What Mic for a Classic Crooner Voice

1

12Kevin

Practical Cat
(Sorry if this posts twice, there was some glitch as I tried the first time).

I've only got $300 or so. Need ideas for a studio mic. I'm doing a series of recordings for seniors featuring a vocalist with a nice silky baritone. I'm looking for a warm, fat sound, but with a bit of enhanced clarity for ancient ears.

Any suggestions?

BTW, the recording gear is PC-based prosumer stuff. I was using an SM7 that was about what I wanted, but I had to return to it's selfish thoughtless owner friend of mine. Can't quite afford a new one.

Thanks a million,
12K
 
12Kevin said:
I was using an SM7 that was about what I wanted
Click to expand...


Then might I recommend . . . a Shure SM-7 perhaps?

Something else you might want to check out would be a used Beyer M-88. You could score one off ebay for less than $300 easily. Kind of a similar sound as the SM-7, only a bit more proximity effect and a little of the jacked high end for added clarity, as you put it.

Anyway, that would be my recommendation, since it sounds like you've had some good luck with a dynamic in the past.

I might recommend a ribbon mic, but I don't know of any (decent ones) in your price range . . . and you're most definitely not going to get any of the enhanced clarity you're looking for with one, either.
 
Humm isn't the SM7 about 300.00...I'll agree with Chessrock about a ribbon..I had a crooner in to track some Xmas songs used a R84 it just sounded right..Theres the Oktava ML52 ribbon and its about 300.00 or so..I've never used one but you should try before you buy anyways..check it out.Good luck



Don
 
Since you can't afford the SM7 right now, try an Oktava MK319. They work pretty well for deeper voices and you can get one for $100 or less. It's not an SM7 for sure, but it still might get you there.

Blessings, Terry
 
Thanks! And what would the real Sinatra use?.

Thanks for the help, everyone. The SM7's run $370-$450 from the major catalogers (except for a couple mystery suppliers on E-bay.) So I'll try a couple of the lesser creatures you've suggested and if they really let me down I'll have to squeeze my partner for more budget.

Just out of curiosity, anyone know what real studio mic might Ol' Blue Eyes and his current ilk (Harry C. Jr, et al) use?

And thanks again!
12K
 
Re: Thanks! And what would the real Sinatra use?.

12Kevin said:
Just out of curiosity, anyone know what real studio mic might Ol' Blue Eyes used?

And thanks again!
12K
Click to expand...
Sinatra used an RCA 44BX (and sometimes an RCA 77DX) in the early days, then switched to the long body Neumann U47 in the early 50's, mainly because Capitol records bought a shit load of them when they first came out.

But, he could use any mic in the world and it would still sound exactly like Sinatra.
 
here you go.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3709669192&category=15198


they go for about $250
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2228230266&category=29833

i have one. it is a great sounding mic, it has its own style. just dont use that variable pattern thing. sounds like shit. in figure 8 you have a nice ribbon mic that sounds like a ribbon mic for really cheap.

lots of crooners use it. look at pictures here:
http://www.coutant.org/varacous.jpg
http://www.coutant.org/varacous.html

if you watch any show about blues and jazz in the 30's this was THE mic.

also good as drum OH and guitar mic.

buy it.
 
Re: Re: Thanks! And what would the real Sinatra use?.

Harvey Gerst said:
Sinatra used an RCA 44BX (and sometimes an RCA 77DX) in the early days, then switched to the long body Neumann U47 in the early 50's, mainly because Capitol records bought a shit load of them when they first came out.

But, he could use any mic in the world and it would still sound exactly like Sinatra.
Click to expand...

if he was in your studio, of your mics, what would you use?.....

also, if you HAD to use a ~$300 or less mic, which would it be?......
 
Frank's main vocal microphone at his record company, Reprise, was a gold plated Shure 546.
(I have one-but it's the standard chrome body)

The trick with the 546 (or a SM57) is to put it about 30-45 degrees to the side of the vocalist's
mouth to "soften" its sound, and make it less "present". Still aiming it directly of course.
This info is on the Shure website BTW.

The normal 545 series can be top notch too.
A 545 was used for all of Brian Wilson's lead vocals on "Pet Sounds", for example.

These microphones were very popular with
West Coast major recording studios in the 60's.

Chris
 
Kevin, come to think of it...

Do you already HAVE a SM57 or Shure 545?

If so, what pre are you using?

Assuming you're already using a "clean" like
Mackie's or some such, something else with good coloration for crooning is the Studio Projects VTB-1. About $130 street price.
Sometimes www.pmiaudio.com has demos for about $100 under the "B Stock" icon.

Then add a good parametric EQ like the DBX
242, which runs around $100 used.

This will further smooth out the microphone
with tweaking, and will enhance the top end.
These Shure's take EQing great.

Bingo, you're under the $300 mark with dependable tools that can be used for other projects too.

Chris

P.S. The "crooniest" mic I own is the
EV 666, slightly more than the RCA 77.
Run about $200-300+ used for one in
excellent condition.
 
Bottom Line, there are no Bottom Lines

Thanks for the fascinating info, Harvey and Chess'.

And I might just look into a collectable like that Varacoustic while I'm at it. It would also look great at a particular live show I do.

FYI, if anyone cares, I've had fun building my gear with a simple plan of forcing myself to buy only with money made from previous projects. My first was with an old PC (<200mhz) with an old AWE card and a borrowed SM57. And inherited Tascam mixing board.

That project paid for a move "up" to a 450mhz machine and a Soundblaster, and a pair of used AKG SE 5E-10s with cardioid capsules. That setup made projects which paid for an AMD 1200 PC and better sound card. And so on.

But I've been too cheap about mics.

Anyway, the money making isn't in the gear, really, it's in sales. But the fun for me is equal parts tools, talents and $$.

Just MHO. Not rich but happy.
12K
 
Re: Re: Re: Thanks! And what would the real Sinatra use?.

Gidge said:
if he was in your studio, of your mics, what would you use?.....

also, if you HAD to use a ~$300 or less mic, which would it be?......
Click to expand...
If I/he were looking for that Capitol Records "bigger than life" sound for under $300, I'd try the MXLV69, MXL V77 and the V67, or the MC012 with the 33mm Lomo head. If I had one, I'd also try the Studio Projects T1.

Without the money restriction, I'd still try all those mics I just listed, but I'd expand the list to include my RCA 44 and 77, the AEA R84, the Neumann TLM-103 and TLM-149, and also a rental on a U47 or U67. The ADK Hamburg is supposed to be voiced similar to a U67 and that might be an option as well. Same with some of the Soundeluxs or Lawsons.

The new Telefunken ELA M251 might be an option, but I think it might be a little too bright; same with an AKG C12.
 
Bing Crosby, Frank Sinatra and Dean Martin all used re 20. as does Bonnie Raitt on her quieter stuff
In His Name
BK
 
chessparov said:
Kevin, come to think of it...

Do you already HAVE a SM57 or Shure 545?

Assuming you're already using a "clean" like Mackie's or some such, something else with good coloration for crooning is the Studio Projects VTB-1. About $130 street price. Sometimes www.pmiaudio.com has demos for about $100 under the "B Stock" icon.

Then add a good parametric EQ like the DBX 242...

Thanks again, Chess! And curiously, I'd been looking at that VTB-1 and a budget LD condenser, but hadn't thought about EQing the 57s or 58s I keep for live work. Hmmmm.

Two or three new toys...tools that is... for the price of one. You folks are priceless...Good thing too.
12K
Click to expand...
 
Big Kenny said:
Bing Crosby, Frank Sinatra and Dean Martin all used re 20. as does Bonnie Raitt on her quieter stuff
In His Name
BK
Click to expand...
I don't know about Bonnie using one (but I can ask Dick Waterman about it), but I think Bing died before they even came out with the RE-20. Bing spent most of his life in front of an RCA 44BX.

Frank did too, till the Neumann U47 came out. He did use a Telefunken ELA M251 for one of his sessions, I believe, but it was usually the Neumann long body U47, at least while he was at Capitol. Live, he used whatever mic happened to be there.

I only saw one Dean Martin session (at TTG Studio), and that was definitely a U47 on his voice.
 
Thanks for the kind words Kevin.

Have to admit it took a long time for me to start a proper appreciation for the SM57 and 545.

I've tried out the Telefunken USA versions of
the 251, C12, and U47.

The 251 sounded very detailed to me, rather than bright. Whereas the C12 seemed to be darker in coloration. All just initial impressions.
I liked (loved) the 251 the best.

Another high end vocal mic I was super impressed with is the Manley Reference Gold.
Smoooth, also "larger than life".

Yes Bonnie Raitt uses the RE20 on her studio vocals. So did Stevie Wonder in the 70's, as his main vocal microphone. Paul McCartney used it for all his vocals on "Ram", and
Bob Dylan for "Blood On The Tracks".

Chris

P.S. Don't sweat "clarity", most adults in their
60's+ only hear under 14 kHz anyway.
(except for Harvey!:))
 
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