studioprojectsusa.com
e-mail: info@studioprojectsusa.com
the studio Project C1,C3,T3 are made by 797audio.
To buy one or two pcs mic from us is difficult(customs clearance,shipping etc and the cost is high).
Best regards
Jessica.
www.797audio.com
regards Wayne
ausrock
Well-known member
Sorry, but count me out..................! And I suggest if you are serious(god forbid), that you post in a new thread for the subject.
Peace...........ChrisO
Peace...........ChrisO
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trebles
New member
Chris the c1 seems to come from 797 and everyone seems to be raving about it my email even confirms it so whats the big drama with 797 i think people will begin to see its about time mic prices dropped to a reasonable rate and everyone got more bang for their buck alot of people in here seem to be in pursuit of this so why not see what all the fuss is really all about before we kick the chinese in the guts.
ausrock
Well-known member
Damn, I typed this out then lost it.....OK, second time.........
Trebs,
You misunderstood what I was getting at.
There would appear to be a significant difference in quality between the "off the shelf" mics (which is what you would be buying) and the mics from Studio Projects and I suspect Marshall Electronics. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
I own a C1 and I'm more than pleased with it and I'm not "kicking the Chinese in the guts, I just dont believe you would get the same quality as 797's large volume buyers.
Peace.......ChrisO
Trebs,
You misunderstood what I was getting at.
There would appear to be a significant difference in quality between the "off the shelf" mics (which is what you would be buying) and the mics from Studio Projects and I suspect Marshall Electronics. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
I own a C1 and I'm more than pleased with it and I'm not "kicking the Chinese in the guts, I just dont believe you would get the same quality as 797's large volume buyers.
Peace.......ChrisO
R
RSMITH123
New member
I guess after everything has been said (and repeated) on thing remains...
A mic that sounds good is a good sounding mic regardless of what price it is or who makes it.
A mic that sounds good is a good sounding mic regardless of what price it is or who makes it.
MrZekeMan
New member
Re: Curious
Good question,
It would depend. I believe in letting someone reap the benefits of their invention. I think they should make their fortune if they invent a better mouse trap.
What really irks me though, is when a company gets leverage in a market, and proceeds to really gouge people on price.
I went into the floor business in the 80's. I maintained tile floors in big discount stores, department stores, and 24hr grocery stores. It was just when propane engine powered floor buffing machines were invented. These machines made everything before them obsolete.
Companies that were building these machines were getting patents on certain designs they were putting into their particular machines, and making it hard for anyone else to build them, thus cutting down on competition.
I got fed up and started building my own machines. I could build for $1,500 what it cost me $4,000 to buy, and that was in mid 1980's dollars. Plus my machines were superior. They were built like a tank, using steel where the commercial machines of the time were generally aluminum. And they did a much more efficient job of buffing, due to the intuitive designs of a colleague of mine, who was building his own machines as well.
You have to keep in mind too, that I wasn't mass producing these machines. Had I been, I could have built them much cheaper. In my opinion, these companies were gouging.
Was I violating any patents? No. I wasn't selling them. You can build anything you want, using anyone's patent, as long as you don't sell what you build.
The market is different today. There's more competition. But if I were to go buy a machine today, I would avoid at all cost the company that was gouging me 15 years ago.
So to answer your question, it would depend. Whether it be mics or anything else, it would depend first on whether or not they were being legally sold. If they weren't violating any laws and they were substantially cheaper with the same quality, I would buy them in a heart beat. If I felt I hadn't been gouged by the company that originally manufactured the product, and they were still in the same ball park price-wise, I would probably stick with the original.
VirtualSamana said:
Good question,
It would depend. I believe in letting someone reap the benefits of their invention. I think they should make their fortune if they invent a better mouse trap.
What really irks me though, is when a company gets leverage in a market, and proceeds to really gouge people on price.
I went into the floor business in the 80's. I maintained tile floors in big discount stores, department stores, and 24hr grocery stores. It was just when propane engine powered floor buffing machines were invented. These machines made everything before them obsolete.
Companies that were building these machines were getting patents on certain designs they were putting into their particular machines, and making it hard for anyone else to build them, thus cutting down on competition.
I got fed up and started building my own machines. I could build for $1,500 what it cost me $4,000 to buy, and that was in mid 1980's dollars. Plus my machines were superior. They were built like a tank, using steel where the commercial machines of the time were generally aluminum. And they did a much more efficient job of buffing, due to the intuitive designs of a colleague of mine, who was building his own machines as well.
You have to keep in mind too, that I wasn't mass producing these machines. Had I been, I could have built them much cheaper. In my opinion, these companies were gouging.
Was I violating any patents? No. I wasn't selling them. You can build anything you want, using anyone's patent, as long as you don't sell what you build.
The market is different today. There's more competition. But if I were to go buy a machine today, I would avoid at all cost the company that was gouging me 15 years ago.
So to answer your question, it would depend. Whether it be mics or anything else, it would depend first on whether or not they were being legally sold. If they weren't violating any laws and they were substantially cheaper with the same quality, I would buy them in a heart beat. If I felt I hadn't been gouged by the company that originally manufactured the product, and they were still in the same ball park price-wise, I would probably stick with the original.
MrZekeMan
New member
Wil Davis,
I can see that your post was removed pretty quickly. I would just like to add, that you misspelled capitalization and vomited.
I can see that your post was removed pretty quickly. I would just like to add, that you misspelled capitalization and vomited.
W
Wil Davis
New member
Well, yes - but not quickly enough to avoid scrutiny by the dreaded "MrZekeMan Spelling-Checker", obviously.
On having second thoughts, I realised that my comments didn't really add anything to what was an interesting thread. One of the problems of the "InterNet Age" is that it's so easy to type faster that one can think, which is not always a Good Thing, and can lead to much misunderstanding...
;>
- Wil
On having second thoughts, I realised that my comments didn't really add anything to what was an interesting thread. One of the problems of the "InterNet Age" is that it's so easy to type faster that one can think, which is not always a Good Thing, and can lead to much misunderstanding...
;>
- Wil
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