Ribbon Mics and Pres

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nate_dennis

nate_dennis

Well-known member
With many of us working on a budget, we have many discussions on low cost pres. The names that get brought up a lot (that I have seen) are: M-Audio DMP3, FMR RNP, Rane, I've heard some votes for the Studio Projects VTP-1, some times ART comes up. Anyway, my question relates to these (and other pres like them) and ribbon mics. As I understand them, ribbon mics take more gain and lower (??) impedance. Would any of these pres work effectively with a ribbon mic? If not, what pres should one look at for use with a ribbon? Thanks so much for all the info.
 
nate_dennis said:
With many of us working on a budget, we have many discussions on low cost pres. The names that get brought up a lot (that I have seen) are: M-Audio DMP3, FMR RNP, Rane, I've heard some votes for the Studio Projects VTP-1, some times ART comes up. Anyway, my question relates to these (and other pres like them) and ribbon mics. As I understand them, ribbon mics take more gain and lower (??) impedance. Would any of these pres work effectively with a ribbon mic? If not, what pres should one look at for use with a ribbon? Thanks so much for all the info.
Click to expand...

I have a client that uses the RNP with his old ribbon mic collection on remote recordings of acoustic music exclusively. The results are excellent.
 
Very cool! Is there any reason the DMP3 wouldn't work with a ribbon mic?
 
The Art Pro MPA-II has variable input impedance, not sure if any of the others on that list do. That could be useful in using a ribbon (or dynamic) that wants a lower impedance. Not basing this on experience, just pointing out the feature.
 
The Cancers said:
The Art Pro MPA-II has variable input impedance, not sure if any of the others on that list do. That could be useful in using a ribbon (or dynamic) that wants a lower impedance. Not basing this on experience, just pointing out the feature.
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I owned an ART MPA Gold and upgraded the tubes to NOS Telefunken and GE 5 star.

I wouldn't recommend the ART pres for ribbons or dynamic mics as they are the noisiest I've tried.

The DMP3 has much less noise.
 
Ultimately what your looking for is a preamp that is capable of gain as high as 80db. With a very, very low noise floor. PLUS NO PHANTOM POWER!





:cool:
 
I don't agree about the 80dB gain requirement, the only requirement is low noise. The maximum amount of required gain is that which is sufficient to make the amp's output noise exceed the following stage's input noise by 10dB--that is a rule of thumb, such that summing a noise signal with another noise signal that is 10dB weaker only increases total noise by 0.4dB.

The quietest possible preamp is equal to the thermal noise of a 150 ohm resistor, which is -133dBV (that's unweighted; don't confuse by comparing to an A-weighted spec). There are a few that come within a few dB of that spec.

So the next question is what is the typical noise floor of a line level input? That varies, but I hope none are worse than -100dBV, because at that point they would have to be actively trying to be noisy--although 16-bit converters can be forced into a de facto higher noise floor, as they must dither their inputs to limit dynamic range within their resolution. But in the era of 24 bit converters -100dBV should be about right.

So the maximum required amount of first-stage gain should really never be more than 43dB or so, maybe 50dB, but certainly not more than 60dB.

Now we might want more gain for convenience, but there is no reason why additional gain can't come from subsequent stages (or by cascading preamps) rather than shelling out for a relatively exotic preamp that can generate 80dB of gain. Such preamps will have more than one internal gain stage anyway . . .
 
Yup. 80db was just as a fail safe and preamps do cost a pretty penny that have gain staging that high. So as MSH (who still hasn't got a cool avatar up as yet) pointed out 60db will be fine for a ribbon microphone.

NO! Damn it! NO! that's wrong ..... it has to be 61db and not a db less! :D






:cool:
 
Great avatar MSH, Is that suppose to be you riding on the Narwhal?






:cool:
 
moresound said:
Great avatar MSH, Is that suppose to be you riding on the Narwhal?
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No, it's President Obama. I'm the narwhal. Here's the original:

obama-narwhal-550x409.jpg
 
Ha I missed that with the avatar being so small up there in the corner.

Now tell me ..... doesn't that look just like Slim Pickens riding the bomb out of the B-52 in the movie "Dr. Strange love".






:cool:
 
moresound said:
Ha I missed that with the avatar being so small up there in the corner.

Now tell me ..... doesn't that look just like Slim Pickens riding the bomb out of the B-52 in the movie "Dr. Strange love".
Click to expand...

We all love the bomb, don't we :)
 
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