Better means of isolating the kick drum from the Overhead mics?

[Nick The Man]

My kick drum sounds like SHIT on my overhead mics, I really like the sound I'm getting from the direct mic, however when I mix the whole kit, I need to bring the level of the overheads up to get more cymbals but at the same time it brings this horrid kick drum sound. Maybe tuning the kick for a better overhead sound would be a better solution at this point, but is there a way to isolate the kick drum from the overheads. I have heard of studios using a blanket over the end of the kick drum, but when I tried this it didn't help much.

Any tips or tricks?

 

[maskedman72]

My kick drum sounds like SHIT on my overhead mics, I really like the sound I'm getting from the direct mic, however when I mix the whole kit, I need to bring the level of the overheads up to get more cymbals but at the same time it brings this horrid kick drum sound. Maybe tuning the kick for a better overhead sound would be a better solution at this point, but is there a way to isolate the kick drum from the overheads. I have heard of studios using a blanket over the end of the kick drum, but when I tried this it didn't help much.

Any tips or tricks?

i use the blanket to keep things from getting into the kick mic so it will trigger well in the mix. i doubt it will keep the kick out of oh mics.

as far as your issue, try to eq the freq of the kick out of the oh tracks.

 

[Farview]

Try a low shelf at 300 hz. Or even a low cut around the same place.

This only works if you have all the toms and snare close mic'd and you are just using the overheads to get the cymbals and a little ambience.

There are other suggestions, but it will depend on how the kit is mic'd up.

 

[Vagodeoz]

If you indeed have individual mikes for snare and toms, move the mikes closer to the cymbals.
You could also compress the overheads using the kick mick as a sidechain.
It compresses the signal according to the sidechain signal, so when there is a kick played, the OHs will be compressed a lot for a tiny little moment.

 

[NYMorningstar]

Take a look at why it sounds like crap in the overheads. Is it boomy? Do you use a pillow in it?
Have you tried to reverse the phase? Do you have any sound treatment in the room?

 

[NL5]

How are you micing your kit? What kind of room? Where is the kit located in that room? Where are you OH's placed? Got some pics of the kit mic'd up?

 

[Ironklad Audio]

not that it'll help the tracks you already have, BUT...using a spaced pair in place of x/y will help get the kick out of the OH's

and, like farview said, rolling off the lows will help out a lot as well

 

[Nick The Man]

Thanks guys for all the good ideas, I'll post a picture of the kit soon. As for the tracks I already have... I'll have to do the 300Hz shelf.

 

[Chris Shaeffer]

The kick should sound good in the overheads. In theory (and much of the time in practice) the overheads should be the bulk of the sound of the kit. Depending on how it is miced, of course.

Because the OH mics are some distance from the drums they are able to pick up more low end than the close mics.

If the kick doesn't sound the way you want it in the room (i.e. the drum itself isn't the right sound) and the close mic is catching the right sound from it- cool. If the drum sounds good then it should sound good in the OH.

I wonder if there are phase issues? Try flipping the phase of the close mic on the kick. If the kick mic is out of phase with the OH then the kick will sound like doo doo when both the direct on OH tracks are played together.

Could also be the room you're recording in.

 

[amra]

If you are using cardioids for overheads, keep them parallel to the ground, not pointing down at all. Spend some time positioning them. You'd be suprised how much that cuts bleed, that and a low cut like farview mentioned would probably do it.

 

[Nick The Man]

Again, more great ideas. I have a bad habit of just placing the overheads and being done with it... maybe they deserve some more attention. I do think my room has a big thing to do with it as well, it is just a typical family room setting pretty much. Maybe 9 foot ceilings and so on, I'll try to post a pic soon. thanks again for all the good ideas! I just took down my XY set-up and changed to a spaced pair, haven't tried it out yet though.

For some sepcs here:

pdp FS birch kit
WAS using oktava MK-012s NOW RODE Nt5s (which shall i use?)
All mics run to a Octane then through the digital out to my tascam FW1804
recorded in SONAR 6

am i forgetting something?

 

[Daisy]

Maybe tuning the kick for a better overhead sound would be a better solution at this point ...

Yes.

It would.

... is there a way to isolate the kick drum from the overheads.

No.

In case you haven't noticed yet ... a kick drum is really loud.

The typical SPL generated by a kick drum will be no match for a little blankie. Have you ever heard of neighbors complaining when loud drummers rehearse? That's because, in most cases, not even solid walls of concrete can effectively dampen the sound of a typical kick drum enough to satisfy an otherwise peaceful neighbor.

Your mics that are a mere 2-3 feet away from it? They're going to pick it up! Get it to where it sounds better in the OH's ... and to where the close-mic and the overhead work better together and compliment one another.

.

 

[RAMI]

I have a bad habit of just placing the overheads and being done with it... maybe they deserve some more attention.

Yes. The answer to your problem is probably right there, along with tuning the bass drum properly.

Look up different methods of micing drums (Recorderman, Glyn Johns, etc...). You'd be surprised how much difference a half inch makes to your sound, not to mention the phasing issues you'll get if distances aren't right. Your overheads should be the main part of the drum sound.