Do you really buy that expensive recording software?

[Stealthtech]

Re: Re: Do you really buy that expensive recording software?

Piracy of Logic on the PC side may have driven Emagic to sell out to Apple. In this case Piracy may have killed Logic Windows outright, and in doing so fucked over 70,000 registered users and inconvienced many more freeloaders.

Piracy necessitates higher prices for folks that do pay. I guess this is a moral reason.

Plus by buying software, you get updates, bug fixes, customer service, etc..

Emagic created version 5.0 with the USB key and you had to mail in your original software disc from 4.8 and all plug-in disc's as proof of ownership. The USB key was to stop the piracy. I upgraded at a cost of $400.00 and I still got fucked !
No more PC support ! 1 month after my upgrade.
But I think I will use 5.0 till it doesn't work anymore. I sure the hell aint going out to buy a Mac.

 

[smellyfuzz]

BOROMETER;

"If you truly believe these two things, then I truly feel sorry for you."

Here on the Long Island express way I get to see first hand what reckless driving causes.

AND am I to understand that you really believe that when you light up
a joint your hurting no one but yourself ?

Not really the point thought.

"Stealing software IS immoral"

Yep, it certainly is, it is very wrong, have you ever acted immoral or
wronged someone in your life ?

GEEKGURL;
"So let's say I were to commit every single immoral act or your list -- and then some -- well, I'm still accountable for stealing software if I'm doing that too. It just means I have that much more to work on. Two wrongs don't make a right."

I agree completely.




Sean

 

[decoy7]

its morally wrong, you'll go to hell for downloading it.

your taking money from development of the software companies.

if your gonna argue the point at least be real.

software companies care about the people who buy their software?

the recent aquisitions of various software companies by major corporations shows exactly how real this all is...this year your a valued customer, next year your a pain in the backside to support so your product is now end of life.

some of you need to think before you support the cause especially when the peole your defending dont stand for what you may believe in.

i'm not saying its right, i know its wrong...but so are many other more serious matters so if someone chooses to do it i wont be losing no sleep.

the bigger picture is if your a musician your already in probably the worst industry there is for cut throat decision making and fcuked up people...so do what you have to to further your art and try not to hurt others in the process....or is that a contradiction in this day and age?

 

[geekgurl]

Re: Re: OK ALL YOU HOLIER THEN NOW PEOPLE.

...as it is written law.



And since when does this determine morality. Stealing software IS immoral, but it has nothing to do with laws.

I think you're turning around what I said. Read it again. I did not say laws determined what was moral; I merely said pirating software was, PER WRITTEN LAW, deemed stealing. SO, IF you're pirating software, you are stealing ... and if you're into the 10 commandments, you'd consider stealing a sin, therefore immoral. So see, your take is pretty much the reverse of the logic I was using.

And regarding decoy's post: frankly, it pretty weak to say it's OK to shit on software companies because they don't care about you as a consumer, blah blah. Don't like the way for-profit companies run in a capitalist society? Then use freeware, or become a shareholder, or a competitor, or write a letter (did you know that when a company or member of the press gets a letter expressing a view they figure it represents the sentiments of 12,000 people who feel the same way but don't bother to write? You have some power, you know!). Besides, it just MAY BE you are underestimating how important the customer is to a company. I've been very satisfied with the service of my software company, and I researched their upgrade policy before I made the decision to purchase their product. So I am a happy customer.


If it's a product on the market and you want it, you should buy it. If you can't afford it make do with less or save. It's what we all do with every other type of purchase every day of our lives, unless we're sociopaths who think the world owes us something or we are the type to blame everyone else for our problems. And to be that way is really to be giving away too much personal power, really.

My .02

 

[decoy7]

i dont really have the time to argue any points, hence the 20+ posts in the year i've been registered, i'm just saying for the people out there who have illegal software running...try buying some when you can and do what you have to in the meantime...good luck on your quest in the music business and spend more time being creative on your computer or instrument than replying to bullsh** on bulletin boards.

any replies to my comments are welcome as this is a free land but i will not be back to reply on this subject...some of you need to spend more time with a guitar...what would happen if you met your musical heroes and they told you they're running a cracked version of Cubase? you gonna start ranting on about how wrong they are or ask them for tips on how they made it in the music biz?

everyone has their own opinion, you cant change the way people think so stop hating them for doing wrong, its their right, just follow your own path.

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

everyone has their own opinion, you cant change the way people think so stop hating them for doing wrong, its their right, just follow your own path.

You gotta love this line.... decoy must be a very young lad....

Yeah... that bugger just stole my car, but I guess it's his opinion that it isn't stealing so I'll leave him be, and *I* don't beleive in stealing anyways, so I guess everything's ok...!

Gimme a fuckin' break...............

 

[Bigus Dickus]

I downloaded my piano. It's a warez Baldwin.

 

[Bigus Dickus]

p.s. - I have a copy of a $20,000 software package on my computer. I don't use it to make money, or even use it to produce any type of "product," for my benefit or otherwise.

I use it to learn the software, in the hopes that it improves my career advancement oportunities.

I'd like your opinions on this, because I haven't really come to a firm "moral" decision myself on this one. I know it's illegal, and that's not in question. I purchased a $400 "student" version when I was a student, but you would not believe how limited it is compared to the commercial version. There's no way to really learn the intracacies of the software on the student version.

There is no "demo" of the full version. I asked a company rep personally (spent some time with him when in school getting specific training for the software), and he laughed. It's one of those programs that can take a year to really learn. My current employer doesn't use this software.

Should an individual spend $20,000 to purchase software that is really only useful to large corporations? Should I wait until the time comes to go looking for a new job (no time soon, I hope), and hope that this item lacking on my resume doesn't cost me the position, or a better salary? Is it immoral to be motivated and want to learn this software away from the workplace?

I'm serious about this one. If there was ever a case of not being "black and white" I think this might be it. What are you guys thoughts?

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

I know that only the very rich can afford Ferraris, but I'm motivated to learn how to drive one.... I'll steal one now so that when I buy one in the future, I'll know how to drive it..........

I repeat........ gimme a fuckin' break.......

 

[subtractor]

I agree. If knowing the software helps get you a job, do it. But I don't really care about software piracy... So my opinion is moot anyway.

 

[subtractor]

Why does this conversation always turn to cars?

You might as well mention the replicator then... Cuz you Ferrarri is still in your garage. It just happens to have been replicated. So I can understand how you might be upset that someone is driving a "clone" of your car for free, while you went out and spent your money one the original... So maybe you should call Ferrarri and have them make a clone proof car. Or get a better garage.

 

[Bigus Dickus]

I know that only the very rich can afford Ferraris, but I'm motivated to learn how to drive one.... I'll steal one now so that when I buy one in the future, I'll know how to drive it..........

I repeat........ gimme a fuckin' break.......

As I stated, I haven't come to a firm moral decision myself on this, but there is a huge difference between my example and yours, and you know it.

When you steal that Ferrari, someone else (the owner) suffers a direct loss. They lose the Ferrari so that you can gain it.

When I get a copy of this software from a friend that uses it at work, does he suffer a direct loss? No. Does the company suffer a direct loss (lost business)? No. Does the company suffer any indirect losses? No, so long as I keep my copy to myself. Am I making it available to anyone else? No. Does the creator of the software suffer any direct or indirect loss? No. Am I in any way creating a product that would have otherwise required me to purchase theirs or a competitor's software? No.

In fact, my having the knowledge to use this software could (remote chance) equate to a future purchase of this software, if a company purchases it on the basis of my existing ability to use it.

Having an opinion is fine, and using analogies to express it can be useful. But if you're going to use an analogy, make sure it is a good one.

I do appreciate your opinion though, since that is precisely what I am asking for. If everyone feels like that, then I may decide that deleting the software is the only reasonable thing to do.

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

It's an excellent analogy - there is no difference between it, and the situation you describe.

When you use a copy of your friend's s/w, the company DOES lose business... it is a copy that someone is using that they haven't paid for, and as such, have no right to use. Period. Ferrari - software... what's the difference. Theft is theft, no matter what spin you put on it to rationalize it.

If you buy it, you can use it... if you didn't, you can't.... simple!

 

[Bigus Dickus]

It's an excellent analogy - there is no difference between it, and the situation you describe.

When you use a copy of your friend's s/w, the company DOES lose business... it is a copy that someone is using that they haven't paid for, and as such, have no right to use. Period. Ferrari - software... what's the difference. Theft is theft, no matter what spin you put on it to rationalize it.

If you buy it, you can use it... if you didn't, you can't.... simple!

I disagree. They aren't losing a customer at all, and they aren't losing any money by me learning their software. If you can show how that is false, I'd be very interested.

Option 1: I don't use the software.
Option 2: I use an illegit copy.
Option 3: There is no option three.

I've paid to go to their training courses in the past, and I've paid for the only "demo" (the student version) available. I'm no longer elegible for student versions, and the only way to keep informed of the dramatic changes they make in new revisions is to actually dig inside a newer revision, and see for yourself. None of the books I have purchased go into nearly enough depth. It can't be explained on the phone. Their customer rep (a friend of mine) has stated simply that there isn't a version available that they can configure in any way that would make it useable as a demo. In otherwords, you get full commercial functionality, or none at all.

I've looked for all other alternatives. The above two options are all there are. I've thought about this at length, and I can't identify a single source that loses revenue due to me keeping current on their software releases.

 

[Bigus Dickus]

BTW, I wonder if the same people who pronounce this entire subject to be "black and white" are the same ones who, when the topic of home studios taking revenue from professionals, declare that it's not "black and white" when a statement such as "adapt or die" is made.

 

[Stealthtech]

Bigus, what is this 20g software program you are reffering to ?

 

[acidrock]

I am so fucking sick of these thieves who have to rationalise their actions.
Get a fucking job and pay for the software.

If you think software a ripoff then go analog.

These programmers make a product that's easy to steal and depend on somewhat of an honor system.

If you steal you're a scumbag.
If you go online and tell every one you're an idiot.

 

[Bigus Dickus]

The software is engineering oriented (mechanical, not audio).

In response to the above post, if that was directed at me, I'd like to say that I have purchased every OS, application, and game that I have ever used. For the software in question I have purchased the only consumer-level demo that exists (student version). The software isn't currently installed on my machine, since I reformatted recently and have no need for it, having already learned what changes were made since the last version. But, when a new version is released, I'll have it installed long enough to see what they did, and get my head wrapped around any substantially different features.

Call it rationalizing if you want. I wouldn't say I'm particularly comfortable with it, but the benefits IMO far outweigh some mild moral uneasiness, for the time being at least.

As an interesting side note... the friend of mine that uses it at work is legally allowed to have a copy at home for his use. Not his own "personal" use (as in using it to make a profit), but for continued learning and/or work on projects for his company. It's in the EULA for that software. I could drive two hours to sit at his house and learn the changes, or I could do it at my own home. One way is technically illegal, the other is not. Both have the same impact on revenue for anyone involved - none. Is there really a moral distinction?

p.s. - it took forever to download my piano.

 

[Toki987]

I downloaded my piano. It's a warez Baldwin.

Did it come all the way from Mississippi with a crack ?

 

[Bigus Dickus]

Did it come all the way from Mississippi with a crack ?

No, I had to download the crack separately. That came from Bama.