would like to record cleaner acoustic guitar

N

NationalSandwic

New member
hi

can anyone recommend techniques for reducing fret noise, plectrum/nail click on an acoustic guitar recording.
certainly don't want to eliminate it altogether, cos it doesn't sound 'real'.
i imagine theres a lot of playing technique work that could clean it up too.
ideas?

thanks
anthony
 
You answered your own question. Playing technique is the key.

You could try attaching that stuff with some surgical paraEQ, but you'll scarring the sound of the acoustic itself. One of those cases where the cure can be worse than the disease.

Recommend to the player (or yourself if it's you), that they give the song a 48 hours more of practice with a concentration of getting the song played cleanly with a minimum of extraneous noise.

If after that time he/you still needs to "slop it up" a bit in order to play with the right feeling and soul, then go with it. Better to have an emotive, soulful performance with a little bit of noise than a technically perfect one that has all the heart of a zombie.

Unless you're recording for a Windham Hill effect :o . But even then, George Winston could stand a little Prof. Longhair infusion. ;)

G.
 
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hi glen, mmm....i'm not going for windham hill, thank god.
yeah i eq the hell out of the high ends, but then the harmonics start to vanish too.
if you listen to them old nick drake recording or cohen's recordings, that's sort of where i want it to be. warm. breathing.
which brings in another question which i've been wondering about...do you think they would have tracked those sorts of songs (singer + guitar) in one shot, vox & guitar? or would it have been a dub job? from the style of music, and the slight shifting tempos that happen (as a natural result of solo performance), i wonder if dubbing would managed to produce such cohesive performances?
 
With what you are describing, technique is where its at. You could combine that with some actual strin treatments, and cautious mic placement and even mic selection. EQ'ing can help, but only a little. If you need more than a little EQ, it's like Glenn said, you will be directly interfering with the tone of the guitar itself. Personally, EQ'ing out string squeaks etc... usually sounds worse to me than leaving them in. The EQ can help to take out the primary frequencies of the squeaks, but those are also very important frequencies in getting a nice clear guitar tone. Not to mention, the squeaks will still be there. When I hear a dull guitar sound with some squeaks still there, I usually cringe because i am assuming that someone tried to take them out. I would rather hear the good tone with the squeaks, than bad tone with minimized squeaks.
 
Getting a clean sound at the source is the biggest thing, I think. Beyond, that, mic'ing from 3 to 6 ft away cuts extraneous playing noises down a lot but you need a good sounding room.

Tim
 
And a good mic and especially a good preamp because you will most likely be digging pretty deep into the preamp at 6 feet on acoustic guitar.
 
sure thing......argh i need $$$. i reckon we're easily paying up to 50% more than you guys in the states for mics here.

what string treatments are you talking about, xstatic?
 
NationalSandwic said:
if you listen to them old nick drake recording or cohen's recordings, that's sort of where i want it to be. warm. breathing.
which brings in another question which i've been wondering about...do you think they would have tracked those sorts of songs (singer + guitar) in one shot, vox & guitar? or would it have been a dub job? from the style of music, and the slight shifting tempos that happen (as a natural result of solo performance), i wonder if dubbing would managed to produce such cohesive performances?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure which "Cohen" you're talking about. If you're talking about Leonard, while he is big on having things "just so" in his studio and in the sound of his tracking, he also puts the song before the production and keeps his productions pretty spase and straightforward and tends to go with the artistic performance rather than manufacture a performance.

And I think that's the general concensus when it comes to vaudevillian performance like "a man and his guitar"; keep it organic. If the artist or the engineer are not happy with some aspect of a particular take, I think most - including myself - would be more inclined to just go with a series of entire takes, and the just pick the best of them rather than collage pieces of each of them together.

Possible exceptions may be extended or classical pieces where entire takes can run twenty minutes each and there are distinct passages that are easier to chapter. In those cases one moght reasonably piece seperate performances togther. But for your average 3-minute folk/blues/pop acoustic piece, in the words of Stevie Ray, "just roll". :)

G.
 
"would like to record cleaner acoustic guitar"

Martin's polish should help :D (sorry couldn't resist!)

All kidding aside... aside from technique- you should look into whether using Fret-ease sprays are right for you. Also I heard using Elixir's cut down on squeaks a bit too.
 
"would like to record cleaner acoustic guitar"

Martin's polish should help :D (sorry couldn't resist!)

All kidding aside... aside from technique- you should look into whether using Fret-ease sprays are right for you. Also I heard using Elixir strings might cut down on squeaks a bit too.
 
hehe
glen, yep i mean leonard.

eep....i'm not so keen on spraying stuff onto my fretboard. never heard of that stuff before. i'm on the hunt for flatwound strings; heard them before and they were very quiet.
 
clean acoustic guitar

Try getting a set of strings made by ELIXER. They're a bit pricy but they have a coating that actually helps cut down noise from fret slides...and also helps prolong the string's life. It's no substitute for technique, but as I've found in most recording problems, they are usually solved by a combination of little things.
 
Someone on this board (can't remember who) taught me a trick for eliminating string squeak.

Have the player put the tips of his fretting fingers in a glass of water (or mouth) for about 30 seconds before playing. Shake/wipe off the excess before playing. It works great when trying to record a passage that normally generates a lot of squeaks.

Solving the problem with technique is obviously preferred, but sometimes we just need to get through a part and move on.
 
Phyl said:
Have the player put the tips of his fretting fingers in a glass of water (or mouth) for about 30 seconds before playing. Shake/wipe off the excess before playing. It works great when trying to record a passage that normally generates a lot of squeaks.
Click to expand...

Damn, beat me to it. I'll add HOT water works better. Ever play after getting out of the shower? It rips up your callouses a little, but definitely cuts the squeak a ton.

What do you mean by nail click? Do you mean when a string vibrates against the nail on a finger fretting an adjacent string. Obviously technique and practice are key here, but also make sure your nails are trimmed as short as possible. If your nails are preventing you from fretting with the tip of your finger completely vertical, avoiding the buzz is much harder.
 
danner, thanks for the suggestion. elixir doesn't make nylons, i'm afraid. the electrics & acoustic strings do sound pretty good & play well, tho.

reshp1, i play classical finger style. ie i have longer nails on the right hand (plucking hand). these can generate a click when attacking the string, sort of like a plectrum tick. to be honest, i think it's a combination of nail shaping and technique that'll solve my problem a lot. but i'm recording mostly with a piezo (i've been posting re. this in microphone forum), which tends to blow out the highends - which is wierd, cos i tried of the same model years ago and that blew out the bottom end. maybe they've made some mods to combat that & to combat feedback.
 
NationalSandwic said:
reshp1, i play classical finger style. ie i have longer nails on the right hand (plucking hand). these can generate a click when attacking the string, sort of like a plectrum tick. to be honest, i think it's a combination of nail shaping and technique that'll solve my problem a lot. but i'm recording mostly with a piezo (i've been posting re. this in microphone forum), which tends to blow out the highends - which is wierd, cos i tried of the same model years ago and that blew out the bottom end. maybe they've made some mods to combat that & to combat feedback.
Click to expand...
Ah okay, I see. Yep, don't know how to help on that one.
 
What kind of mic are you using? Hopefully a condenser and not a dynamic. Maybe a ribbon mic has the sound you want. Hard to say.
 
Timothy Lawler said:
Getting a clean sound at the source is the biggest thing, I think. Beyond, that, mic'ing from 3 to 6 ft away cuts extraneous playing noises down a lot but you need a good sounding room.

Tim
Click to expand...

I'm with this too...close micing gets the best results if the room isn't up to par but if it is, move back. Less breath sounds, less fretting sounds etc.
 
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