Do you really buy that expensive recording software?

[Ham On Rye]

piracy

i gotta say at least one thing.. i work at a music store and i have some nfr's and some cracked stuff.. if i didnt get the cracked stuff i would have not been able to help the people like you when we talk about software at this music store.. funny thing is ive gotten to the point i care less, sonar 2.0, fuck it. i dont feel like downloading and learning about it.. logic 5 is one of the few major improvements ive really seen in consumer/ pro software.. but alas its going away for pc. im just presenting one more standpoint in this beat to death discussion.. ive configured more software for a lot of soundcards because of piracy.. now i can help the customer before they call steinberg, cakewalk, emagic and so forth.. so it does have its good points i suppose.. i dunno..

 

[Dave S.]

From a Professional Software Engineer...

Right on! I am so sick of people saying they steal software because they can't afford to buy it. I too am a software engineer and I know what it takes to develop a real software product. Can't afford the software? Get a job! You call yourself a musician and can't play a few gigs to finance what you need??
Dave

 

[ColdAsh]

Re: From a Professional Software Engineer...

2) If you are using the rationalization that you need to download a crack to demo it, your just fooling yourself. I seriously doubt your going to be a diligent person and not "accidently" use it a few more times. If you really need to demo a piece of software, believe me, there are ways to get a legite copy/demo.

Well with some software packages, eg logic, there are no free demos. Sure you could buy one of the cheep version live AV but that way too expensive for a demo. I admit to using a cracked verison of logic, not that i could do much with it. And you know what i bought logic gold. If i didnt have the cracked version i might not have known how good it was and bought something else then the manufacture would have lost my money. You cant say that this topic is 100% black and white because IT'S NOT!

 

[Busy]

Re: piracy

i gotta say at least one thing.. i work at a music store and i have some nfr's and some cracked stuff.. if i didnt get the cracked stuff i would have not been able to help the people like you when we talk about software at this music store.. funny thing is ive gotten to the point i care less, sonar 2.0, fuck it. i dont feel like downloading and learning about it.. logic 5 is one of the few major improvements ive really seen in consumer/ pro software.. but alas its going away for pc. im just presenting one more standpoint in this beat to death discussion.. ive configured more software for a lot of soundcards because of piracy.. now i can help the customer before they call steinberg, cakewalk, emagic and so forth.. so it does have its good points i suppose.. i dunno..

So Egg on Face...I mean Ham on Rye,

You're telling me that you music store (I assume mega GC or Mars) can't provide you with legite copies at work to learn with? So instead, you've decided to steal software for a minimum wage job? You are one devoted fellow to have sacrificed your ethic for such a small return. Again, if you really need the software and work for a real music store that sells the product, you can get a retailer copy. You need to reevaluate your job decision. Hey by the way, can I borrow the keys to your car? It's the least you can do for me given that your stealing my intellectual property.

 

[Busy]

Re: Re: From a Professional Software Engineer...

Well with some software packages, eg logic, there are no free demos. Sure you could buy one of the cheep version live AV but that way too expensive for a demo. I admit to using a cracked verison of logic, not that i could do much with it. And you know what i bought logic gold. If i didnt have the cracked version i might not have known how good it was and bought something else then the manufacture would have lost my money. You cant say that this topic is 100% black and white because IT'S NOT!

There is always a way to get a demo. Try calling the company. I do commend that you broke the normal rule that your demo just didn't turn long term. If a company doesn't provide a demo that's there problem. Let them know they need to change that or you will take your business elsewhere. Remember what I said before....Warez sites are tracked. If you are logging onto one from a place of business, your putting your company in jeapardy.

 

[ColdAsh]

There is always a way to get a demo. Try calling the company. I do commend that you broke the normal rule that your demo just didn't turn long term. If a company doesn't provide a demo that's there problem. Let them know they need to change that or you will take your business elsewhere. Remember what I said before....Warez sites are tracked. If you are logging onto one from a place of business, your putting your company in jeapardy.

Well id love to know where the free demo is becasue its not on Emagics site. Also the cracked version came on a CD from a friend who got it in Singapore i think so i dont have to worry about being tracked

 

[Ham On Rye]

Re: Re: piracy

So Egg on Face...I mean Ham on Rye,

You're telling me that you music store (I assume mega GC or Mars) can't provide you with legite copies at work to learn with? So instead, you've decided to steal software for a minimum wage job? You are one devoted fellow to have sacrificed your ethic for such a small return. Again, if you really need the software and work for a real music store that sells the product, you can get a retailer copy. You need to reevaluate your job decision. Hey by the way, can I borrow the keys to your car? It's the least you can do for me given that your stealing my intellectual property.

well first off i sure as hell dont make mininum wage. yes i can get nfr's sometimes.. hell because of piracy is why its probably harder now. if you want the list of hard ones to get here ya go. steinberg used to offer nfr's now they have cheap ones. logic is 150 dollars, no nfr's. ik multimedia are great about nfr's. cakewalk is decent about them, i have actually been told by a cakewalk rep to distrubute freely amongst all the employees. no you cant borrow my car and keep it.. but you can go down to the dealership and test drive a couple different ones and come tell me the differences.. thanks..

 

[Busy]

Re: Re: Re: piracy

well first off i sure as hell dont make mininum wage. yes i can get nfr's sometimes.. hell because of piracy is why its probably harder now. if you want the list of hard ones to get here ya go. steinberg used to offer nfr's now they have cheap ones. logic is 150 dollars, no nfr's. ik multimedia are great about nfr's. cakewalk is decent about them, i have actually been told by a cakewalk rep to distrubute freely amongst all the employees. no you cant borrow my car and keep it.. but you can go down to the dealership and test drive a couple different ones and come tell me the differences.. thanks..

Didn't mean to offend. I was just meaning that you worked retail. Not trying to slight the job. I did a little investigation and called up emagic and asked if they would demo....and went so far to say...I'm "This Close" to buying Logic if I could just demo even a crippled version for a while....They guy said no...I went on to tell him that Sonar, DP3...etc. would provide me demos and he said sorry. I finished my conversation with, well I guess that knocks you guys out and I'm buying DP3. He said OK (half laughing). So let me do a 180 and say screw emagic and their sales staff. So Ham on Rye, I apolgize...use the crack (to try out of course only). They deserve it for having such a screwed up marketing department. Hopefully apple will teach them the errors of their ways.

 

[Stealthtech]

Started with Logic Audio discovery $300
Upgraded to Logic 4.5 $400
Upgraded to Logic 5.0 $400
I learned the software over a 5 yr. period and it would be rediculous to change now.
5.0 has created a software USB key that controls piracy and is a powerful program for recording.
I dont regret spending the money over time. These guys know what their doing and have offered great tech support to me over the years.
Logic Rocks !!!

 

[Ham On Rye]

Re: Re: Re: Re: piracy

nah you didnt offend.. i make good money actually. none of it has to do with software sales though.. but i am always the go to guy for software and computer based troubleshooting.. its quite the hassle sometimes.. hell we have a copy of logic 4.8 missing the dongle and cant get a dongle so that we can sell it.. they pretty much gave me the brush.. my manager is going to ask for a free nfr soon and when they say no like they do, hes gonna tell them, oh ok, i guess ill sell cubase exclusively.. oh well.. i love logic my self.. and my 150 dollar nfr is worth every penny even when they leave me stranded in september.. ah well.
they really do havea superior product.. well anyhoo..

Didn't mean to offend. I was just meaning that you worked retail. Not trying to slight the job. I did a little investigation and called up emagic and asked if they would demo....and went so far to say...I'm "This Close" to buying Logic if I could just demo even a crippled version for a while....They guy said no...I went on to tell him that Sonar, DP3...etc. would provide me demos and he said sorry. I finished my conversation with, well I guess that knocks you guys out and I'm buying DP3. He said OK (half laughing). So let me do a 180 and say screw emagic and their sales staff. So Ham on Rye, I apolgize...use the crack (to try out of course only). They deserve it for having such a screwed up marketing department. Hopefully apple will teach them the errors of their ways.

 

[DougC]

Most of the people (kids) who download cracked software don't know how to use it, and get really bummed when their music still sounds like cr4p because of their cheap soundcard and $20 Radio Shack mic. In the US at least, some software is available at student discounts [that approach 50%] that many of these KIDS would qualify for, if they got their heads outta their rears.
-Imagine that!
You'd get a legit CD, user manual, tech support and everything!
~
What I use for mixing/sequencing software didn't cost $100.
Burning software usually comes free with a CD-RW drive, and wav editors often come free with both.
What's to steal?
There's an old saying: "It's a poor musician that blames his instrument."
~
BUT-
I have heard of people using cracked versions of legit software they paid for, for reasons like what Ham On Rye said: poorly-implemented security measures that don't work right. If your CD drive is old, the program may refuse to even install.

 

[ColdAsh]

Started with Logic Audio discovery $300
Upgraded to Logic 4.5 $400
Upgraded to Logic 5.0 $400
I learned the software over a 5 yr. period and it would be rediculous to change now.

I hope your not using a PC for logic like me or ur gonna have to buy a Mac or give up on getting new versions. Life sux

 

[esactun]

Kelby,
Itsn't this why the agreement you see before installing software often contains the language, stating that if you don't agree with provisions of this agreement, you should return it for full refund?
That way although not having been fully informed at the cash register, the user is still given a chance to return the product and get back his money. When the user continues installation, the circle closes: you've been warned!
Just my undertstanding.

AFAIK, all the vendors I've bought software from won't let you return software that's been opened, except to exchange a defective copy for a working one. So one can't return the software for a refund if one doesn't agree to the agreement, since the package has been opened and the vendor will assume that you copied the disc. It's an SOL situation, like buying an album you end up hating (but for far more $$$$).

 

[((ÐamneÐ))]

Kelby,
Itsn't this why the agreement you see before installing software often contains the language, stating that if you don't agree with provisions of this agreement, you should return it for full refund?
That way although not having been fully informed at the cash register, the user is still given a chance to return the product and get back his money. When the user continues installation, the circle closes: you've been warned!
Just my undertstanding.

Yeah, except the retailers will generally refuse to refund you once the package is open. You can exchange it for a copy of the same program. IF you say you don't agree with the license agreement, they tell you to complain to the manufacturer.

I've tried it (as a study for a paper I wrote)...that's how it has panned out on 20 or so occassions.

 

[KingstonRock]

Student discounts

I'm a KID that might be able to qualify for student discounts, how do you get them?

I'm looking to buy Sonar 2.0 possibly XL, can you get a discount on that?

Eric

 

[Hard2Hear]

When I was in college, they had the software at the univertisy bookstore. It was very very discounted. Try your local university.

H2H

 

[smellyfuzz]

OK ALL YOU HOLIER THEN NOW PEOPLE.

Let's just remember one thing.

Ever taped a song off the radio, did you pay for that ?

Ever recorded off HBO ?

If you ever tried pot, you support murder, prostitution.

If you fill your car with gas, you support the Mid East terrorists.

How many of you guys cheated on your wife or girl friend.
None of you ? It has been proven that 70-90% men do cheat.

How about, cheating a little on your taxes. Anybody ever do that ?
I bet no here on this web-site has.

Wait, I've got a good one, how many people at this web-site have excelled the speed limit.
Endangering yourself and more importantly the family in the mini van you just passed and flipped the bird to because THEY were doing 55 in the LEFT lane.

Anyone ever keep the extra change that was given to you by the poor register clerk ?
He/she may have been fired because of your dishonesty.

EVER SELL YOUR OLD CAR & NOT DISCLOSE ALL THAT WAS WRONG WITH IT.

Before we all start casting stones, perhaps we should work on our own flaws first.

LOVE BABY,

SEAN

 

[geekgurl]

Re: OK ALL YOU HOLIER THEN NOW PEOPLE.

Let's just remember one thing.
...

Before we all start casting stones, perhaps we should work on our own flaws first.

LOVE BABY,

SEAN

It's an admirable thing to work on one's flaws, indeed. Would you consider pirating software unethical, and therefore flawed behavior? I think that's the original question. And I don't think it's a judgment call to say that taking someone else's intellectual property is stealing -- it's a fact, as it is written law.

So let's say I were to commit every single immoral act or your list -- and then some -- well, I'm still accountable for stealing software if I'm doing that too. It just means I have that much more to work on. Two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[subtractor]

Shiver me timbers...
Did you programmers know about software piracy before you decided to make that your profession? Have you ever witten a virus? Perhaps cracked a program yourself? When's the last time your paycheck bounced?
I agree that if someone is making money or distributing material produced with said code, that it should be paid for.
I like to try before buying though. And most of the demo's don't really let you get a good feel for the program. If they do, fine. But most don't. So yes, I will buy your program once I find I like it. But I don't want to fuck with a crippled copy in anyway if there is a full version available.

Or I will not evaluate or ever buy your software.

Your choice...

 

[Barometer]

Re: OK ALL YOU HOLIER THEN NOW PEOPLE.

If you ever tried pot, you support murder, prostitution.

Wait, I've got a good one, how many people at this web-site have excelled the speed limit.
Endangering yourself and more importantly the family in the mini van you just passed and flipped the bird to because THEY were doing 55 in the LEFT lane.

SEAN

If you truly believe these two things, then I truly feel sorry for you. They start at the source...government . And if you want to argue that we can take it to the cave.

Originally posted by geekgurl
as it is written law.

And since when does this determine morality. Stealing software IS immoral, but it has nothing to do with laws.