A Mackie Mixer, a Balanced patchbay and an unbalanced 4-track go in to a bar...

[Scooter B]

Well now that I have you attention I just can't figure out the best way to patch this all together.

As mentioned I have a 1402-VLZ PRO, a Neutrick Balanced Patchbay and unfortunately a Yamaha 4-track cassette that has unbalanced ins/outs only. I also have an unbalanced patchbay not in use.

(I had expected to upgrade to a DAW but my bonus did not come through..another story )

For preamps:
Joe Meek VCQ6
DMP-3
ART TUBEPAC (not bad for bass DI after the SansAMP)
and the Mackie's

Effects and compressor:
Behringer Composer Pro
RNC
ART Elite Multi effects
Nano Verb
old noisy ADA Digital Delay

I also have an Echo Darla 24 that came with Cool Edit demo version.

I basically want to do some decent bedroom demos and play guitar and bass. For drums I have a Boss DR-5 and Fruity loops on the PC (have not had time to learn the Fruity Loops).

I don't sing but plan on having some vocalists over. With only four tracks I dont have the luxery of dedicating each track to one general purpose. I generally would do drums in stereo, 1 track of bass and rhythm guitar > bounce to two track and add lead guitar and sometimes vocals. So far it is just me one intrument at a time so I don't need to do alot of "live" mixing although I like to run DI'd guitar cabinet simulators into an amp and mic to add more "life" to the recording and mix into the original track.

I know the PC would probably yeild much better results but it is the "family" PC and in a noisy part of the house for recording. I would like to master some stuff to the PC eventually to burn CD's.

Q1. Would it be best to ditch the balanced patch bay (for now) and use the 1402 for mixing (and patching) into the 4 track?

Q2. Do I only insert the unbalanced cables going from the balanced patch bay (or mixer) "half way" that feed the unbalanced 4-track?

Any help is appreciated....well any well informed help would be appreciated.

 

[Sennheiser]

I would ditch the balanced bay for now, but hang on to it. Use the unbalanced bay with the four-track. I think it would be easier to use. You may not need it at all if you have enough in's and out's on the Mackie. I'm not that familiar with it.

Does the 1402 have sends and dedicated returns for your effects?

 

[Scooter B]

Does the 1402 have sends and dedicated returns for your effects?

I think so but I have not had time to really read the manual and I don't have any previous experience with mixers.

I understand sends and returns as in effects loops for guitar and bass amps but I don't quite understand how inserts are used.

Previously (before I found this site) since the 4-track itself was unbalanced I did not buy balanced patch cables or patch pays and did not have any preamps.

The unbalanced patchbay was very usefull and has been structured as follows:

Rows
1: Input channel 1 (Top)
Input channel 3 (Bottom)
2: Input channel 2
Input channel 4
3: Aux 1 Send
Aux 2 send
4: Aux 1 return L
Aux 1 return R
5: Aux 2 return L
Aux 2 return R
6- 24 send and returns from comps and effects and line outs to patch to cassette decks.

When I though I had the money coming for AW16G I picked up a balanced patchbay and some TRS cables.

So some of my stuff - Preamps, Mackie mixer, Behringer Compsoser Pro and Sans Amp DI, V-Amp along with my Mics (MLX V-67, 2 Oktavia MC-012's and an SM-57) are balanced.

Plugging the mic cables in and out the racked pre-amps is a hassle but since the mixer has the XLR inputs on top they are easier to get to but then I have a longer signal path....

Of course all of this primarily will go to 4-track cassette degredation and then possibly into the PC via the Echo Darla 24 for MP-3 and CD burning. I planned to run the 4-track mix via either the Composer Pro or the DMP-3 to get a balance line into the Echo Darla.

This patching a hybrid system on an extremely limited budget is quite frustrating!

I will check my manual and check on the dedicated sends and returns but lets assume yes for now.

I thought even though the end recording unit is unbalanced that keeping everything else on balanced line whenever possible would still be benificial.

 

[Scooter B]

Senhieser,

I just read the manual (on-line at work).

Channels 1-6 have dedicated sends and returns 7-14 do not.
The dedicated sends and returns can be run either in series or parallel.

All 14 channels have inserts.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Sennheiser]

Don't worry about the inserts for now. You can use them for "inserting" your RNC compressor into the signal chain. You can also use a gate or any other of a variety of dynamic processors. Don't use a dynamic processor on a send.

The bay that I used to use with my very first four track was a neccesity as I didn't even have any sends on it. It looks to me like you have three effect units (not sure what the Behringer Composer Pro is) maybe four. So if you want to use all of them without re-patching from the sound card, I would use the unbalanced bay.

Mine was set up for straight through patching. In other words, all of the in and out jacks of all of my outboards were presented at the patchbay so I wasn't crawling around all of the time repatching from the rear. There are other ways of patching that I am not totally comfortable explaining since I've never used those configurations though I understand the basic concept.

Others here use different configurations for different purposes extensively because of the scope of their setups. Right now I have no need of a patchbay as I am able to bounce tracks (if I should ever have to) from the mixer because of it's design and I haven't used up all of my sends yet. Soon though.

Someone here will advise.