Lets talk custom computers!?

[wheelema]

Yeah, I actually screwed up pretty bad when I built my first PC. It was a horrible, horrible experiment. Remember in Alien Resurrection when they find that lab with all the failed Ripley experiments? That.

Basically, long story short, it came out as a Mac so I took it out behind the shed and shot it. It was a mercy killing.

I'm probably the only pro system builder (former) to respond in this thread.

Buying from a system builder... or a faux system builder like Sweetwater... is a fast path to expensive overkill. A digital audio workstation (DAW) is not a power hungry application; you don't need kick-ass video, a massive CPU, and tons of memory. You are far far far better off purchasing... or assembling... only what you need and spending the savings on things that actually make music. To that end...

• Splurge on the case, but focus on cooling, not size. Throwing a huge case around gets really old, really fast. Leave the ATX motherboards to the gamers, Micro-ATX motherboards invariably come with integrated video that gives you all the video power you will ever need. You need to keep the CPU cool and you REALLY need to keep the hard drives cool so cases that mount fans in front of the HDD cage are great. Make sure your CPU cooler will fit inside your case. Look at cases that provide for large fans (that turn slowly and quietly), and move as much air as small fans that have to turn fast. Personally I love Lian-Li but they're hardly the only game in town.
• It's almost impossible to purchase single core CPUs. The Intel dual-core Celeron is an inexpensive kick-ass CPU that'll provide all the processing power you'll need.
• As noted prior Micro-ATX mobos come with integrated video. Make sure the mobo has the functionality you need, but don't splurge. Buying a pricey mobo make sense for a gamer, not for you. On-board Firewire (1394) is more reliable then using an after-market adapter though some interfaces are picky about what Firewire chipset they like. If you need Firewire make sure your components will play nice with each other.
• Personally I wouldn't go over 4GB of RAM but get the fastest RAM your motherboard supports. This allows you to pop in a faster processor after a year when prices drop if you really feel strongly about it.
• Stay away from Glyph and similar HDD... the name buys you little you can't find elsewhere for much less. SSD HDD are great, but the tech is still evolving whereas conventional SATA HDD are proven, huge, and cheap. I'd use a SSD for your boot drive if you're impatient but elsewhere it's an expensive waste. 7,200RPM is fine, 10,000RPM is nice but hardly critical. I prefer multiple 'small' drives in a RAID array to individual 1TB or 2TB drives. When I got into this game the Seagate ST225 was considered large at 20MB... MB, not GB. eSATA allows you to move huge amount of data around for corroboration or backup.
• If your mobo does not include video get the cheapest video adapter that you can. The only caveat here is to make sure that the card you buy will plug into your mobo.
• Splurge on your keyboard and mouse. These are components that you'll use day in and day out.
• Buy whatever display you want but keep in mind that money saved on a modest display can be used towards that ribbon mic you've had your eye on.
• If you want the most bulletproof Windows OS extant purchase Windows Server 2008 and gut out the server functionality. There's a web site out there that explains how but I don't have the link.

I'd worry quite a bit more about keeping the computer cool then I would about noise. There are ways of isolating the DAW if you are worried about keeping it quiet that don't involve trying to plaster 'sound damping foam' into the case.

Multiwave (www.mwave.com) will build your custom computer for $80. Just choose the components. They're prices are competitive and if you've bundled incompatible components they'll let you know.

Luck.


I'm probably forgetting something.

 

[wheelema]

...can someone give me a really rough estimate of how much this would cost?

$1,000 before tax and shipping, assembled. All components www.mwave.com

• ASUS P5QL-EM intel g43 chipset micro ATX form factor 1xPCI-E(x16)/2xPCI-E(x1)/1xpci/4xddr2 w/integrated vga,sata2,lan(gb)
• PENTIUM DUAL-CORE E5300 2.6G (800MHz)
• KINGSTON 4GB DDR2 800-(2GB x 2)
• LIAN LI PC-V351B (black) mini tower no power supply 2x5.25" 1x3.5" 2x3.5"(hidden) w/ front i/o connector & 120mm fan x 3
• Thermaltake W0379RU TR2 500W ATX12V V2.2 24PIN Power Supply with 120MM Fan
• Intel SSDSA2MJ080G2C1 X25-M 2.5" 80GB MLC Gen 2 Solid State Drive - 80GB - Serial ATA/300 - Internal
• WESTERN DIGITAL WD5000AAKS Caviar Blue 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" internal hard drive (Bare Drive)
• LITE ON IHAP222-06 Black IDE LightScribe 22x dvd+/-rw dual layer drive 9/30/2010
• I-ROCKS KR-6820E-BK 104 Key USB/PS2 Wired Back-lit Gaming Keyboard (Orange LED) - Black
• Logitech 910-001326 Wireless Mouse M505 Laser - Scroll Wheel - Ergonomic - USB - Red
• VIEWSONIC LCD VA2232WM 22" Widescreen DVI VGA 100000:1 1680X1050 5MS
• Microsoft Windows 7

This is a assembled E5300 2.6G dual-core Intel box w/4GB RAM in a Lian Li case w/500W power supply. Drive C is a 80GB SSD, drive D is a 500GB 7,200RPM SATA, drive E is DVD/RW. Backlit keyboard, wireless mouse, 22" display.

A comporable Sweetwater box would be the Creation Station TowerLE for $1,000. It has more processor, half the memory, no SSD boot, smaller power supply, and no monitor. I could build their box for $500, and that's without their bulk purchasing power.

 

[guitaristic]

I want to have a computer made from scratch, with dual processing and just jampacked with memory. aside from that i want to run windows xp. thats it. Whats a great store/website to have this done? I know this isnt very specific at all but can someone give me a really rough estimate of how much this would cost?

Yeah, I'd just put it together yourself....you'd get better bang for the buck anyways if you did that. And to all the posters who say it's too hard, I don't really understand where you're coming from! It's not actually that much stuff and can be done in a few hours.

 

[moresound]

Yeah, I'd just put it together yourself....you'd get better bang for the buck anyways if you did that. And to all the posters who say it's too hard, I don't really understand where you're coming from! It's not actually that much stuff and can be done in a few hours.

Just don't build a HAL 9000 or the damn thing wont let you back in the damn spaceship!

 

[ASG]

thanks for all the input you guys for real. 1 grand is about all im looking at spending before i get uncomfortable. Can someone give me a comparison in price between buying a computer and putting an identical one together myself?

 

[grimtraveller]

Yeah, I'd just put it together yourself....you'd get better bang for the buck anyways if you did that. And to all the posters who say it's too hard, I don't really understand where you're coming from! It's not actually that much stuff and can be done in a few hours.

The issue was never about it 'being too hard', but that of 'desiring to do it'. If someone wants a computer built and doesn't want to do it themselves, especially because they've never done it, saying "it's easy" is a fairly pointless statement. If they want to do it or are in two minds about it, then that's a different story.
Legion says he screwed up pretty bad the first time he did it so obviously, it ain't that easy. Things tend to become moreso with a little experience and the precious commodity of hindsight.

 

[bdenton]

A Few Responses, If I May...

Some reasonable cases have been made for do it yourself vs storebought, but...

Speaking of cases, I didn't see any use of sound absorbent materials in any of the DIY options mentioned; all of the music computer builders I mentioned use acoustic materials to provide an almost-to-true ability to use the computer near an open mic.

Warranties...assume a parts-count of 10. DIY and you've got to chase down possibly 10 different manufacturers; buy from a builder, and most of them offer their own warranty on the compter.

Are the folks at newegg going to know that with most DAWs you're going to need both a system and an audio drive, and a third drive if you use a lot of sample based VIs?

And to the gentleman who suggested using Windows Server 2008...with all due respect, you were kidding, right? It costs about three times as much as Win 7, I've seen some pretty sharp guys have a hell of a time setting it up, and do you really think your average noob would be able to "gut out the server functionality" even with instructions? Then, how many DAWs support it, and how many devices offer drivers for it?

Look...we're talking about a whole bunch of different market segments here. About 15 years ago a survey found that most really talented computer programmers had an arts background, with the predominate art being music. So there are a lot of music guys who are perfectly capable of building damn good music computers.

But by the same token, there are a lot of great musicians who can't even do an oil change on their car...at SuperLube. No joke...I was in GC in Chicago a few years ago listening to a dude totally tear up a guitar. Then he got up and walked up to the counter and said (paraphrasing), "Dude, I need a new one of those wires that connects my guitar to my amp." Somehow, I don't think he's going to be assembling computers anytime soon.

Kids today are surrounded by technology and gadgets, and I imagine a lot of them get just as much of a hard-on from hot-rodding their iPods as I did from hot-rodding my '55 Chevy. And thank God for that.

But I've also been a salesman, and one of the first things you learn in sales is how to "read" a potential customer.

Lets go back to the original post...

I want to have a computer made from scratch, with dual processing and just jampacked with memory. aside from that i want to run windows xp.

From this, I did not "read" a guy who would, at this point in time, be interested in or able to build his own computer. If I'm wrong, my apologies to all concerned.

But look around on this board...if you cut out all of the posts that say "build your own computer" or "switch to Reaper" you'd be cutting out about half of them, along with the half-dozen guys who constantly offer these "one size fits all" solutions. There are a lot of great solutions and products out there, and DIY and Reaper are often the right one, but not always. Just like Pro Tools and Sweetwater's computers are not always knee-jerk bad ideas...

 

[mattr]

Speaking of cases, I didn't see any use of sound absorbent materials in any of the DIY options mentioned; all of the music computer builders I mentioned use acoustic materials to provide an almost-to-true ability to use the computer near an open mic.

I've happily used my last two computers near open mics - they've been more-or-less silent. If you put some thought into it and buy decent fans, a very quiet yet powerful computer is easily possible. There probably are some more expensive solutions that work, but the thin foam "acoustic panels" I've seen installed in cases most often don't appear to do much anyway. The amount of mass there can't do much at all in terms of absorption, so if anything it probably just thermally insulates your case (resulting in higher temps ∴ raised fan speeds & more noise ). I had a case come with some preinstalled and would happily have peeled it out if I didn't think it would make a sticky mess on the panel.