What is the nature of the sound of the EV RE20 on kick?

[Whoopysnorp]

One of the mics I am planning on buying soon is the EV RE20. My main use for it would probably be kick drums, although I am very keen on experimenting with it on vocals as well. I own a Sennheiser e602, which I have had for quite some time but never really liked. I much prefer the Shure Beta 52, which my drummer owns and I used exclusively for kick on an album we're finishing up. I find the e602 too clicky and sharp for my taste; by contrast the Beta 52 sounds more natural to me. Between the spectrum of 'clicky and hyped' and 'natural', where does the RE20 fall on kick? I have done a search and found lots of praise for it on kick, but nobody talking about the nature of the sound.

 

[leddy]

I have an RE20 and I've used it on bass drum. I would put it as more natural, based on the lack of proximity effect so the low end does not get hyped like it could with a different mic placed up close. I like the top end on the RE20 better than most other dynamic mics as well, including the Beta 52 (though I do like that mic).

It needs a lot of gain, so have a decent pre ready.

 

[Fishmed]

I have an RE20 and I've used it on bass drum. I would put it as more natural, based on the lack of proximity effect so the low end does not get hyped like it could with a different mic placed up close. I like the top end on the RE20 better than most other dynamic mics as well, including the Beta 52 (though I do like that mic).

It needs a lot of gain, so have a decent pre ready.

I agree. I have the RE-27 and it does a great job on the kick and so does the AKG D112. The RE20/27 does sound GREAT on vocals too, but as mentioned above, you need to have a mic pre with tons-o-gain.

Here is a song I recorded almost 10 years ago using the RE27 on Vocal and Accoustic Guitar. (The Accoustic Guitar had a DI track mixed with it.) The rest of the tracks were direct, so pardon the drum sounds.

Solomon's Rain

 

[chessrock]

The only word that comes to mind is "thick."

Other than that, really flat and unhyped.

On vocals, it's pretty hit and miss.

.

 

[Whoopysnorp]

The only word that comes to mind is "thick."

Other than that, really flat and unhyped.

On vocals, it's pretty hit and miss.

.

I like the sound of that...do you find that much or any EQ is required to get the beater click to come through the mix, or can you get everything you need with proper placement? I expect to mostly be miking drums with felt beaters.

 

[cavedog101]

Another of the 'honest' mics. This one doesnt have that really pronounced proximity effect like the Beta52 and the D112 have, so you're gonna get what cha got. Its a GREAT mic for learning how to really tune the drums and really get the placement right, cause its gonna sound like the source.

As far as vocals , I agree with Chessrock.....for singing its hit and miss....for voiceovers its a nobrainer.

Its one of the best mics to use a heavy-handed compressor on. It can be crushed without mercy and still have some fidelity......as always YMMV.

 

[chessrock]

I like the sound of that...do you find that much or any EQ is required to get the beater click to come through the mix, or can you get everything you need with proper placement? I expect to mostly be miking drums with felt beaters.

What Cavedog said. If that's the sound you're going for, though (i.e. pronounced beater click) ... then I might look at a different mic.

.

 

[Whoopysnorp]

What Cavedog said. If that's the sound you're going for, though (i.e. pronounced beater click) ... then I might look at a different mic.

.

I don't really like it to be 'pronounced' (in fact I have grown to strongly dislike that really clicky sound), but I do want to be sure the beater attack is capable of cutting through the mix enough that the kick doesn't just turn into a 'whump' happening underneath all the midrange and treble stuff.

 

[Fishmed]

I don't really like it to be 'pronounced' (in fact I have grown to strongly dislike that really clicky sound), but I do want to be sure the beater attack is capable of cutting through the mix enough that the kick doesn't just turn into a 'whump' happening underneath all the midrange and treble stuff.

Yes it is a very solid sound that you can mold in any direction, of cource placement and drum tuning will come into play.

As far as drums go, I think you will always have to eq them; for if no other reason, to reduce mic bleed. The RE20/27 will definiately put you in the middle of the ballpark.

 

[Juggernaut]

I love the e602. Duno whatcha talkin' about!

But if you really don't like that 602 on kick, try it on toms it is simply AMAZING there.

 

[nuemes]

I don't really like it to be 'pronounced' (in fact I have grown to strongly dislike that really clicky sound), but I do want to be sure the beater attack is capable of cutting through the mix enough that the kick doesn't just turn into a 'whump' happening underneath all the midrange and treble stuff.

Check out the ATM25 used too for @ $100. Much more natural sounding than the D112 & Beta52. No click unless you dial it in w/ EQ. Takes EQ well too.

http://www.mojopie.com/atm25.html

 

[Scott Signal]

Re20

We have the RE20 in our production program and I have to say I've never been too crazy about it. I have used it in conjunction with a D112 for kick drum multiple times to decent results but nothing mind-blowing. Personally, the Audix D6 is what I use for kick drum when I have my choice.

 

[Whoopysnorp]

We have the RE20 in our production program and I have to say I've never been too crazy about it. I have used it in conjunction with a D112 for kick drum multiple times to decent results but nothing mind-blowing. Personally, the Audix D6 is what I use for kick drum when I have my choice.

Can you elaborate a bit? What don't you like about the RE20, and what do you like about the D6?

 

[chessrock]

What he means is that the D6 has a hefty upper-midrange boost to help bring out the beater slap ... along with a scoop in the lower mids to tame some of the "basketball dribble" resonance that normally accompanies most kick tracks in their natural state.

In contrast, the RE-20 isn't going to do you any favors, so you have to make sure that your kick drum is damn near perfect sounding to begin with ... or you just have to be prepared to use a lot of EQ if necessary.

.

 

[Whoopysnorp]

What he means is that the D6 has a hefty upper-midrange boost to help bring out the beater slap ... along with a scoop in the lower mids to tame some of the "basketball dribble" resonance that normally accompanies most kick tracks in their natural state.

In contrast, the RE-20 isn't going to do you any favors, so you have to make sure that your kick drum is damn near perfect sounding to begin with ... or you just have to be prepared to use a lot of EQ if necessary.

.

I see...does anybody have any recordings they can post on which they used their personal favorite kick drum mic? Particularly RE20 recordings, if anybody's got 'em.

 

[cavedog101]

Specialty mics such as the Audix D6, the AKG D112, the AT ATM2500, Shure Beta 52, and so on are voiced to do a particular thing well, and its a bonus if you find something else you like it on. I completely understand some of the reasoning behind liking these mics..... theres very little 'engineering' to do as they are all 'placement stupid'........you simply get them close to the source you wish to record (in this case a kik drum, preferably) and turn them up till the meters say 'no more'. I particularly love that for fast setups of live and demo sessions. I love the D6, but it sounds exactly as Chessrock described.....AND it sounds like that for MOST poorly tuned kiks. If you dont want to mess with tuning or placement issues, then you need to look into these specialty mics.

Its interesting to note (do a search to confirm this) MOST of the hot-shot tracking engineers DONT use these specialty mics and are more likely to list an RE20, SM7b, MD421, MD409, and Neumann U47 as their go-to kik drum mics.

Of course they have brilliant rooms to record in and someone on staff that really knows what tuning a drum is all about.

The EV is NOT going to knock your socks off at an initial listen.....It will, however, deliver exactly what you put into it without any extraneous noise,EQ problems and lack of fidelity throughout the frequency range of the source being recorded. At mix, this WILL knock your sox off and make you job so much easier.

 

[Fishmed]

Samples

I see...does anybody have any recordings they can post on which they used their personal favorite kick drum mic? Particularly RE20 recordings, if anybody's got 'em.

Here are a couple I did with the RE-27 (just about the same as the RE-20)

Forgotten (Placed inside the drum)

County Line (Outside the drum by the beater, also this was a bigger kick drum)

 

[warble2]

Here are a couple I did with the RE-27 (just about the same as the RE-20)

Forgotten (Placed inside the drum)

County Line (Outside the drum by the beater, also this was a bigger kick drum)

Holy high frequency in those MP3's. I kinda like the sound of the kick using that mic though

P.S. I listened to the tracks through my home studio system (Echo Layla 3G, Hafler TA1600 and Tannoy Reveals).