Tremendous Bass Tone - How To Mix A Bass Guitar

[Mr Clean]

The fact that you dislike bass software doesn't change the fact that with under $300 you can get fantastic bass DI tones and not only one bass tone.

I never once said I dislike Bass Software. I actually use some myself, from time to time. I first said it would be nice to hear some examples of the process you outline against those without it and I actually meant that. I still regard tuning any instrument with a digital plugin as laughable but that's a case of my personal opinion. The world is full of opinions.

We live on 2014 where most bands work via the Internet.....

Read what I wrote again, I said "the majority of people AROUND HERE record themselves". If the majority of your "subscribers" are studio owners/producers/engineers then maybe you should of edited the post for the Home Recording people around here who don't mix files sent to them by bands? No?

If we are talking about Melodyne yes. It doesn't care about how dark, deep, shitty or fantastic tone we've got. It doesn't even care about the tone, it cares about the tuning if it's made correctly.
That's why it always works (if not always, then 99% of the time).

I wasn't asking specifically about Melodyne. I asked if ALL that processing you mentioned in your original post will work for any bass tone. Seeing as Compressors/Limiters/EQ/Reverb are all tone changers/shapers/colourers/etc, I'm guessing the answer is NO?

But for a guy like me that love modern production like the "A Perfect Circle" band, I'll use some of it. Of course I'll fix it at the source though.

That's fair enough, like I said, each to their own.

I've got no problem with your thoughts, I have a problem with the attitude that entered the post and made me lose some respect for you, before even getting the chance to meet you:

--> Melodyne on a bass <--

I stand by that post 100%. It's a matter of personal opinion and you asked, in your original post, for people to contribute comments. Some opinions are shared, some not.

So the real question is, does all the processing that you outline in your original post work for any bass, any tone, in any genre of song, at any given time, in whatever session, in any mix?

 

[PDP]

I never once said I dislike Bass Software. I actually use some myself, from time to time. I first said it would be nice to hear some examples of the process you outline against those without it and I actually meant that. I still regard tuning any instrument with a digital plugin as laughable but that's a case of my personal opinion. The world is full of opinions.

I'm in agreement there, slapping autotune over an entire track is a pretty poor solution to intonating a composition, but pitch correction can be very handy when there is one or two sour notes. I recently did some vocals over a sax solo, one note in the solo was conflicting by a 1/2 tone. Without having to bring the sax player back again I shifted that one note. Beautiful. Used properly pitch correction can be quite handy.

 

[DM60]

I'm in agreement there, slapping autotune over an entire track is a pretty poor solution to intonating a composition, but pitch correction can be very handy when there is one or two sour notes. I recently did some vocals over a sax solo, one note in the solo was conflicting by a 1/2 tone. Without having to bring the sax player back again I shifted that one note. Beautiful. Used properly pitch correction can be quite handy.

I could agree with that, as a tool (like EQ) it makes sense.

 

[Mr Clean]

I'm in agreement there, slapping autotune over an entire track is a pretty poor solution to intonating a composition, but pitch correction can be very handy when there is one or two sour notes. I recently did some vocals over a sax solo, one note in the solo was conflicting by a 1/2 tone. Without having to bring the sax player back again I shifted that one note. Beautiful. Used properly pitch correction can be quite handy.

I can see the use for a tool like that in some situations, like yours PDP, it makes a bit more sense to nudge a note. Much like copying a note from another part to fix a fluffed bump on a string or something. On an entire track though?

If I was working with files a band sent me and the bass track was all out of tune and timing, I would tell them their bass sounds like shit. A spade is a spade, not a shovel, honesty is the best policy and all that. Fixing it for them is probably worse because the band will be lead up the garden path to believe that their bassist is a fantastic, totally in tune, time keeper. When in reality he's an out of tune bell-end with a crappy bass set up. Same thing applies with auto-tuning singers, in my opinion of course.

Still, the title of the thread is Tremendous Bass Tone - How To Mix A Bass Guitar, not, How To Use Melodyne and I apologise for taking it in that direction.

 

[mjbphotos]

I'm glad I don't do metal or hip-hop, I'd give up if I had to do this much processing to my bass line alone! I can just imagine how much you are doing to the guitars and vocals! Limiting, compressing, EQing, multi-band compressing, pitch-correct ... If I was mixing a client band (I don't) that gave me that bad a bass track, I'd retrack with myself playing it and never tell them!

EQing: cutting everything except 80-150Hz and 1kHz-5kHz (without being specific 'cut some dB') - not leaving much meat in that sandwich!

I DI my $90 (used) Squire bass with 2-year-old strings, (tuned), pop a PodFarm bass amp sim on the track when I'm done, tweak the knobs like a bass amp. If my volume was a little up-and-down, I'll put a compressor in front of the amp sim. If any note volumes are particularly bad, I'll automate the volume on the track. Done.

 

[Paschalis I.]

I'm glad I don't do metal or hip-hop, I'd give up if I had to do this much processing to my bass line alone! I can just imagine how much you are doing to the guitars and vocals! Limiting, compressing, EQing, multi-band compressing, pitch-correct ...

If I was mixing a client band (I don't) that gave me that bad a bass track, I'd retrack with myself playing it and never tell them!

The bass guitar is the instrument that I process the most, cause I mainly mix modern metal music and cause it's the No1 instrument that can handle all these tweaks.
It actually needs all these tweaks cause the bass guitar is an imperfect instrument on each own.

For the guitars and vocals I mostly use 1 EQ and 1 Compressor but it really depends on the source material.

About the band thing, I would tell them to re-record it again (it's not my job to learn their song and play it I am their mixing engineer not a band member).
Then, when i'd get the better take i would edit it more depending on the genre. Modern metal needs it, rock and easier stuff not so much.

And about the "too much processing" subject about metal/hip-hop, the sad truth is that compression in series is not really uncommon.
Compression in series work wonders on most genres too cause the flow of the signal is more natural.

Just because there are more compressors doesn't mean there's more compression.

Thanks for your opinion!

 

[gecko zzed]

The bass guitar is the instrument that I process the most, cause I mainly mix modern metal music and cause it's the No1 instrument that can handle all these tweaks.
It actually needs all these tweaks cause the bass guitar is an imperfect instrument on each own.

Maybe it depends on the bass guitar. I put my bass through a DI and . . . well nothing else. For 90% of the time that's it; there is no further processing. Some bass guitars may be imperfect 'on each own', but not all are.

 

[rayc]

"The bass guitar is the instrument that I process the most... cause it's the No1 instrument that can handle all these tweaks."
Edmund Hillary would be rolling in his grave.
Now, honestly, that's just DAFT.
I was going to use an analogy but I don't think the daftness of that statement requires illumination.

Usually I run my Aus $182 in 1983 MIJ bass into a AUS$45 Behringer BDI21 through an interface into Reaper and add some defintion at 3khz depending on the mix and a compressor if needed.

If I want an "older" tone I'll run in through the preamp in my 1985 MT100.

If I want it BIG I'll run a line from my BDI21 into my bass amp & mic that to blend with the DI signal.
IF I've been wayward I'll retrack &/or automate the volume.

Bass synths running with the bass - yes been threr, used an octaver to do somehing similar too. That depends on the track but I wouldn't replace the bass with a synth.

 

[PDP]

Maybe it depends on the bass guitar. I put my bass through a DI and . . . well nothing else. For 90% of the time that's it; there is no further processing. Some bass guitars may be imperfect 'on each own', but not all are.

Sure, I was recording at a studio in Manhatten where they did a lot of R&B artists. There were these black session guys that would plug straight in, all the sound and levels came from the fingers and their superb technique, if they wanted a bright sound they play next to the bridge, a full round tone, they moved up towards the neck. All the while keeping a constant level on the VU meter.

 

[gumbi_nz]

So what's wrong with melodyne on a bass mate? If I find a sample that i like that doesn't quite fit the key of the tune I'm working on, I use melodyne to align it. In fact, pitch correction generally works better on more monophonic sources such as bass. You don't seriously think the OP is talking about the T-Pain effect on bass do you?

 

[Manor Music]

This is relevant for me...just recorded one song for a teenage "metal group" like Alice In Chains...The Greg Miller Band...not related to Steve...
bass player doing a one note line and couldn't keep the beat or in tune....
I spent last day editing out bad drumming...misplaced parts and copy/pasting "replacement" parts from other areas of the song...bass parts that couldnt keep a steady basic beat and the guitarist/singer was mostly together

No chance to mix just yet
probably not done editing
looking foward to using this thread
now listen...and I will dig up the unedited version if you all play nice...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/gdduyogcazzr9rm/memory greg miller .wav

 

[rayc]

Manor Music,
I didn't listen because a 60+ meg download would take hours with my line. Any chance of a streamer or soundcloud etc?
Have you had the conversation with the band about how poorly the rhythm section performed?
If Y how did they cope?

 

[Guitargodgt]

It is not a shame to use software, especially for your bass tone, which is one of the hardest things to get a great source sound from, if money is an issue.


You' ll need to invest $1.000 minimum to get a bass guitar that will give you a professional DI sound... Let's not forget that each bass guitar works differently for each genre so it's not easy to afford a different bass guitar for each genre!

This is really the only thing I don't agree with at all going on personal experience. The rest of the tutorial seems alright to me.

 

[Paschalis I.]

This is really the only thing I don't agree with at all going on personal experience. The rest of the tutorial seems alright to me.

Yeah I've got to say that it was a bit too much, it's just my love for a perfect modern sound that makes me really picky about it.
For a professional studio might not be so much but for a home studio I could easily use an $400 price tag and not a $1000 price tag.

Thanks for your input!

 

[Manor Music]

new mp3 link Glen Miller

there is a new additional mp3 link I put up
https://www.dropbox.com/home/memory by greg miller band
still not mixed, just edited

I think a conversation with the band is not gonna help these young kids play better.
They know where they sit...they hired me to fix up their song for them.

Manor Music,
I didn't listen because a 60+ meg download would take hours with my line. Any chance of a streamer or soundcloud etc?
Have you had the conversation with the band about how poorly the rhythm section performed?
If Y how did they cope?

 

[Guitargodgt]

$150 bass. No upgrades, totally stock from the factory:

https://db.tt/dAHRTkxd

 

[gecko zzed]

For a professional studio might not be so much but for a home studio I could easily use an $400 price tag and not a $1000 price tag.

Price is generally a good indicator of quality . . . but not always. It's risky talking about prices, because people will always come up with their exceptions. I can do exactly the same.

Instead of talking about prices, refer to the real issue, which is quality. In other words, getting a good DI sound out of a bass guitar depends on the quality of the bass guitar and its electronics.

 

[rayc]

That link requires password & registration etc. Still can't listen.

 

[Paschalis I.]

$150 bass. No upgrades, totally stock from the factory:

https://db.tt/dAHRTkxd

I can hear that... Not the best one but with some processing it'll work really great for a home recording project, great work!
Might if I ask which bass guitar you used?

I suppose you haven't mixed it yet my friend? No gentle compression during tracking?
I always love sharing stuff like that, hope I don't ask too much

Price is generally a good indicator of quality . . . Getting a good DI sound out of a bass guitar depends on the quality of the bass guitar and its electronics.

And its wood. You are not getting great wood with great electronics with less than $400, but there are some bargains on ebay so I suppose you can

 

[Guitargodgt]

I can hear that... Not the best one but with some processing it'll work really great for a home recording project, great work!
Might if I ask which bass guitar you used?

I suppose you haven't mixed it yet my friend? No gentle compression during tracking?
I always love sharing stuff like that, hope I don't ask too much



And its wood. You are not getting great wood with great electronics with less than $400, but there are some bargains on ebay so I suppose you can

Oh yeah I don't mind. No I have no plugins on that example. It's just bass to pre with a hardware comp on the way in.

It was a 5 string Jazz SX ash bass. I spent $150 on it brand new.