guhlenn
Oh REALLY????
sabbath, although i agree with ya, are you homophobic?
Guhlenn
Guhlenn
VOXVENDOR
New member
I already know whats going to happen next...
MOVE IT TO THE CAVE!
Please Sabbath and Guhlenn and Musikman.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tired of this stupid shit.
MOVE IT TO THE CAVE!
Please Sabbath and Guhlenn and Musikman.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tired of this stupid shit.
flapo1
New member
It shouldn't be moved to the cave if we stick to the point, which is guitar solos, not homosexuals or homofobics!
I still like melodic solos. My fav is Gilmour's "comfortably numb".
I still like melodic solos. My fav is Gilmour's "comfortably numb".
B.SABBATH
New member
Vox, no one was talking to you..
sorry I came off a bit strong..
I just find it funny that some people look at alternate tunings as a crutch.. I love it all, standard, dropped, etc. BUT I know that alternate tunings give you a sound that is impossible to get otherwise..
It's like saying Pizza is great, but anyone who puts pepperoni on it, doesn't know how to eat..
Maybe that's a bad example, but you get the point..
Dimebag Darrell from 'Pantera' blows most guitarists away, including Eddie Van Halen, and he never uses standard E...
That's all. Close minded people usually have shitty recordings..
peace.
sorry I came off a bit strong..
I just find it funny that some people look at alternate tunings as a crutch.. I love it all, standard, dropped, etc. BUT I know that alternate tunings give you a sound that is impossible to get otherwise..
It's like saying Pizza is great, but anyone who puts pepperoni on it, doesn't know how to eat..
Maybe that's a bad example, but you get the point..
Dimebag Darrell from 'Pantera' blows most guitarists away, including Eddie Van Halen, and he never uses standard E...
That's all. Close minded people usually have shitty recordings..
peace.
VOXVENDOR
New member
Anyways.. back to the topic..
Nuno is great... he is amazing, and gives Eddie and alot of them a run for their dollars........
But, at the same time, he knows when to lay back and be a rythym guy, when the singer is trying to do his thing.....
Once again.. taste.....
I think part of the thing in the nineties, was that it was cool to be in a garage band, and if you were talented or smart, you were considered not-real.. (which is dumb).....
It was cool to be some guy who has played for 6 months on a shitty guitar from a pawn shop.
Very weird trend.
Glad it's over...
Joe
Nuno is great... he is amazing, and gives Eddie and alot of them a run for their dollars........
But, at the same time, he knows when to lay back and be a rythym guy, when the singer is trying to do his thing.....
Once again.. taste.....
I think part of the thing in the nineties, was that it was cool to be in a garage band, and if you were talented or smart, you were considered not-real.. (which is dumb).....
It was cool to be some guy who has played for 6 months on a shitty guitar from a pawn shop.
Very weird trend.
Glad it's over...
Joe
M
musikman316
New member
B.SABBATH, I wasn't coming down on alternate tunings, just gay bashing... I also use a lot of alternate tunings (I'm highly influenced by Robert Fripp)... lets just keep things intelligent.
JR#97
New member
VOXVENDOR said:
Chris Tondreau and I saw Rik Emmett last weekend.... He was doing an acoustic "unplugged" thing with a few other notable Canadians....
You guys, probably won't know them , but they are legends up here.. well somewhat..... Ian Thomas (Dave Thomas(the actor, not the Wendy's guy's) Brother... David Wilcox, and Murray McLaughlin...
They were all on stage together on stools...
It was great.... Rik was cool....... He has great audience winning-over skills... Im not sure if he was over-using them or the rest were under-using them, but there were times when it appeared tha Emmett was beng a bit of a crowd-hog
Great show.. lots of fun.
Great Performance of "Lay it on the Line" Unplugged... Amazing guitar player.
Joe
I've heard of all of them. I even had some live bootlegs of David Wilcox.
What's interesting is how a lot of the shredders have gone different routes. Rik Emmett went the jazz and acoustic route. Steve Stevens went totally flamenco... he's shredding just the same on that thing, though. kick ass! Neil Schon went "soft jazz" ala Craig Chaquico... either way, they were all tasteful and skilled players in their 80's genres. And yet can still kick ass in any genre. That is guitar musicianship..shredders or not.
VOXVENDOR
New member
JR#97 said:
So, you have heard of them!... Cool I always thing that stuff is reserved for Canadian knowledge......
Ian Thomas lives in my Neighbourhood..... Well sort of.. it's an area known that used to be known as Winona, but is now a part of the city of hamilton....
I can walk to his house in 10 min...
He has a cool Analog studio, rumour has it..
Joe
VOXVENDOR
New member
And Yeah.. JR.. Shredders make great Classical players, and classical players make great shredders..
I think Chris Tondreau is formally Trained in Classical...
I think Chris Tondreau is formally Trained in Classical...
esactun
New member
B.SABBATH said:
This is displayed pretty obviously in early 90s death metal. Bands that tuned to B (with regular six-strings, before the post-Korn 7-string craze) had a very particular tone, due to the loose, heavy-ass 13 gauge strings... you could tell if they were in B or C just by hearing them play almost ANY note or chord. Playing my pal's 7 string is a trip cuz I'm not used to playing that low with tight strings
And the bends one gets with strings that loose.... e-GAD!!
I don't like playing drop D (or drop A with those 7s!), it screws me up when it's time to do something besides a power chord. Plus I can play power chords in "regular" tuning fast enough to not need it... but if one likes to tune and play that way and likes the tone, I ain't gonna rag on 'em. I don't see it as some sort of cop-out or anything.
Is the song good? That's what I wanna know. Some songs need solos. Some songs would suck with solos. But the prescence or lack of a solo is, in and of itself, no indication of whether the song sucks. (Nor is the sexual orientation of the guitarist of any bearing.) IMHO.
Toki987
Rock Steady
I guess it would be hard to rap to Jeff Beck doing Freeway Jam or Larry Carlton or Chet Atkins doing Sleepwalker. Gosh could you imagine somebody rapping with the Steve Morse Band?
It`s all dime store in the top 40 scene anymore. And much of what we hear is about a dime a dozen as well.
It`s all dime store in the top 40 scene anymore. And much of what we hear is about a dime a dozen as well.
Aaron Cheney
Favorite Chord: C 6/9
A couple thoughts:
A big part of the reason guitar solos are so ubiquatous is because in most rock bands they are the only available instrument that one can solo with. I mean, let's look at the anatomy of a rock band: drums, bass, 1 or 2 guitars, singer, sometimes a keyboard player. That describes 95% of 'em, especially the '80's bands, i.e. Scorpions, Judas Priest, Van Halen, Ratt, Winger, White Lion, etc, etc etc..... . So what are you gonna solo with? After a certain point guitarist started to lose sight of the fact that the guitar line was only a component part of a song, not the end-all-be-all, and you started getting some really absurd guitar-centric junk.
Everybody wanted their own spin and be the coolest guy on the block. You had guys claiming to be the innovator of some new technique every other week. Heck, I remember seeing a guy in a guitar mag once claiming to be the inventor of the "upside-down guitar" technique, with a picture of him holding his guitar upside-down and fingering it like a damn clarinet! After a few years people just got sick of it.
I'm really encouraged by what I see in high school kids in my area now. Some of these kids have a more well-balanced sense of music than kids have had in a long time. They listen to all the radio ga-ga, and they're into all the fads, but they play jazz! I mean real jazz: Caravan and Satin Doll and real classics. They have a great sense of the cultural place of different genres of music and they appreciate them all.
I'm really optimistic about where music is going to be in a few years. It will include a greater variety of instruments and depth of styles than it has in a long time, solos included.
Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com
A big part of the reason guitar solos are so ubiquatous is because in most rock bands they are the only available instrument that one can solo with. I mean, let's look at the anatomy of a rock band: drums, bass, 1 or 2 guitars, singer, sometimes a keyboard player. That describes 95% of 'em, especially the '80's bands, i.e. Scorpions, Judas Priest, Van Halen, Ratt, Winger, White Lion, etc, etc etc..... . So what are you gonna solo with? After a certain point guitarist started to lose sight of the fact that the guitar line was only a component part of a song, not the end-all-be-all, and you started getting some really absurd guitar-centric junk.
Everybody wanted their own spin and be the coolest guy on the block. You had guys claiming to be the innovator of some new technique every other week. Heck, I remember seeing a guy in a guitar mag once claiming to be the inventor of the "upside-down guitar" technique, with a picture of him holding his guitar upside-down and fingering it like a damn clarinet! After a few years people just got sick of it.
I'm really encouraged by what I see in high school kids in my area now. Some of these kids have a more well-balanced sense of music than kids have had in a long time. They listen to all the radio ga-ga, and they're into all the fads, but they play jazz! I mean real jazz: Caravan and Satin Doll and real classics. They have a great sense of the cultural place of different genres of music and they appreciate them all.
I'm really optimistic about where music is going to be in a few years. It will include a greater variety of instruments and depth of styles than it has in a long time, solos included.
Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com
Chris Tondreau
Member
Whoa.... go to work for a day and the whole world goes by ya!! What a busy thread!!
Sexual orientation does not seem to have a statistically significant corelation to choice of guitar tunings. Guaranteed..... can we get on with the thread, please??
I DO agree, though, that there is a lot of value to be gained from the exploration of alternate tunings. This includes the use of the 7-string guitar (though I tried one, and personally didn't think I could justify buying another guitar for the sake of being able to play low B, C, and C#.... I occasionally tune down to low D, so three extra notes only made it more awkward to play.
Eddie maybe gives Nuno a run for HIS money!! The big surprise of the evening of acoustic music with Rik Emmett, David Wilcox, Murray McLaughlin, and Ian Thomas was actually, for me, David Wilcox. That man can really play guitar, and he can really sing too!! A lot of his most popular material seems to suggest to me that he's only a step or two above "hacker" in both departments, but he proved me WAY wrong the other night. He's also a really quirky writer, but a lot of fun. Listen to the BearCat if you've never heard it!!
Yes, I have a rather formal background in classical guitar. I have a university degree in it. But, what is probably more interesting is what inspired me in that direction. My teen years were in the '80's, when a lot of players that I really admired often talked about their study of classical guitar. (Rhodes, Malmsteen, etc.) I figured that if I wanted to do what they do, I had to take the same path... I don't really use the technique much in my rock playing, but hand position, knowledge of the fretboard, speed, control are things that can be applied to any style of playing, and are really a requirement for playing classical repertoire.
Aaron C - that really is encouraging. I work with kids a lot too, and am seeing a lot more open-mindedness, and more interest in musicianship too. There's the old pendulum swing again, eh?
Chris
Sexual orientation does not seem to have a statistically significant corelation to choice of guitar tunings. Guaranteed..... can we get on with the thread, please??
I DO agree, though, that there is a lot of value to be gained from the exploration of alternate tunings. This includes the use of the 7-string guitar (though I tried one, and personally didn't think I could justify buying another guitar for the sake of being able to play low B, C, and C#.... I occasionally tune down to low D, so three extra notes only made it more awkward to play.
Eddie maybe gives Nuno a run for HIS money!! The big surprise of the evening of acoustic music with Rik Emmett, David Wilcox, Murray McLaughlin, and Ian Thomas was actually, for me, David Wilcox. That man can really play guitar, and he can really sing too!! A lot of his most popular material seems to suggest to me that he's only a step or two above "hacker" in both departments, but he proved me WAY wrong the other night. He's also a really quirky writer, but a lot of fun. Listen to the BearCat if you've never heard it!!
Yes, I have a rather formal background in classical guitar. I have a university degree in it. But, what is probably more interesting is what inspired me in that direction. My teen years were in the '80's, when a lot of players that I really admired often talked about their study of classical guitar. (Rhodes, Malmsteen, etc.) I figured that if I wanted to do what they do, I had to take the same path... I don't really use the technique much in my rock playing, but hand position, knowledge of the fretboard, speed, control are things that can be applied to any style of playing, and are really a requirement for playing classical repertoire.
Aaron C - that really is encouraging. I work with kids a lot too, and am seeing a lot more open-mindedness, and more interest in musicianship too. There's the old pendulum swing again, eh?
Chris
B.SABBATH
New member
everyone relax.. I was kidding about the homo stuff.. 
Didn't mean to get peoples panties in an uproar!
Didn't mean to get peoples panties in an uproar!
nave
Cave Relic
I remember back in the eighties when I first started playing....I always looked up to all those fancy 80's shreader dudes with their fancy fret work....I remember staying up to watch head bangers ball........I out grew that pretty quick though..Wonder what happened? Started smoking pot and listening to the grateful dead? Seriously, kind of like Jerry Garcia's soling, dave gilmour, and a handful of others but even that gets old....I just want to here good songs......I'm pretty damn mellow now and the last thing in the world I want to here is guitar wanking....Just tastes I guess......Personally I don't really like guit solos because I think that the guitar is one of the most horrible sounding instruments when soloing..(other then a really high pitched harmonica)....and that' s coming from a guit player....I'd much rather here a piano solo or some other sort of nifty odd instrumentation soloing......oh well....
I think the person who posted one of the first posts in this thread nailed the reason why you don't here guit solos in rock today...I think it's primarily because songs are all stripped down to 3:00 packages....it's marketing in this fast pace lifestyle...no one wants to waste time listening to you show off your guit skills.....you get into the song...you get out of the song...and at the end hopefully you've made an impression with the song....not with guitar skills..Wham bam thank you mam....show me the money. Personally, I ain't got time for that attitude either. I'll stop babbling now.
....I remember staying up to watch head bangers ball........I out grew that pretty quick though..Wonder what happened? Started smoking pot and listening to the grateful dead? Seriously, kind of like Jerry Garcia's soling, dave gilmour, and a handful of others but even that gets old....I just want to here good songs......I'm pretty damn mellow now and the last thing in the world I want to here is guitar wanking....Just tastes I guess......Personally I don't really like guit solos because I think that the guitar is one of the most horrible sounding instruments when soloing..(other then a really high pitched harmonica)....and that' s coming from a guit player....I'd much rather here a piano solo or some other sort of nifty odd instrumentation soloing......oh well....I think the person who posted one of the first posts in this thread nailed the reason why you don't here guit solos in rock today...I think it's primarily because songs are all stripped down to 3:00 packages....it's marketing in this fast pace lifestyle...no one wants to waste time listening to you show off your guit skills.....you get into the song...you get out of the song...and at the end hopefully you've made an impression with the song....not with guitar skills..Wham bam thank you mam....show me the money. Personally, I ain't got time for that attitude either. I'll stop babbling now.
Speeddemon
New member
Shredding and 80's hairmetal WILL come alive again if the 4 Horsemen rejoice!
Gidge
Lopp
Chris Tondreau
Speeddemon
We know Jennifer Batten kicks ass, Motley Crue had some cool tunes, KISS still rocks, Iron Maiden and Judas Priest rule tha whole shit, the 1st Boston album rules too, and we will shred those 7-string Nu Metal wankers to tears!
YEAH! ROCK!
Gidge
Lopp
Chris Tondreau
Speeddemon
We know Jennifer Batten kicks ass, Motley Crue had some cool tunes, KISS still rocks, Iron Maiden and Judas Priest rule tha whole shit, the 1st Boston album rules too, and we will shred those 7-string Nu Metal wankers to tears!
YEAH! ROCK!
Chris Tondreau
Member
speaking of the four horsemen.....(though I know what you meant.....) Nobody Said it was Easy was a great song!
Jennifer Batten is one of those players who often gets over-looked. Yes, I'm guilty of it too. I'm sure it is because she never really presented herself as a high-profile player, chosing rather to be a back-up band player for Michael Jackson - she just kinda did her job, did it well, and stayed in the background. Give her a chance and she was surely a top-notch shredder.
I think Nave has an excellent point about the whole wham-bam-thank-you-maam approach to marketing. The general public seems to be shamefully musically illiterate, and has an equally embarassingly short attention span unless they are being bludgeoned to death with a chorus. Guitar solos would send many listeners off to a barren wilderness, making them wonder how they got there so quickly, and ultimately, causing them to sue the record companies for pain and suffering and lost wages.
Chris
Jennifer Batten is one of those players who often gets over-looked. Yes, I'm guilty of it too. I'm sure it is because she never really presented herself as a high-profile player, chosing rather to be a back-up band player for Michael Jackson - she just kinda did her job, did it well, and stayed in the background. Give her a chance and she was surely a top-notch shredder.
I think Nave has an excellent point about the whole wham-bam-thank-you-maam approach to marketing. The general public seems to be shamefully musically illiterate, and has an equally embarassingly short attention span unless they are being bludgeoned to death with a chorus. Guitar solos would send many listeners off to a barren wilderness, making them wonder how they got there so quickly, and ultimately, causing them to sue the record companies for pain and suffering and lost wages.
Chris
Chris Tondreau
Member
Speeddemon said:
Just got me thinking.... we should get together for a shred-fest (making sure not to compete with the JamFest
), or maybe have it as a component of the Jamfest, and get a tune together. Shredders of the world unite!! Brittney and Timberlake won't know what hit 'em!! (sadly, neither will the average listener... )Chris
F
flash2ace
New member
wow this is a great discusion, and it just goes to show how diverse everyone is. i was born in 1970 and i feel i have lived thru 30 great years of music, im not gonna lose my cool and judge a certain year of music because personally i see where music is going and i like all music, i have a 13 year old boy who lives across the street named david and somtimes when i record i have my studio window open and he could always hear me playing, well one day he knocked on the door and my wife let him in and he waited patiently for me to finish tracking what i was doing and then he came in and said i realy like what your playing and i want to learn so bad but my parents cant realy afford to help me with the cost of guitar and lessons, well i imediately gott a great idea, i had a fender squier bullet that i have had for sometime now that i have never used, hell i picked it up at a garage sale for like 65 bucks and i had a peavey bandit amp so i said well come in and sit down and we will talk, so he did and i told him that i had a offer for him, first i showed him the equipment and then i told him lets go over and talk about this to your parents, and i told them all if david will be willing to mow my lawn again this year( he mowed it all last year for me) i am willing to give him a guitar a amp and lessons. his face lit up and he said mom dad please. and they agreed. what shocked me was with our first lesson he didnt ask once for me to teach him a song like most students i used to teach, instead he says teach me how to play where i will be able to write my own music, which was a realy cool response from a 13 year old. and heck surprising to me his favorite band is acdc. well its now been a year and a half since we started with lessons and he has done very well. he has a very open mind when it comes to music and has come a long way towards becoming a good musician. he mowed alot of grass this year and he bought a 7 string esp with all the money he managed to save and i am quite proud of this kid, in fact im gonna put him in my studio to record soon and ill have to post it for you guys he realy has come a long way and works realy hard at learning somthing new everyday. sorry this is so long guys and i know my typing and or spelling aint the best but i have a cast on my hand wright now because of my operation i just had for my carpal tunnel. thanks for hearing me out guys. tim pate
p.s another one i give alot of credit to is zeke he is quite the musician and if he keeps at it he will definately go somewhere.
p.s another one i give alot of credit to is zeke he is quite the musician and if he keeps at it he will definately go somewhere.
Chris Tondreau
Member
Hey Flash2Ace;
What a generous person you are!! The world would truly be a better place if more people were as willing as you to help someone out like that. I felt good just reading it!
I DO find it encouraging that younger people seem to be more open-minded than we were (I was born in '70 too...) when we were in school. I did a practice-teaching block a few years ago, and then taught night school guitar the following year, and was amazed at the number of kids that wanted to learn stuff like Twisted Sister and AC/DC!! I happen to love AC/DC, but I grew up with them. These bands are like retro or classic rock to the kids now, of course. It was interesting....
Chris
What a generous person you are!!
The world would truly be a better place if more people were as willing as you to help someone out like that. I felt good just reading it! I DO find it encouraging that younger people seem to be more open-minded than we were (I was born in '70 too...) when we were in school. I did a practice-teaching block a few years ago, and then taught night school guitar the following year, and was amazed at the number of kids that wanted to learn stuff like Twisted Sister and AC/DC!! I happen to love AC/DC, but I grew up with them. These bands are like retro or classic rock to the kids now, of course. It was interesting....
Chris
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