Why not place your speakers like this...

[darkecho]

I can understand using monitors for EQing and such because they give unbiased frequencies to your ears, but as far as panning around, wouldnt headphones be best? A. because a majority of listeners will be listening on headphones, and B. because headphones are predictable and controlled.

I also, i found it hard to make sure im sitting in the right spot each time i sit down at the computer because my chair swivels and is on rollers, so i am always moving around in it, I would have to remeasure my head to the speakers every time i wanted to mix, and then make sure not to move myself... that seems a bit odd

i think a really good pair of headphones would do well

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

A peak system will alow you to move anywhere in the room and pin point (with perfect imagery) any of the instruments in the sound stage. There should be no point of reference (i.e., no specific place for you to sit in order to get accurate imagery).

...in the Twilight Zone.

I can understand using monitors for EQing and such because they give unbiased frequencies to your ears, but as far as panning around, wouldnt headphones be best? A. because a majority of listeners will be listening on headphones, and B. because headphones are predictable and controlled.

I also, i found it hard to make sure im sitting in the right spot each time i sit down at the computer because my chair swivels and is on rollers, so i am always moving around in it, I would have to remeasure my head to the speakers every time i wanted to mix, and then make sure not to move myself... that seems a bit odd

i think a really good pair of headphones would do well

Headphones are Ok for setting panning, but no better than a decent pair of monitors.

Personally, I think this thread is getting way carried away and overthinking what is a basic, simple subject. Don't get so carried away with worrying whether you head is in the theoretically exact pright spot or not. And don't worry so much about headphones being better for panning; technically they are, but that's rather like saying that a laser ranger is better for measuring the size of a pizza than a tape measure is.

Just get your monitors out there at a distance roughly equilateral to the average location of your head and run with it. If you want to expiriment with wider or narrower stereo imaging, and you have the physical options to do so, then try moving your monitors in or out a little to see how you like it. Then when you feel comfortable with it and you mix panning translates fine to the real world (whether they are using headphones or not is irrelevant to a good mix), then just run with it and don't look back.

No need to make the subject any more complicated than that.

G.

 

[sweetshoes18]

...in the Twilight Zone.G.

Actually,Any audiophile will tell you the same thing. It is atainable (As I have achieved it). However, it requires an acusticly stable room. Audiophile equipment is much more accurate than the normal studio setup but it can be attained with a studio set up (monitors) as well.

 

[xstatic]

Actually,Any audiophile will tell you the same thing. It is atainable (As I have achieved it). However, it requires an acusticly stable room. Audiophile equipment is much more accurate than the normal studio setup but it can be attained with a studio set up (monitors) as well.

So you are telling me that if you are standing 2 feet out from your speakers and 6 feet to the left you can still pinpoint the precise location in the image? Or that it sounds the same at that location? Or at the back corner of the room near the ceiling?

All of this I highly highly doubt.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Two simple examples. First the false mono technique only puts the image at it's intended location when you are near the center axis of the stereo sources. Second, stand to the immediate left of the left speaker facing the same direction as the speaker drivers. Pump a sound through the right speaker and a natural reverb of it in the left speaker. The human ear will not interpret the sounds with the same natural positioning cues as it will get from in front of the image plane.

These are both as true in an anechoic chamber as they are in a handball court, wheat field, or anything in-between. And the subjective or objective quality or accuracy of the reproduction gear has absolutely nothing to do with it.

And, BTW, please define "acoustically stable". Any room with a static boundary configuration and static air pressure, temperature and humidity is, by all standard definitions "acoustically stable", regardless of how it actually sounds. Is this one of those Bob Carver LSD terms again?

This is yet another example of why audio philes and audio engineers should never be in the same room together for very long; parallel universes made of different physical laws collide and wipe each other out.

G.

 

[Beck]

Actually,Any audiophile will tell you the same thing. It is atainable (As I have achieved it). However, it requires an acusticly stable room. Audiophile equipment is much more accurate than the normal studio setup but it can be attained with a studio set up (monitors) as well.

By definition, the near field necessitates at least an approximate equilateral triangle and its associated “sweet spot” for accurate stereo representation.

In the classic near field model the close proximity of each point allows very limited right-left movement from the optimum listening position without skewing the perceived balance.

If the goal is to achieve stereo equilibrium (which is a very pleasing psychoacoustic effect) it’s quite impossible while outside this rather limited center position.

I wouldn’t say you have to glue your shoes to the floor and slip into them each time you mix. There is some wiggle room here, and that largely depends on whether the speakers are mounted vertically or horizontally, and the size of the triangle, among other things… But at some point that triangle becomes too large to fall under the near field model anyway.

I may be missing something here, or perhaps we’re talking about two different things.

~Tim

 

[sweetshoes18]

So you are telling me that if you are standing 2 feet out from your speakers and 6 feet to the left you can still pinpoint the precise location in the image? Or that it sounds the same at that location? Or at the back corner of the room near the ceiling?

All of this I highly highly doubt.

Yes, it is quite possible A setup of that accuracy is not going to be achieved in your average music room. However, you can get a VERY good soundstage in just about any room if you treat it correctly.

By definition, the near field necessitates at least an approximate equilateral triangle and its associated “sweet spot” for accurate stereo representation.

In the classic near field model the close proximity of each point allows very limited right-left movement from the optimum listening position without skewing the perceived balance.

If the goal is to achieve stereo equilibrium (which is a very pleasing psychoacoustic effect) it’s quite impossible while outside this rather limited center position.

I wouldn’t say you have to glue your shoes to the floor and slip into them each time you mix. There is some wiggle room here, and that largely depends on whether the speakers are mounted vertically or horizontally, and the size of the triangle, among other things… But at some point that triangle becomes too large to fall under the near field model anyway.

I may be missing something here, or perhaps we’re talking about two different things.

Well it is not going to be as accurate if you were to move throughout the room in comparison to the "sweet spot" but you will still have very clean imagery