Working on some guitar tones.

[FoulPhil]

I have been trying a bunch of different ways to get some decent metal guitar tones. Everything from using a tube amp to amp sims. I really just don't know if it sounds good. So, here's a short clip. Please tell me if it sounds any good or sounds like complete shit as well as some recommendations. I've been doing this for a long time and I still haven't been able to get that "it" sound that I want lol. If that makes sense...

With EQ on Guitars


With out EQ on the Guitars


Less Gain/Distortion

 

[WhiteStrat]

Depending on what your goal is, this could be "it." Question though--is this double tracked or played through a double amp/stereo sim? The tone works, but there's a phasey-ness that seems to be working against the tone a bit. Also, I'm not detecting any bass guitar. Am I right, or am I just missing it? For me, one of the hardest parts about metal guitar tones is making them thick and heavy enough while leaving room for the bass. I think you've done that here, but I just don't hear the bass.

 

[FoulPhil]

It's 4 guitar tracks and drums. There isn't any bass yet. I cut some frequencies out that sounded harsh to me, that might be the phasey-ness. Maybe it's the playing isn't tight enough? Not sure that would be the cause.

EDIT:

I added a the exact same track without EQ for reference. I might as well avoid bad decisions like excessive EQing for no reason...

 

[TripleM]

I liked the "without EQ" version better. It had a little more presence and a little more power.

Both versions, though, were lacking in low and low-mid power. There was no "umph" there.

There is a thread in the "Guitars and Basses" section called the "Guitar Tone" thread or something like that. Guys are putting up clips just like this in that thread. Then they describe their equipment, mic, amp settings. Other's chime in with suggestions. I might suggest you post these samples there. See what advice you get.

 

[FoulPhil]

I liked the "without EQ" version better. It had a little more presence and a little more power.

Both versions, though, were lacking in low and low-mid power. There was no "umph" there.

There is a thread in the "Guitars and Basses" section called the "Guitar Tone" thread or something like that. Guys are putting up clips just like this in that thread. Then they describe their equipment, mic, amp settings. Other's chime in with suggestions. I might suggest you post these samples there. See what advice you get.

I can't find a thread like that lol.

 

[PDP]

The without eq sounds better. Ask Greg to help you, he's the master of rock guitar sound, but having a stack of Marshalls helps. Those guitars don't sound bad, that's the thing, you can sound decent like everyone else pretty easily, but getting that extra edge takes some good gear, knowledge and playing.

P.S. I think its called the "New tone thread"

 

[FoulPhil]

The without eq sounds better. Ask Greg to help you, he's the master of rock guitar sound, but having a stack of Marshalls helps. Those guitars don't sound bad, that's the thing, you can sound decent like everyone else pretty easily, but getting that extra edge takes some good gear, knowledge and playing.

P.S. I think its called the "New tone thread"

Yeah I don't have stacks of amps like that. I might just have to do the best I can with what I have or just give up and keep jamming. Not sure yet. I hate that itch to want to put something out, but it not being within my power to be super freaking bad ass lol...

 

[PDP]

I think it sounds pretty good, I'd keep at, production is only part of the product you can still put "bad ass" into the rest of your project and get it to come across. Good luck.

 

[TripleM]

Yeah it's the "New Tone Thread" or something like that. It hasn't had a post in the last couple of days. Change the setting in that forum to display threads with updates in the last week and it will show up.

 

[Greg_L]

Without EQ sounds better to me.

You really can't tell too much about it though until you get bass in there. I find that the "heavier" the guitars, the more the bass guitar is gonna affect the overall feel of everything.

Also, if you're quad-tracking and stacking, this is an area where cutting the gain back some will help. Two less gainy crunchy tracks layered on top of each other will sound beefier and more powerful than two fizzed out over-gained tracks of mush.

If you're just double tracking and panning one to each side, then record the tone you wanna hear.

But metal sucks anyway, so whatever.

 

[FoulPhil]

Without EQ sounds better to me.

You really can't tell too much about it though until you get bass in there. I find that the "heavier" the guitars, the more the bass guitar is gonna affect the overall feel of everything.

Also, if you're quad-tracking and stacking, this is an area where cutting the gain back some will help. Two less gainy crunchy tracks layered on top of each other will sound beefier and more powerful than two fizzed out over-gained tracks of mush.

If you're just double tracking and panning one to each side, then record the tone you wanna hear.

But metal sucks anyway, so whatever.

LOL. Yeah I'll experiment

 

[Btyre2013]

prefer the version without EQ, the one with EQ takes away some of the warmth

 

[FoulPhil]

Some of the palm muting that I'm doing just doesn't come out sounding loud enough or something. Is there a trick to making it stand out a bit more? Here's a new one...



I think I got it a tiny bit better, clearer, less fizzy and still sort of "heavy". What do you think? I've read something about maybe making it 6 to 8 guitar tracks. Does that sound like over kill?

 

[FoulPhil]

Instead of making a new thread I figured I would just put it here. How is this lead guitar tone? I can't seem to get it perfect. Does it sound like shit to you?

 

[Greg_L]

Are you using sims? It seems like it to me because these guitar tracks have no depth to them. To me, there's one big glaring weakness in those clips - no punch. The guitars don't chug or chunk or whatever you call that 3-D chug that they're supposed to have. I can only assume you're not moving any air. These tracks sound "flat" like there's no dynamics in them at all. It's like they're painted on a flat wall instead of jumping out at you. If you're using sims, play with the "air" or room or whatever to make them seem like a speaker moving air. That's where the power comes from IMO.

 

[FoulPhil]

Are you using sims? It seems like it to me because these guitar tracks have no depth to them. To me, there's one big glaring weakness in those clips - no punch. The guitars don't chug or chunk or whatever you call that 3-D chug that they're supposed to have. I can only assume you're not moving any air. These tracks sound "flat" like there's no dynamics in them at all. It's like they're painted on a flat wall instead of jumping out at you. If you're using sims, play with the "air" or room or whatever to make them seem like a speaker moving air. That's where the power comes from IMO.

It's guitar rig 5 and I have my crappy amp we've talked about before, but it seems a bit useless. I'm mostly trying to get as good as possible results with what I have and hoping when I do have better gear I'll be able to put it to better use. I'll play around with the air. What about the guitar solo as well? For some reason I can't ever seem to get it sit in the mix and sound detailed without turning it up real loud. Is there a trick to make it fit in better without it overpowering? I'm going to end up doing some real nice solos, but I figured I should whip up a quick one and think of ways to approach it.

 

[Greg_L]

It's guitar rig 5 and I have my crappy amp we've talked about before, but it seems a bit useless. I'm mostly trying to get as good as possible results with what I have and hoping when I do have better gear I'll be able to put it to better use. I'll play around with the air. What about the guitar solo as well? For some reason I can't ever seem to get it sit in the mix and sound detailed without turning it up real loud. Is there a trick to make it fit in better without it overpowering? I'm going to end up doing some real nice solos, but I figured I should whip up a quick one and think of ways to approach it.

I don't know dude, I'm not a lead guy. I pay little to no attention to "lead tone". I just use whatever rhythm tone I'm using and play a lead with it. Lol. I'd suggest drop some highs and bring up more mids for a good cutting lead tone that doesn't have to be too loud and ear killing..

 

[FoulPhil]

I don't know dude, I'm not a lead guy. I pay little to no attention to "lead tone". I just use whatever rhythm tone I'm using and play a lead with it. Lol. I'd suggest drop some highs and bring up more mids for a good cutting lead tone that doesn't have to be too loud and ear killing..

Yeah so I played with the air slider and basically put it in the position that was the "loudest" which seemed to be at 50%. The guitars sound a bit bigger, but it's very subtle. Not sure it's any better. I think my guitar really sucks I've had it for about a year now and doubt it'll survive another string change (crap failing hardware). Does it sound any better?

Old


New more air

 

[Greg_L]

Yeah so I played with the air slider and basically put it in the position that was the "loudest" which seemed to be at 50%. The guitars sound a bit bigger, but it's very subtle. Not sure it's any better. I think my guitar really sucks I've had it for about a year now and doubt it'll survive another string change (crap failing hardware). Does it sound any better?

Old


New more air

Yeah it's subtle. Better? I don't know, maybe a little.

Try it with a real amp now.

Also, your sig line is wrong. Freud never said such a ridiculous comment. That "quote" is a paraphrased translation from someone else trying to interpret Freud's work.

 

[FoulPhil]

Also, your sig line is wrong. Freud never said such a ridiculous comment. That "quote" is a paraphrased translation from someone else trying to interpret Freud's work.

Yeah I know, but F it