When + why do YOU multitrack guitars

  • Thread starter Thread starter TylerDrums109
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Everyone gave you some great answers so all I can really add is to do whatever you feel you need to do. If you are getting a good sound with one track then by all means only use one track. Im not saying you shouldn't try mulitracking guitars, experimentation is always necessary when trying to record.. Who knows you might wind up with a much better sound!

I like to use one mic on my guitar amps and then track them multiple times using different mics.
 
I do mainly acoustic based stuff and always double mic and also take a pickup line out to a nice clean tube amp and mic that as well with an LDC... with those three tracks and EQing/compressing/reverb I manufacture a left hand side "take" - then repeat and get a right hand side take - doubline - so I essentially use 6 of the 16 tracks I have available to get the basic track down then use the other 10 to highlight / solo / keyboard / bass etc..

The miked amp might sound a little strange on acoustic, but it actually gives you some nice mids-highs that you can feed back into the sound. Lots of people take an out from the acoustic straight to the desk and use that, I've just taken it one step further...

The end result is a fairly "large" sounding acoustic track which really can knock your socks off at volume - not much use for rock music, of course, but pretty nice for acoustic stuff..

Works for me...
 
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Armistice said:
I do mainly acoustic based stuff and always double mic and also take a pickup line out to a nice clean tube amp and mic that as well with an LDC... with those three tracks and EQing/compressing/reverb I manufacture a left hand side "take" - then repeat and get a right hand side take - doubline - so I essentially use 6 of the 16 tracks I have available to get the basic track down then use the other 10 to highlight / solo / keyboard / bass etc..

The miked amp might sound a little strange on acoustic, but it actually gives you some nice mids-highs that you can feed back into the sound. Lots of people take an out from the acoustic straight to the desk and use that, I've just taken it one step further...

The end result is a fairly "large" sounding acoustic track which really can knock your socks off at volume - not much use for rock music, of course, but pretty nice for acoustic stuff..

Works for me...
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Sounds cool. I'm gonna have to try that. :)
 
WhiteStrat said:
Artificial multi-tracking doesn't get the job done. It just takes your one track and makes it louder. It's still the same sound. Even if you nudge it, your just creating a delay the hard way.

Actually playing the part twice introduces a myriad of subtle difference that go a long way to creating a thicker sound than one track can. Furthermore, when you record your second track with a different guitar, a different amp, a different mic, or different chord voicings, you're adding yet more texture to that guitar sound. Again--creating a "wall of sound" that a single (or duplicated) track can't create.

(Bonus round: consider all the above options with 4 takes spread across the stereo field!)
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What Whitestrat and steve.h said. Probably something like 99.9% of all rock and metal guitar tones you've heard are the result of at least two tracks of guitar; double-tracking is just sort of the "sound" of rock guitar these days. You need a tight performance, true, and you really get the best results through complimentary tones that aren't huge on their own but "fit" together well (though, full disclosure - I write instrumental guitar music with lead guitar going on through probably 90%+ of most of my songs, so a massive rhythm tone isn't something I'm often after - I need space in the mix for a lead), but even a reasonably tight doubled guitar with the same basic tone used for both takes is going to sound more "spacious" and bigger than a single track, more than the simple change in percieved volume from having two voices playing the same part can explain.

That said, I almost never double leads. There's a couple reasons for this, not the least of which is most of my solos are improvised. However, that quasi-chorused sound doubling gives you works great for rhythm guitars (and another full disclosure moment - I HATE chorus on distorted rhythm guitars, it just robs them of all body and "presence" in the mix, and sort of pushes them back in the mix, so what we're hearing here isn't a true "chorus" exactly, but it does give a similar spaciousness to the sound, without that neutering effect) doesn't seem to work as well for leads for me - I just don't care for the sound.

It's already been said, but multi-mic setups can be cool, just expect to pull your hair out while you're getting the two mics in phase with each other.
 
DrewPeterson7 said:
It's already been said, but multi-mic setups can be cool, just expect to pull your hair out while you're getting the two mics in phase with each other.
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Someone once told me a really easy way to do this! Essentially, once you've got the tone you want, you reverse the phase of the second mic, and move it around until the two signals nearly cancel each other out. Reverse the phase back, and poof! You're good!
 
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steve.h said:
Someone once told me a really easy way to do this! Essentially, once you've got the tone you want ,you reverse the phase of the second mic, and move it around until the two signals nearly cancel each other out. Reverse the phase back, and poof! You're good!
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Great idea! And the "poof" is my favorite part!
 
steve.h said:
Someone once told me a really easy way to do this! Essentially, once you've got the tone you want ,you reverse the phase of the second mic, and move it around until the two signals nearly cancel each other out. Reverse the phase back, and poof! You're good!
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*drew bangs head against wall.


Why didn't I think of that? That makes perfect sense, lol. Thanks, e-rep to you!

EDIT - seems I have to spread it around first. Sorry dude - stop being so helpful, ok? ;)
 
DrewPeterson7 said:
*drew bangs head against wall.


Why didn't I think of that? That makes perfect sense, lol. Thanks, e-rep to you!

EDIT - seems I have to spread it around first. Sorry dude - stop being so helpful, ok? ;)
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Hah, I definitely can't take credit for it, but it was definitely a very useful tool to get a starting point for multi-mic setups. The fun part is, on some level, anything you hear when the phase is reversed, will be cancelled out when put back in phase (sorta)!
 
DrewPeterson7 said:
That said, I almost never double leads. There's a couple reasons for this, not the least of which is most of my solos are improvised.
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Nothing much to add to everyone's good thoughts, only to repeat that doubling parts is just one more tool for making interesting sound. I often double parts, especially backing guitars, but occasionally I'll double a lead or part of a lead (e.g., doubling the last part of a solo can build intensity.) I sometimes enjoy totally improvising a solo, then going back to figure out what I'd played, and then doubling that on guitar, bass, keyboard, flute, etc. It's a pretty insightful exercise and sometimes sounds great. Sometimes not.

Which reminds me that doubling well is an acquired skill and good for the chops. I still remember the first time, many years ago, when an engineer told me to double what I'd just played. My response: huh? I eventually gave it a shot. He never asked me again.
 
Here's how I manage two mic phase and mixing...

I position each mic independently for tone, I record the two mics as a stereo track and use these plugins and manipulate the Phase Relationship, Mix and Panning to create a Mono Mix

Sample Delay - Single Bit Alignment Level Time Alignment, Time per bit is based on Sample rate. I basically use this as an EQ... flexibility you cannot achieve by mic positioning alone. To determine aligned phased, I invert one side (Left or Right) and adjust for the least volume. Once found, Un-Invert. You'll find that right around the least volume point, this acts as a really good EQ for the top end that you could never get otherwise.

FreeG Stereo - Mix the two mics 100% One to 100% the other and anything in between. Set the Pan Mode to -6db.

FreeG Mono - Creates a Mono Mix that can be panned by the DAW SW Track Pan. Set the Volume to +6db for Unity Gain.

Phase.jpg
 
Sonixx said:
Here's how I manage two mic phase and mixing...

I position each mic independently for tone, I record the two mics as a stereo track and use these plugins and manipulate the Phase Relationship, Mix and Panning to create a Mono Mix

Sample Delay - Single Bit Alignment Level Time Alignment, Time per bit is based on Sample rate. I basically use this as an EQ... flexibility you cannot achieve by mic positioning alone. To determine aligned phased, I invert one side (Left or Right) and adjust for the least volume. Once found, Un-Invert. You'll find that right around the least volume point, this acts as a really good EQ for the top end that you could never get otherwise.

FreeG Stereo - Mix the two mics 100% One to 100% the other and anything in between. Set the Pan Mode to -6db.

FreeG Mono - Creates a Mono Mix that can be panned by the DAW SW Track Pan. Set the Volume to +6db for Unity Gain.

Phase.jpg
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I can't quite discern if this is simpler or not! :)
 
steve.h said:
I can't quite discern if this is simpler or not! :)
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Nor can I. :lol: It's an interesting approach though, easier at the time but more of a pain in the neck down the road. I don't think I have the patience personally for this (my thoughts are by the time you're going down this road, you almost might as well just record two seperate performances through different mics and be done with it), but I could see it being effective. :)
 
Sonixx said:
simpler than what?
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Simpler than getting phase issues/preferences figured out with mic placement alone. Not sure which would ultimately end up in better quality...
 
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steve.h said:
Simpler than getting phase issues/preferences figured out with mic placement alone. Not sure which would ultimately end up in better quality...
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you're missing the point:) it's not instead of mic, placement, it's in addition to. you can always do nothing.

if you've never spent time moving phase coherent waves relative to one another in very small increments, you're possibly in for a treat. especcialy for heavy gtr tone. it can be an excellent EQ that you cannot get otherwise.
 
Sonixx said:
you're missing the point:) it's not instead of mic, placement, it's in addition to. you can always do nothing.

if you've never spent time moving phase coherent waves relative to one another in very small increments, you're possibly in for a treat. especcialy for heavy gtr tone. it can be an excellent EQ that you cannot get otherwise.
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I've actually never found a practical way to do this, save for enabling snapping and zooming in absurdly close and trying to move in small increments, and that's sort of haphazard at best. The plugin you're referring to - that isn't freeware by chance, is it?
 
DrewPeterson7 said:
I've actually never found a practical way to do this, save for enabling snapping and zooming in absurdly close and trying to move in small increments, and that's sort of haphazard at best. The plugin you're referring to - that isn't freeware by chance, is it?
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Don't most DAW's have the ability to move regions by single frames?
 
I double track - for real - when I'm after a meaty distorted tone.
Sometimes I'll cheat by double mic'ing (using very diff mics) but then I have to deal with potential phase issues so it comes down to the axiom:
Play it twice & it'll be real nice!
Play some more if you want real gore!
 
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