A different kind of mix contest

[caryindy]

tonight, I'm going to post the track from the CD so everyone can compare.

(I'll go ahead and put on my nomex racing suit)

 

[Strave]

First off, nice song I have done a couple of the mix contests and so far these were the easiest actual tracks to mix. I personally like the heavy guitars, and the drum tracks are decent etc...

Of course these are just my opinions, nothing personal so take it how you guys want.

Now that I have given my feedback, here is a link to my first 30-45 minutes of this song

http://www.nowhereradio.com/xstatic/singles?aid=4450&alid=-1&1111094015

This is the kind of criticism I like, you actually named things that could be better. I agree with most of the things you said. I made that kick just too loud. However, I think that kind of voice needs this kind of processing, but that's just what I've drawn from the kind of music I listen to. That compression of the whole track was done after the actual mixing process yet it seems to be the main focus of everyone's attack. I was just trying to get it loud but, in the end, it seems that's what everyone doesn't like. I might post a remix if I get some time without compressing the whole track but I don't really feel it coming. As for the snare... it was a sample/blended with the original about 50 50 to keep the original dynamics and decay but to add some crack to it. A lot of the wavering in vocals... and things that you'll notice aren't in my mix (the squeaks on the Is, "lieeeeeee" I think wavered, etc.) are because I cut them and took a better take of the same part. So if something sounds fixed in mine... it may not be from autotune (autotune was barely doing it's thang) but because I actually replaced it with another.

Like we've all said, it's all opinion. I get my influence on how things should sound from listening to the bands that sound this way... if you turn on fuse or mtv or whatever you have, you're going to be hard-pressed to find a band of this style who isn't completely proccesed. Thanks for your comments, I appreciate criticism with support.

Bluebear - I never said my listening space was better than yours, in fact I said it was much worse (computer speakers and headphones), I just said this wasn't a priority (which is why I didn't bust out the monitors and why I finished within like an hour of starting).

Anyways guys, have fun.

 

[xstatic]

This is kind of funny. I just looked at your link in your post Strave. I have worked with probably 95% of the bands listed on your page doing live shows

 

[BRIEFCASEMANX]

I was hoping to get some criticism from mine but it's mostly just talk inbetween the guys who are already good-great at mixing.....

 

[Strave]

This is kind of funny. I just looked at your link in your post Strave. I have worked with probably 95% of the bands listed on your page doing live shows

Haha that's awesome. Yeah I've played shows with maybe like 3%

 

[gusfmm]

Just had a listen - nice job! Only thing that I really don't care for is the kick and the bass -- it's booming all over the place on my system and the kick has too much 'point' on it.

Well, actually the whole thing rumbled less in my set-up than Bear's. I totally agree with Xtatic's comments in general.

As a listener and musician, not an expert AE, I think Xtatic's sounded better than any other I've heard thus far. At least it doesn't sound over-processed (Strave), nor it had some details I didn't like from Bear's (like bass making the whole room rumble like hell, singer almost lost when background vocal go along).


IMHO, Strave's was probably the most original but not the best sounding, Bear's overall mix was very well balanced although too bassy, Xtatic's was well balanced and pretty much doing well where others were a bit weak. Again, MHO.


p.s. Just in case, I'm using Wharfedales 8.2A

 

[thajeremy]

I listened to mine in the car today and was not pleased with a few things so i made a few last adjustments...i pulled some of the low end out of the bass and kick and dropped the levels a little bit. I also added some of the mids back into the guitars.

when is the deadline on this anyway???

 

[chessrock]

Well, actually the whole thing rumbled less in my set-up than Bear's. I totally agree with Xtatic's comments in general.

As a listener and musician, not an expert AE, I think Xtatic's sounded better than any other I've heard thus far. At least it doesn't sound over-processed (Strave), nor it had some details I didn't like from Bear's (like bass making the whole room rumble like hell, singer almost lost when background vocal go along).


IMHO, Strave's was probably the most original but not the best sounding, Bear's overall mix was very well balanced although too bassy, Xtatic's was well balanced and pretty much doing well where others were a bit weak. Again, MHO.


p.s. Just in case, I'm using Wharfedales 8.2A

Wow. Interesting. Xtatic's was actually one of the more processed-sounding ones of the bunch ... I think I just went treble-deaf listening to his vocal track, which was also too loud, btw. He had some interesting things going on with the kick and bass -- sounded very powerful, which probably fits this particular genre to a certain extent I suppose. Too much limiting on the master bus. Great concept, though; powerful drums and upfront vocal, etc.

Bear's was obviously fundamentally sound, professional, and very solid all around ... but also very conservative. This isn't a paying gig ... at least have fun with it. Take some chances.

DigitalNinja ... not bad. A little over compressed/limited, again on the master and particularly on the drum mix, which brought up an insane amount of cymbals (which pumped a lot from the comp). I like the idea, though. The huge drum sound kinda' works for this particular song in a way. I like the overall concept of where you were taking the mix.

Mike Runner ... your snare sounds like it has a Phil Collins-esque gated reverb, which is interesting, but unfortunately makes it sound a little mechanical -- like a drum machine. A little heavy on the comp there, too. A tad much reverb on the vox -- not unlike my mix . Not a bad balance, though, at all. It translates well on my monitors, and I love the way you mixed the backing vocal vocal. Good job.

Thajeremy ... interesting effect on the backing vocal. Weird, but interesting. Guitars are a little dark and muffled sounding, and your MP3 encoding leaves a little to be desired, but other than that it sounds pretty good.

Briefcaseman ... great job for a beginning mixer. I could stand just a little more vocal (needs to be up front a bit more), but overall I like the raw energy of it. You're not yet at the point where you're overthinking things, which is good. It's a very raw and stripped-down sounding mix. Sometimes less is more.

 

[caryindy]

Here is the tune the way it is on the CD.
If you're still working and dont want to spoil it, resist the urge to listen.

 

[BRIEFCASEMANX]

Here is the tune the way it is on the CD.
If you're still working and dont want to spoil it, resist the urge to listen.

The autotune on that sounds gross. I wouldn't put the settings nearly that high unless I had a REALLY in tune performance to start out with. It seems like he goes too far out of tune in a few spots and the autotune corrects it to the wrong note. But hey, I probably shouldn't be talking, my mix didn't sound that great.

 

[SpeedKing9]

Here's my attempt. This is my first ever attempt at a mix, so any criticism is welcome.

 

[Dr.Phil]

Hello, I made fun with the intro and the backin vocals, check it out

hereeee

And please give comments

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

This is my first "real" mix. I did it so I could test out mixing on my new monitors. It's horrible compared to a lot of the mixes already posted, but any and all constructive feedback would be VERY much appreciated. I want to get better at this stuff.....

I expected worse considering your own comments! It's not that bad... the drums are definitely a weak spot - very muddy and wooly-sounding. And the cymbals jump out far too much relative to the rest of the kit (and the song!)

The guitars are a bit mushy - can't distinguish their individual tones and the bass often is getting buried along with the kick.

Oh yeah, and vocals need to be stronger with more presence...

Good effort though!

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

Bear's was obviously fundamentally sound, professional, and very solid all around ... but also very conservative. This isn't a paying gig ... at least have fun with it. Take some chances.

"Chances" my arse!! Didn't you hear the flanger on the third rhy gtr during the solo???

Actually you're right - it is conservative from a creative mixing POV. Except for editing of some "issues" - particularly on the guitars - I didn't wear a producer's hat on this one, partially because of time but also because most of the track's arrangement I already liked!

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

Here is the tune the way it is on the CD.
If you're still working and dont want to spoil it, resist the urge to listen.

Interesting - I really miss not hearing the bass come in with the intro guitar -- without it there, the intro runs just a bit too long for my taste - it needs the additional musical element coming-in before the build-up. (maybe I get bored too quickly as far as arrangement interest - in any case, that's just a personal preference!)

The drums could have been punchier but overall it also had an "understated charm" about it.

I like the guitar tone too - but I think I preferred my approach to the vocals!

 

[LemonTree]

Interesting - I really miss not hearing the bass come in with the intro guitar -- without it there, the intro runs just a bit too long - it needs the additional musical element coming-in before the build-up.

It's all personal taste. I left the bass out of the intro too cause for me the acoustic and the vocal held their own. As soon as you throw a bass in there the listener knows everything is gonna pounce in at any time. Without it there's still a slight element of surprise when all hell eventualy does break loose.

Never did get around to doing that sober mix and I cringe listening to the rocket fuled version I did now, but hey...... this has been a hell of a lot of fun. I really enjoy these kinda things just for pulling all the mixes into a player at the end and hearing the different approaches people took.

The message on this board always seems to be the same....don't pin the needles in the red and watch out for the reverb police. It's good advice but you can't reason with a drunk man Here's mine again incase anyone missed it LIGHTER ......I know some had trouble streaming it but it seems to work now.

Chess n Bruce get my vote

 

[jensen]

Hi

Here in denmark we are working on the mix as well.

This is normaly not my type of music, but here we go:

 

[xstatic]

I agree with comments on the whole too much compression on the master buss for my mix. First off, I am no mastering engineer. Secondly, it was blindly thrown through an L2 just to bring the volume up to semi commercial CD levels. I did that because too many people listen to music and assume it doesn't have "power" because they have to turn their volume up a little. If for some reason I was going to have to master my own mix myself (which i prefer not to do), I would have mastered it much differently. I would have done overall mix EQ on my console ( I have a huge D&R console with absolutely stunning EQ on board ), I would have done some waveform edits to help tame those few momentary spikes, I would have used a really tight parametric to help smaller frequency issues, and I would also have spent more time mixing it and referenced it in at least one other system. I was in a hurry to get it posted really quick before I had to leave town to go do a Jim Messina show.

I do appreciate everyones comments for sure. I love these things because whether or not we are pro's or newbs we can learn from each other. Even if it is just one thing we like about a mix it could be a valuable lesson. I new before I posted my mix that the vocals may have been about 1.5 or 2 db up front. Putting them back a bit may even help the backings cut through my mix more. I had a feeling the bass guitar may have been a touch hot as well, but thats a close one in my opinion. I was never totally happy with my kick. The kick track if you cue it up has a lot of shell resonance down as low as 160 and I caould never fully get rid of enough of that to make me happy without creating another problem. i have a feeling that contributes to any boominess in my mix, as well as how much kick there was in the overheads. It's just not what I am used to. I didn't really like the snare sound when I first heard the track, but it started to grow on me and I was surprised at how well it shaped up with a little EQ and a touch of compression.

Last night I got bored and spent another half hour on this mix, but I started completely over. This mix is much more basic. This time I mixed it on the console with only two reverbs, one compressor, 3 gates and a slight vocal doubler on the lead vocal that is barely audible. This means the whole mix is very raw, but it really allows you to hear what a big console will do that plug ins won't. The only other processing I did was a little Waves L3 multimaximizer on the two track in Sound Forge and brought the RMS to like -14 so it still isn't at commercial volume. What I like better about the console is that I feel like I can get higher frequencies into the mix without getting as harsh, and the lows are a little tighter. Also, I feel the analog console by nature offers a wider deeper and more realistic sound stage. I will try and get that posted soon and post links to both my old mix and the new one done on a console so you guys can listen to the both

 

[xstatic]

Ok, here is the new link. Both files will turn up with this link and are clearly labeled as to which is which. I recommend playing back in hifi instead of lofi of course (the larger play button).

http://www.nowhereradio.com/xstatic/singles?aid=4450&alid=-1&1111256804

This is what I did

Drums.... Waves Audiotrack as gates only on kick and toms. Waves audiotrack as compressor on snare. All EQ'ing was done straight from the D&R console.

Bass and guitars..... Just EQ from console. No comps at all.

Backing vox eq'ed a little with stock Cubase SX channel EQ.

Lead Vocals..... A hint of the waves Doubler on an insert, EQ from the console as well as outboard compression from an EL Distressor.

All in all thats only 2 channels of compression (I only spent a half hour on it) and all reverbs were done from inside Cubase SX but passed thorough the D&R during mixdown. I used Waves IR for both reverbs. I used 960L presets with a large wooden room on the drums and a warm vocal plate for vocals and the acoustic guitar. All conversion was done through either a Mackie SDR or a Lucid D/A. For the 2 track I added a little 12k boost from the UAD Pultec and tried out the new Precision Limiter from the UAD as well. I added 5 db on the Precision Limiter with whatever else the stock settings were. The only edits in the song were removing wav form parts where there was no signal, and some fades at the end of tracks and on the guitar solo, and of course removed the clicks before the drums came in as well. I also volume edited a few parts of the backing vocals. When I ran the mix (realtime through the console) I left all faders at a static position so all the tracks do not change in volume at all throughout the entire song, with exception of the few waveform volume changes I made on the backing vocals.

My personal goal on this was to use console EQ, minimal processing, and minimal labor (automation, fader rides etc...) to try and make a good full mix that was very heavily based on how it was tracked and not a whole lot of engineering prowess. To me it really shows how much some nice console EQ can really affect a mix and how the analog summing really serves to widen an image and just sort of add a degree of clarity without adding any harsh artifacts. Hope you guys enjoy the contrast between the two mixes. It's been really nice to do some work without a client hanging over my shoulders

 

[gusfmm]

I'm getting some kind of issue with your new version from Windows Media Player. Can't play it.