Limiters

  • Thread starter Thread starter p_bruno87
  • Start date Start date
P

p_bruno87

New member
At which ratio does a compressor commonly begin to become a limiter?
 
I think 20:1 is the usual definition. But I have no idea what difference it would make wether it's called a limiter or compressor.
 
Yeah about half of the meaning is in how its used- aimed at peaks vs deeper into the boddy of the signal and its speed.
Take a high threshold zero attack 2:1 and drop it on to your raw kit tracks. A little will do quite a lot to the sound, and mess with the meaning 'limit.
 
The "textbook" answer is 10:1.

The "people who don't like to smash everything" answer is probably closer to 3 or 4:1 (but is subjective).

When you think about it, 2:1 is cutting the dynamic range in half above your threshold. In half. That sounds pretty "limiting" to a lot of people also...
 
Massive Master said:
The "textbook" answer is 10:1.

The "people who don't like to smash everything" answer is probably closer to 3 or 4:1 (but is subjective).

When you think about it, 2:1 is cutting the dynamic range in half above your threshold. In half. That sounds pretty "limiting" to a lot of people also...
Click to expand...
Little thumby up' thingy here...
 
Wouldn't a lot of "limiting" have to do with the threshold?
 
aaronmcoleman said:
Wouldn't a lot of "limiting" have to do with the threshold?
Click to expand...

I guess you could visually look at it as Threshold setting the depth of the limiting...but I think you could also have a lot of limiting that only touches the very top of the signal range.
So a lot of limiting with a high threshold can still be a lot of limiting...though I know what you are saying, the lower the threshold the more of the signal is limited....
...and then you can also have a low Threshold but with only a little limiting. :)
 
aaronmcoleman said:
Wouldn't a lot of "limiting" have to do with the threshold?
Click to expand...

Again that is sort of half of the equation/meaning isn't it?
Then, being fast enough for the peaks in question -A limiter' fast enough to control a vocal is not limiter to a snare smack'. ...(may not.. More shades of grey :D
 
aaronmcoleman said:
Wouldn't a lot of "limiting" have to do with the threshold?
Click to expand...

Yes and no. You can lower your threshold to get more reduction, but if your ratio is 1.1:1 you're not going to limit much. I guess it's safe to say they go hand in hand to a certain extent.
 
I guess the point is (and everyone has pretty much said it), limiting or compressing...whatever you want to call it...depends on all of the big four: ratio, threshold, attack, and release.

A huge ratio with a high threshold won't do much to the signal compared to a normal ratio at a super low threshold. and if the attack is too long it won't catch the peaks, and if the release is too long it won't let go and will smash everything.

I understand compression/limiting pretty well, I just don't use it super well sometimes.
 
aaronmcoleman said:
I understand compression/limiting pretty well, I just don't use it super well sometimes.
Click to expand...

Yeah...been there.

When in doubt....cut back. :D

I've used a 4:1 ratio on a lot of stuff with a moderate treshold just for compressing individual tracks....but lately I'm going more toward 2:1 with higher threshold.
 
Limiting (IMO) is typically not for tracking, you compress as needed, shape transients as needed, on the tracks and compress on the buses and limit on the mains... But this probably depends on the style of music as well? And (IMO) limitting is over used much of the time, people smash their mixes up in to condom shaped .wavs... I think music needs to breath more and therefore, limitting should be "limitted..." Clint Eastwood said "a man's got to know his limitations." (Magnum Force)
 
Last edited:
My understanding of limiting is that when the signal hits the limiter threshold that's it. The signal does not get any louder once the limiter is acting. Therefore a true limiter is a (Infinite ratio) ∞:1. With an extremely fast attack.

Alan.
 

Attachments

  • limiter-graph.webp
    limiter-graph.webp
    2.4 KB · Views: 29
witzendoz said:
My understanding of limiting is that when the signal hits the limiter threshold that's it. The signal does not get any louder once the limiter is acting. Therefore a true limiter is a (Infinite ratio) ∞:1. With an extremely fast attack.

Alan.
Click to expand...

Technically, the limit would be 1db over the threshold though, wouldn't it?

I'm not saying that to be picky. I'm saying it because I never actually processed that before.
Is it right?

I mean, you'd never do it I guess, but If you wanted to set a limiter for 0db, you'd actually set the threshold at -1 then, yeah?
 
Steenamaroo said:
Technically, the limit would be 1db over the threshold though, wouldn't it?

I'm not saying that to be picky. I'm saying it because I never actually processed that before.
Is it right?

I mean, you'd never do it I guess, but If you wanted to set a limiter for 0db, you'd actually set the threshold at -1 then, yeah?
Click to expand...
I don't see that. If 20:1 means that you need to go 20db over the threshold to get 1db over. So, if we assume that (infinity):1 is the same as 100:1, then you'd need to go 100db over the threshold to get 1db over. So, I'm pretty sure that infinity (i don't know how to make the "infinity" symbol) to 1 ratio, or even 50:1 ration is a pretty hard ceiling. I can't see anything going over the threshold with those ratios.
 
Steenamaroo said:
Technically, the limit would be 1db over the threshold though, wouldn't it?

I'm not saying that to be picky. I'm saying it because I never actually processed that before.
Is it right?

I mean, you'd never do it I guess, but If you wanted to set a limiter for 0db, you'd actually set the threshold at -1 then, yeah?
Click to expand...

I am now processing this .....:rolleyes: :confused: :eatpopcorn: :drunk: :facepalm: :cool:.... I feel like the computer on "Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" (answer 42!).

If the ratio is infinite is the actual setting then the actual point where the limiting occurs? Also audio does not actual increase in steps of 1 dB, it could be 0.000001dB above threshold, or in the case if infinite 0.1(-1000000000000∞) above threshold.

Answer? I don't know the science, only that a true limiter will not let the audio level go above the threshold, where by a compressor will reduce the audio level above the threshold by the amount set by the ratio.

Cheers
Alan.
 
Oh, right enough RAMI.

If I have an 8:1 ratio and go 4db over, I'll see a 1/2 db over the threshold, I guess.
So with inifity :1 (don't know the symbol either), the compressed level will technically pass the threshold, but not by a significant amount.

For some reason I pictured that any level in excess of the threshold would be reduced to 1db over. :facepalm:
 
Steenamaroo said:
So with inifity :1 (don't know the symbol either), the compressed level will technically pass the threshold, but not by a significant amount.
Click to expand...

Right. I guess, mathematically, a signal will always pass the threshold by some fraction of a db, no matter high high the ratio. But at some point, it must stop being significant enough even call it passing the threshold.

Keep in mind, none of my shit is researched. :eek:
 
That's cool. You've answered my question man. Cheers :)

Of course, I was just testing you guys. :p
 
This thread has not reached its 'limit'
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top