What is the purpose of the Eurorack's output behaviour?

Y

Yasoo

New member
What is the purpose of the Eurorack's output behaviour? The output meter shows:

clip
6
0
20

This is a normal looking meter with the 20 and the 0 are green lights, the 6 is a yellow light, and the clip is a red light.

I thought clip was 0db. This is proving to be really hard to use. The manual says the output appears at a level of 0dBu. If I turn the output mix knob to "0" (on a scale from -infinity to +15 with 0 at half turn), then I'm getting some signal level called "clip" above "0". LOL What the heck does that mean? It matches the clip signal in the computer on a -infinity to 0 meter (where 0 is clip like I would expect). If I set the channels on the Eurorack to "0", the output to "0", and send a signal from the computer that stays just below "0", the output meter on the Eurorack looks just like the meter on the computer. Except, the signal is +15 or +20db hot. What is the purpose of this and how can I match it's output properly to an input?
 
The output meter is referenced to line level in the analog realm. Digital clipping happens when you run out of headroom in the converter. 0db VU is normally -12db or -15db db FS (digital).
You are getting confused because you are measuring the levels of the same signal with 2 different scales. Just worry about the one on the computer, Having a meter with only 4 leds is kind of worthless anyway.
 
Ah, I see. Thanks for the info.

One thing, I can't just worry about the one in the computer because I'm using the mixer to connect 3 computer outputs and share one set of powered monitors which I have to match the signal to. I'm also using the aux outs on the mixer to send to a stereo aux in to periodically test my mixes. In this case, I have to use the lights to make sure the 0 light just barely flashes like a clip light. This means I have to turn the output knob a little less than a quarter turn and there isn't a mark for it.

This is still a little confusing. If the Eurorack's meter is the analog meter, then why do I have to turn my powered monitors to -20db to handle the 0 level on the mixer? That's an analog signal from the mixer to the monitors.
 
Are you using the control room output, or are you sending the main outs to the monitors?
Anyway, remember that the signal coming out of the computer might be really hot. Line level in the analog world is -12db in your computer. So, if you have the levels pegged in the computer, you are beating the crap out of the inputs on the mixer. That would explain your gain staging problems.
 
To the monitors, I'm using the main outs. The outputs from the computer are analog outs on my soundcard. Like I said, it's just plain confusing. The analog meter on the Eurorack has those 4 lights. 20,0,6,clip. Which I've found to mean -20,0,+6, and some value greater than 6 called "clip". The Eurorack's manual says the main out is at 0dB.
 
YOu should be using the control room outs for the monitors. That way, you can set the level to the computer independantly of the monitor volume.
Anyway, if your output meters in the computer are reading anything above -12db, you are feeding the mixer a hotter than line level signal. That is why you are running out of headroom (and therefore can't turn anything more than 1/4 the way up) on the mixer.
Sending a line level (0dbvu) signal to your monitors is having them all the way up. If your monitors are 100 watts rms, you will be hearing all 100 watts when you send it a line level signal out of the mixer.
 
This is getting more confusing than ever. I don't know what you mean by setting my level to the computer independently of the monitor volume. Anything I'm sending to the computer is through my soundcard inputs. The output from the computer is an analog output, not a digital output, and goes to the channel input on the mixer. I have 3 computers connected to the inputs on the mixer. Those signals are mixed and sent to the monitors through the main mix outputs on the mixer.

I think all this is really sort of irrelevant. What this boils down to is that the "0" light on the mixer is 0dB, which is a quarter turn on the main mix knob. If I turn it past that, then I will get clipping. If I turn the main mix knob to it's "0" marking, that is really, by my estimate, +15 to +20dB, which matches the meters red light. So why does the red light at +something (over 6dB) called clipping when that is more like overamplifying. I can turn it up that hi and set my monitors to -15 to -20dB to attenuate the signal back to 0dB.
 
It sounds like you have the signal coming from the computer too hot. Line level is -12db on a digital meter. If the meters on your computers are above -12db, then you are coming out of the soundcard at more than line level. You are then adding another 2 hot signals to it (from the other computers) and wondering why you can't turn up a volume control.
The clip light turns on when you have run out of headroom on the board and it starts to distort.

I'm sorry I confused you earlier, I was assuming you were using the mixer to mix stuff into the computer instead of just for monitoring.

Your gain staging is fouled up. Any time you have to turn something at the end of the chain down by 20 db, it's a bad thing. The signal is starting out to loud.
 
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