voice not powerful enough.....

[v01d]

you need to amplify your voice. check under the effect panel in audition.

 

[skunktree]

The real problem is that it's a vocal with a high peak-to-average ratio that he's trying to balance with an instrumental track with a low peak-to-average ratio. The instrumental track is probably compressed/limited and mastered to be just short of 0dBFS, so it's average is higher than the vocal's even if the vocal peaks are also just short of 0dBFS. The options are to lower the instrumental so its average level is more like the vocal's, or compress/limit the vocal so its average level can be raised to balance with the instrumental.



He already tried more gain and got distortion (by exceeding 0dBFS). There is no headroom left for more vocal without lowering its peaks.



There is no difference between this and simply moving the fader up except that moving the fader is convenient and rational whereas having two or three or four copies of a track just for the gain is not.



This will not be much different from simply lowering the instrumental until it no longer overwhelms the vocals. The channel faders aren't really a great place to try to get a "hot mix", they are better used to get a good mix.

maybe you should re-read what the newbe asked...

"I'm just a beginner at recording, I have audacity, and Adobe Audition 9 but it has a glitch. I'm using singstar microphone, from the video game. I don't have money for a professonal microphone, the singstar mic is a good one I think considering it's from a PS2 video game. But the problem I'm having, it when I'm recording my singing the instrumental song overpowers my voice when I play it back. and when I try to increase the volume on the mic, well....I get distorted. what can I do to have a good balance of the instrumental track and then my voice?"


he is trying to turn up the volume of the mic...said nothing bought track,fader,.....yes he's clipping....he makes no mention if the distortion is at track lvl after recording ...we all assume...
.....and......
there is nothing wrong with the advice i gave to a new comer to recording...my advice has almost no learning curve...if he is infact running out of fader this will give him a solution fast so he can move on to more fun recording...your advice assumes he knows how to implement your suggestion...since you offer no explanation on how to limit and/or boost...( attack,release,ratio,hard/soft knee,gain,ext)...your suggestion is irrelevant....he owns a poor mic...i dont know bought you but i wasn't born with all the best equipment...i gave him something he can work with rite now at this moment...you...did not..

i see your suggestion as ..."dady what is 1+1....?" you hand the boy a text book on calculus and expect him to understand...

oh and...by the sound of it i dont think he is mixing the next #1 album...or are you going to suggest he get this track professionally mastered...

 

[mattr]

You make me "lol".

bouldersoundguy had already pointed out his errors, which he disagreed with.

bouldersoundguy then explained very well in more detail.

No point me parrotting what he had already said, so I chimed in with a meaningless and derogatory dig

Its the self-moderating nature of forums - yes there are moderators to protect us from spam, offensive stuff, illegal stuff, etc, but it usually ends up being the users who decide what is good or bad content and, if someone is giving bad advice, its better that its pointed out by several people than left uncommented to mislead others later on. You rarely see a thread on a forum being deleted for having loads of misinformation in it, but you'll find loads of posts criticising that misinformation which shows it is such.


And as it turns out, skunktree is still barking up the same tree despite bouldersoundguy's post, so he can probably expect more jabs at him from various people sooner or later.

 

[skunktree]

You make me "lol".

It's really awesome that you understand the concepts behind why his statment is wrong. Truly it is. It says a lot about you that you feel the need to post this as a response though.

A better approach would be to explain why he's wrong, thus correcting his error and clearing up the confusion. Instead of laughing at him...

***

Skunktree,

Thanks for the input, but that's not really what happens when you copy and paste a track. Duplicating the same track will merely raise the overall volume, exactly the same as sliding a fader up, or using a gain plugin.

the way im interpreting his post is...the mic is recording at a low lvl...he is not sure of what to do with the loud instrumental track so he leaves it up at 0 and is trying to get the vocal up louder by maxing out the fader on its track...by the sound of it to me i dont think he knows how to use a compressor to fix this...so...i suggest another way...i really dont see the harm...if some one else is suggesting he use a plugin tell him how to use it...teach to an end...dont leave him hangin...

 

[mattr]

the way im interpreting his post is...the mic is recording at a low lvl...he is not sure of what to do with the loud instrumental track so he leaves it up at 0 and is trying to get the vocal up louder by maxing out the fader on its track...by the sound of it to me i dont think he knows how to use a compressor to fix this...so...i suggest another way...i really dont see the harm...if some one else is suggesting he use a plugin tell him how to use it...teach to an end...dont leave him hangin...

Look, this is how it is...

(Using "you" in the generic sense of "one", not you personally)


If the mic signal is clipping on the way in, its either that the max SPL of the mic has been significantly exceeded (the max SPL figure is normally referenced in terms of a certain THD at 1khz, though I can't remember if its 0.5% or 1%, and not outright clipping resulting from the diaphragm reaching is maximum excursion) or - as is far more likely - too much gain from the preamp / any other gain staging issue in the input signal chain.

If this is the case, reduce the signal level on the way in. Next you have to address; why are you trying to record really hot in the first place?

If its because, as you suggest he might be having problems with, you are trying to match the level of the backing instrumentals, bring the levels of those down to the level of the vocals, not the other way around. If you are trying to push the level of the vocal much higher during mixing and clipping the master bus, again pull all the levels down and mix with more headroom.

Duplicating the track is just a stupid roundabout method of applying gain, which can be done just by putting the track level up a bit more. Again, if you're pushing your track faders over unity (or even approaching running out of virtual-fader-travel) then you're mixing way too hot and, once again, need to pull all your levels down. You should never ever ever need to 'max out' your track faders... there is no reason to!

If the recorded signal level is so low (even with lots of preamp gain) that reasonable gain structure has to go out of the window, he's probably going to have more problems than making large gain changes to match up the levels, ie. noise. This is when you need to start looking into better gear.


This is basic, basic, basic stuff and not overcomplicating anything as you claim bouldersoundguy was doing. I've mentioned nothing of compression or any other type of signal processing yet - just basic gain staging.

 

[moresound]

And as it turns out, skunktree is still barking up the same tree despite bouldersoundguy's post, so he can probably expect more jabs at him from various people sooner or later.

jab.....jab.....jab.....jab.....jab.....jab.....jab.....jab.....jab......jab......jab.....jab

 

[bouldersoundguy]

he is trying to turn up the volume of the mic...said nothing bought track,fader,.....yes he's clipping....he makes no mention if the distortion is at track lvl after recording ...we all assume...

It doesn't matter that much whether he ran out of headroom on the input or in the DAW. The vocal was evidently clipping even when it sounded too low, and it's unlikely that it would be at or near clipping at the preamp and not record at a usable level. The options are the same: lower the peaks of the vocal so it can be raised overall, or lower the other track. Learning about gain structure would also be good.

there is nothing wrong with the advice i gave to a new comer to recording...my advice has almost no learning curve...if he is infact running out of fader this will give him a solution fast so he can move on to more fun recording...your advice assumes he knows how to implement your suggestion...since you offer no explanation on how to limit and/or boost...( attack,release,ratio,hard/soft knee,gain,ext)...your suggestion is irrelevant....he owns a poor mic...i dont know bought you but i wasn't born with all the best equipment...i gave him something he can work with rite now at this moment...you...did not..

i see your suggestion as ..."dady what is 1+1....?" you hand the boy a text book on calculus and expect him to understand...

oh and...by the sound of it i dont think he is mixing the next #1 album...or are you going to suggest he get this track professionally mastered...

My suggestion assumes he is smart enough to figure it out. I gave him ample clues that he can use to do a search or post another more specific question, thereby building his knowledge and skills on a strong foundation. Your shortcut to a solution is a detour in disguise.

I started recording with a tabletop cassette recorder and the mic it came with. Getting the most out of the least is exactly what I am good at. I'm no gear snob, but I also understand when a link is too weak to hold the chain together. What the OP has is perfectly fine for learning the basics, and later he'll appreciate better gear when he gets it.

 

[Gizzmo0815]

Look, this is how it is...

(Using "you" in the generic sense of "one", not you personally)


If the mic signal is clipping on the way in, its either that the max SPL of the mic has been significantly exceeded (the max SPL figure is normally referenced in terms of a certain THD at 1khz, though I can't remember if its 0.5% or 1%, and not outright clipping resulting from the diaphragm reaching is maximum excursion) or - as is far more likely - too much gain from the preamp / any other gain staging issue in the input signal chain.

If this is the case, reduce the signal level on the way in. Next you have to address; why are you trying to record really hot in the first place?

If its because, as you suggest he might be having problems with, you are trying to match the level of the backing instrumentals, bring the levels of those down to the level of the vocals, not the other way around. If you are trying to push the level of the vocal much higher during mixing and clipping the master bus, again pull all the levels down and mix with more headroom.

Duplicating the track is just a stupid roundabout method of applying gain, which can be done just by putting the track level up a bit more. Again, if you're pushing your track faders over unity (or even approaching running out of virtual-fader-travel) then you're mixing way too hot and, once again, need to pull all your levels down. You should never ever ever need to 'max out' your track faders... there is no reason to!

If the recorded signal level is so low (even with lots of preamp gain) that reasonable gain structure has to go out of the window, he's probably going to have more problems than making large gain changes to match up the levels, ie. noise. This is when you need to start looking into better gear.


This is basic, basic, basic stuff and not overcomplicating anything as you claim bouldersoundguy was doing. I've mentioned nothing of compression or any other type of signal processing yet - just basic gain staging.

It doesn't matter that much whether he ran out of headroom on the input or in the DAW. The vocal was evidently clipping even when it sounded too low, and it's unlikely that it would be at or near clipping at the preamp and not record at a usable level. The options are the same: lower the peaks of the vocal so it can be raised overall, or lower the other track. Learning about gain structure would also be good.

My suggestion assumes he is smart enough to figure it out. I gave him ample clues that he can use to do a search or post another more specific question, thereby building his knowledge and skills on a strong foundation. Your shortcut to a solution is a detour in disguise.

I started recording with a tabletop cassette recorder and the mic it came with. Getting the most out of the least is exactly what I am good at. I'm no gear snob, but I also understand when a link is too weak to hold the chain together. What the OP has is perfectly fine for learning the basics, and later he'll appreciate better gear when he gets it.

Man you guys are helpful!!

The Singstar microphone is obviously the weak link here if it's distorting at a low level. It really is just a toy, but there are several really inexpensive options for microphones that you can pick up that will let you record at a more usable volume level.

The input you'll get here will range from the expert to the amature, but there's a lot of good advice in this thread already. Keep at it man!

Post some of your stuff here (in the mp3 clinic too) and you'll get tons of feedback that way also.

 

[XLR]

...the instrumental song overpowers my voice when I play it back...

You have to bring down the level of the instrumental track.

This thread should have been just two posts long.

 

[moresound]

This thread should have been just two posts long.

It is now XLR